SW20S

This has been true for a long time for their non-SUVs. Issue is their lease rates are so terrible even with those discounts a comparable BMW or Mercedes is cheaper.

crabman

It's a problem with Porsche too, you can often be ahead buying rather than leasing. On the other hand with Porsche you've got some similarities with Apple where people will buy for the brand rather than the qualities of the product itself. Audi doesn't command the same mindless loyalty but they do have the terrible leases which is a problem in a market where people have become accustomed to flipping leases every 3ish years.

SW20S

When I was shopping a $116,000 A8 60 with a $25,000 discount was $200 more a month than my $123k S560 with a $20k discount. Easy choice.

Ormond2004

I watched parts of the video, including all of the i7 and 7 series portions. He seemed to like it very much. I watched with the close captioning on. I’m a bit embarrassed to admit that I had a hard time understanding Thomas without close captioning. Only the 7 series section had it. I think that if I have an opportunity, I’d definitely compare the i7 to the EQS.

emilner

But Porsche and Apple do make quality products which results in very high resale values.

crabman

Lots of people make quality products without the sycophants. I love Porsche, don't get me wrong, but fanboyism is never pretty and they've got their share.

SW20S

I find fanboyism really annoying, personally...

crabman

In fairness, there is nothing wrong with being a fan of something; it's the flat earth guys I'm referring to with the fanboy comment. I think everyone knows that but this being the internet and people liking to argue...

SW20S

Totally, there is being a fan and then there is zealotry.

js_cls

Agreed, I’ve spent my fair amount of time on Rennlist and have had mostly positive conversations, but I never ventured into certain threads or forums, specifically that of the 911, as I know many people get emotional there, even over such things as comfort seats in GT3’s

One thing I think everyone can agree on though is German fanboys aren’t as bad as the Tesla cult though, lol.

crabman

Oh yeah, the old 18 way on a GT car is blasphemy paradigm. lol closely related to the concept that if you don't order the buckets the car is ruined. Shows what I know because 2 seconds after I climbed into a GT4 with the buckets I knew I would never order them. I'd order a GT4 though... To be honest I think the Taycan section is just as bad and partly because of the Tesla folk. Of course the most vocal of those are the ones who would never buy the Taycan but are happy to hang out in a Porsche forum and explain why you're stupid for even considering it.

SpookyTheFirst

Interesting, I did not realize the A8 sales were so low, it’s just about twice the sales of top of the line Lamborghini (Aventador) and the S class sells 5x more…

superangrypenguin

Plenty of that for every brand, including owners of A8s, 7 series, and S Classes.

Precisely why some are drawn to the product (exclusivity)

Wolfman

Hmm. This is a high volume production car with a low sales volume. That doesn't equal exclusivity
It's a very fine car by any measure; it's just very boring looking car and not having a V8 is a miss in this segment IMO

superangrypenguin

There is a V8. (at least here in North America).

Also, no car maker is going to be making a ton of cars that don't sell. Audi makes what the market will buy. So, nice try with the bait, but not grounded in reality.

crabman

The A8 needs to be updated and while they're at it they need to up the lust factor, these cars should inspire lust and the A8 just doesn't do it anymore.

emilner

The A8 does not have a V8, only the S8 does. If Mercedes dropped the 580 you would say the same thing, top line performance branding (AMG, S, M etc) is not the same as regular models. Everything Wolfman said is true, the A8 is not an exclusive vehicle because of limited production. It's exclusive because people don't buy them.

superangrypenguin

The Audi A8 60 TFSI has a V8. If you're going to start attempting to spew facts, maybe start by getting them right? Sure, they recently got rid of this model, but also dropped the pricing of the S8 substantially to make up for that. And yes, people don't buy A8s like they don't buy Rolls Royces (not comparing the two in quality but I'm not the one who brought up this idea of limited production ! = exclusivity, though that literally is the definition of exclusivity so the argument is lost on me (and is wrong)). Anyways...

Seems like fanboyism is super strong in these neck of the woods and hasn't changed Then again that makes sense given the reasons why people buy S classes.

chassis

Agreed, they are everywhere…including 48V system and V167 owners.

crabman

Exclusive means either having the tendency to exclude through one or more properties or something that isn't generally shared with others due to specific bars to entry. The A8 is exclusive only in that it's comparatively undesirable and few are selling; it is not exclusive in terms of bars to entry; anyone may own one if he/she is willing to pay.

Saying it's exclusive is like saying you're