cant make up my mind between s550 and 750il
02-16-2008, 09:52 AM
#27
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2008 S class
WSH & Trumpet: You are way to harsh/unfair on BMW. The current 7 series had its shares of electronics gremlins in its first two years of production but by MY2004 BMW had made it a pretty reliable car. My '04 745i was one of the best cars I have ever owned. BMW offers you the choice of short wheel base (which MBUSA doesn't in this market and it makes a difference in handling) and a separate factory 'sport suspension' package (springs/coils, etc) which was the best sport-luxury combination I have experienced on a large sedan. (I don't have enough driving time yet on my recently acquired CL600 to compare - barely 20 minutes - since still recuperating from my shoulder operation). Let me just add this. The 745i drove much better than the 650i Vert I currently own, even though the latter has the bigger 4.8 engine! You also must remember that the last S class had some serious reliability issues and caused Mercedes large headaches, tons of warranty money and many lost sales from customers very disappointed with their experiences. Regardless of its lower price & cachet vis a vis a Mercedes S (last generation), the BMW 750 (and 745) was an incredible value of sport and luxury for the money. And it's one that deserves a serious look from any sport sedan enthusiast. But I agree with Chris and 06CLK350, it just doesn't make sense to buy or lease a 7 series now that a new generation is about to be introduced. And we will have to see how the new 7 series stacks against the newest S. I, for one, am very happy to have both a Mercedes and a BMW! They are both excellent manufacturers, each with a distinct 'take' on how sport and luxury should be combined in a modern automobile. And it is not a question of adding 8 pounds of pressure to the tires! Z356
I was one of those guys that went out and got the 745 when it first came out and man was it a mistake. I thought the looks were great and I loved the way the Idrive system worked. Then the problems started in and there were alot of them with the car. I had huge issues with the service dept at bmw and they gave me problems because I had the aftermarket video input installed in my car even though it had nothing to do with the problems the car was in for. Aside from that I always felt the 745 fell a bit short on the 'luxury' part of the luxury/sport experience that it promised: I drive alot for work and I never felt that comfortable in the 745 after a few hours. With the S I dont feel like there is a compromise... The car is fast and handles very well but I am totally comfortable even after all day in the car.
02-16-2008, 01:02 PM
#28
From what I remember about the 7 series...
I am sure for every '02/'03 745 owners with issues we can find an equal or greater number of early W220 S buyers who had problems also with their vehicles. We know, particularly those in this Forum, that MB has made great strides with their new generation W221, which was introduced relative trouble-free in all markets and, over all, has been praised as a great improvement of luxury, ride comfort and safety features over the older S model it replaced. But comparing the latest generation BMW 750 (e.g. 2008) to the last year of the W220 (e.g. 2006), you have to admit that BMW offered some features in their top of the line sedan which were noteworthy and desirable to enthusiasts. The 7 series front seats have articulation at the shoulder area that provide the ultimate 'custom' fit of your upper back. This particular feature is unmatched by even the current generation of MB S/CL seats, as good as these are (not same as MB's inflatable feature). The 7 series provided a choice for a sport steering wheel (thick, sporty and all leather) which is superior to anything MB offers to this day, except for the current AMG 63 sport steering wheel available only to those limited buyers. The BMW also engineered less 'power steering' assistance at low speeds than those found (my opinion) in the old or new S/CL class. Matter of taste, but I prefer the lesser BMW power assist. The electronic parking assist was introduced earlier by BMW in their top of the line sedan. This is a feature that helps you not have to ride the brake at stop lights and is now available in the W221 platform. These are some of the things that I remember from my '04 745i Sport which I found particularly attractive and/or desirable about that vehicle. I just wanted to mention them in this thread to add a perspective to this interesting discussion on the merits of each marque. As to ride quality and perception of status & luxury, it is all highly personal. Each individual (especially on a MB Forum) will have an opinion on the matter which I respect. I own both a BMW & a Mercedes and each provides me with a different kind of driving experience & enjoyment, both of which I value. Z356
02-16-2008, 01:43 PM
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I am sure for every '02/'03 745 owners with issues we can find an equal or greater number of early W220 S buyers who had problems also with their vehicles. We know, particularly those in this Forum, that MB has made great strides with their new generation W221, which was introduced relative trouble-free in all markets and, over all, has been praised as a great improvement of luxury, ride comfort and safety features over the older S model it replaced. But comparing the latest generation BMW 750 (e.g. 2008) to the last year of the W220 (e.g. 2006), you have to admit that BMW offered some features in their top of the line sedan which were noteworthy and desirable to enthusiasts. The 7 series front seats have articulation at the shoulder area that provide the ultimate 'custom' fit of your upper back. This particular feature is unmatched by even the current generation of MB S/CL seats, as good as these are (not same as MB's inflatable feature). The 7 series provided a choice for a sport steering wheel (thick, sporty and all leather) which is superior to anything MB offers to this day, except for the current AMG 63 sport steering wheel available only to those limited buyers. The BMW also engineered less 'power steering' assistance at low speeds than those found (my opinion) in the old or new S/CL class. Matter of taste, but I prefer the lesser BMW power assist. The electronic parking assist was introduced earlier by BMW in their top of the line sedan. This is a feature that helps you not have to ride the brake at stop lights and is now available in the W221 platform. These are some of the things that I remember from my '04 745i Sport which I found particularly attractive and/or desirable about that vehicle. I just wanted to mention them in this thread to add a perspective to this interesting discussion on the merits of each marque. As to ride quality and perception of status & luxury, it is all highly personal. Each individual (especially on a MB Forum) will have an opinion on the matter which I respect. I own both a BMW & a Mercedes and each provides me with a different kind of driving experience & enjoyment, both of which I value. Z356
02-21-2008, 01:36 AM
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'09 S63 AMG
I am sure for every '02/'03 745 owners with issues we can find an equal or greater number of early W220 S buyers who had problems also with their vehicles. We know, particularly those in this Forum, that MB has made great strides with their new generation W221, which was introduced relative trouble-free in all markets and, over all, has been praised as a great improvement of luxury, ride comfort and safety features over the older S model it replaced. But comparing the latest generation BMW 750 (e.g. 2008) to the last year of the W220 (e.g. 2006), you have to admit that BMW offered some features in their top of the line sedan which were noteworthy and desirable to enthusiasts. The 7 series front seats have articulation at the shoulder area that provide the ultimate 'custom' fit of your upper back. This particular feature is unmatched by even the current generation of MB S/CL seats, as good as these are (not same as MB's inflatable feature). The 7 series provided a choice for a sport steering wheel (thick, sporty and all leather) which is superior to anything MB offers to this day, except for the current AMG 63 sport steering wheel available only to those limited buyers. The BMW also engineered less 'power steering' assistance at low speeds than those found (my opinion) in the old or new S/CL class. Matter of taste, but I prefer the lesser BMW power assist. The electronic parking assist was introduced earlier by BMW in their top of the line sedan. This is a feature that helps you not have to ride the brake at stop lights and is now available in the W221 platform. These are some of the things that I remember from my '04 745i Sport which I found particularly attractive and/or desirable about that vehicle. I just wanted to mention them in this thread to add a perspective to this interesting discussion on the merits of each marque. As to ride quality and perception of status & luxury, it is all highly personal. Each individual (especially on a MB Forum) will have an opinion on the matter which I respect. I own both a BMW & a Mercedes and each provides me with a different kind of driving experience & enjoyment, both of which I value. Z356
Last edited by AustinGuy; 02-21-2008 at 11:29 PM.
02-21-2008, 02:58 AM
#33
You can't, as of today, duplicate the BMW's upper back articulation in the Mercedes world, but the rest of the new MB S/CL seat mechanics, especially the massage function in the Dynamic option, are just wonderful and effective. However you can do BETTER than the BMW sport steering wheel now in the Mercedes world. You just have to upgrade your S550's optional wood/leather (or 'skinny' all leather 'standard base') steering wheel for the AMG thick leather sport model with aluminum shift paddles that comes with the S/CL63. The link below shows photos of the modification I made on my '07 CL600 by installing this exact wheel. https://mbworld.org/forums/cl55-amg-cl65-amg-cl63-amg-c215-c216/230145-photos-amg-sport-steering-wheel-aluminum-shift-paddles-07-cl600.html. That is a nicer looking & nicer feeling (thicker) steering wheel than either of the sport steering wheels I had or have on my BMWs - '04 745i Sport or the '07 BMW 650i Vert. Unfortunately, unless you have an '08 S63 or CL63 you don't have that wheel in your US market Mercedes S or CL class car. Not even the 07/08 S/CL65 gets this wheel in our US market (except for the 40 units CL65 special limited edition). But you can get this AMG sport wheel by ordering it at the parts department at any Mercedes dealer in the US, although it will be expensive. And it will fit perfectly well in your '07/'08 S550, CL550, CL600, S600, S65 and CL65. And the aluminum paddles will work and shift better (and look 'cooler') than the 'back' buttons you currently have on your MB wheel. The only problem, in my opinion, is that the AMG leather colors (beige, black, gray?) might not go well (color matching) with some interiors, especially if the wood color trim is predominant. I was happy that it seemed to work in my case. But, in any case, if you go this route, let the MB dealer do the exchange for you. You need to use your existing air bag center portion and reset some controls re: airbag via Star tech computer. The entire switch takes less than one hour of labor. Z356
Last edited by Z356; 02-21-2008 at 03:05 AM.
02-21-2008, 02:59 PM
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2018 S63 Sedan and 2012 E350 Cabriolet
BMW 7 Series vs. MB S Class - No comparison
02-21-2008, 11:34 PM
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'09 S63 AMG
You can't, as of today, duplicate the BMW's upper back articulation in the Mercedes world, but the rest of the new MB S/CL seat mechanics, especially the massage function in the Dynamic option, are just wonderful and effective. However you can do BETTER than the BMW sport steering wheel now in the Mercedes world. You just have to upgrade your S550's optional wood/leather (or 'skinny' all leather 'standard base') steering wheel for the AMG thick leather sport model with aluminum shift paddles that comes with the S/CL63. The link below shows photos of the modification I made on my '07 CL600 by installing this exact wheel. https://mbworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=230145. That is a nicer looking & nicer feeling (thicker) steering wheel than either of the sport steering wheels I had or have on my BMWs - '04 745i Sport or the '07 BMW 650i Vert. Unfortunately, unless you have an '08 S63 or CL63 you don't have that wheel in your US market Mercedes S or CL class car. Not even the 07/08 S/CL65 gets this wheel in our US market (except for the 40 units CL65 special limited edition). But you can get this AMG sport wheel by ordering it at the parts department at any Mercedes dealer in the US, although it will be expensive. And it will fit perfectly well in your '07/'08 S550, CL550, CL600, S600, S65 and CL65. And the aluminum paddles will work and shift better (and look 'cooler') than the 'back' buttons you currently have on your MB wheel. The only problem, in my opinion, is that the AMG leather colors (beige, black, gray?) might not go well (color matching) with some interiors, especially if the wood color trim is predominant. I was happy that it seemed to work in my case. But, in any case, if you go this route, let the MB dealer do the exchange for you. You need to use your existing air bag center portion and reset some controls re: airbag via Star tech computer. The entire switch takes less than one hour of labor. Z356
This is the steering that I think rocks (and what I'm getting on my S550)
Last edited by AustinGuy; 02-21-2008 at 11:37 PM.
02-22-2008, 01:39 AM
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2003 S600 ; 1999 E55 (sold)
no option for TT v12 for bmw
Guys, a lot of good points have been made, definitely some know the finer points of each car when they can compare 16-way power seats! I definitely learned something there 
Point missing from the discussion is the S600/S65 option. No 7 series, even an Alpina, can throw you back in your seat like the TTV12. Like a jet taking off. Just shoves you back and slaps that silly grin right on your face. Watching the speedo climb looks like a video game, esp. with ZERO cabin noise!
All these cars so huge that IMHO most buyers not interested in tossing them about in the twisties, but 700 lb-ft of torque is a fine thing to play with.
Point missing from the discussion is the S600/S65 option. No 7 series, even an Alpina, can throw you back in your seat like the TTV12. Like a jet taking off. Just shoves you back and slaps that silly grin right on your face. Watching the speedo climb looks like a video game, esp. with ZERO cabin noise!
All these cars so huge that IMHO most buyers not interested in tossing them about in the twisties, but 700 lb-ft of torque is a fine thing to play with.
02-22-2008, 01:51 AM
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2013 SL 550 (Previously 2012 Porsche Panamera Turbo-S, 2015 Tesla P85D, 2007 S600, 2005 E55 AMG)
Point missing from the discussion is the S600/S65 option. No 7 series, even an Alpina, can throw you back in your seat like the TTV12. Like a jet taking off. Just shoves you back and slaps that silly grin right on your face. Watching the speedo climb looks like a video game, esp. with ZERO cabin noise!
Acceleration like the space shuttle.... (Though to be true to this thread these cars are in a different price category to the S550/750 range...)
02-22-2008, 11:51 AM
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W220 S430
I have owned 2 BMW's and 2 Mercedes so I have some insight into this. I feel the BMW-7 is perceived as being more "sporty" and the Mercedes-S has been perceived as more "luxury". However the W221 has since dissolved this distinction and molded an automobile that is truly a balance of sportiness and elegance. The key areas and Mercedes advantages are:
Suspension: ABC, FREE 4matic, and AIRMATIC (ride height adjustable)
Powertrain: Optional 6200cc (525 hp) torquey and modernly engineered AMG motor or V12 bi-turbo for those people who live SoCal (j/k)
Interior Features: COMMAND (better than iDrive in my opinion) + slew of options some more noteworthy than others
Exterior Features: Optional AMG kit and wheels, flared fender arches
I havent owned a BMW-7 only BMW-3's so I have no insight into the 7 in these categories. Maybe someone else can help.
Suspension: ABC, FREE 4matic, and AIRMATIC (ride height adjustable)
Powertrain: Optional 6200cc (525 hp) torquey and modernly engineered AMG motor or V12 bi-turbo for those people who live SoCal (j/k)
Interior Features: COMMAND (better than iDrive in my opinion) + slew of options some more noteworthy than others
Exterior Features: Optional AMG kit and wheels, flared fender arches
I havent owned a BMW-7 only BMW-3's so I have no insight into the 7 in these categories. Maybe someone else can help.
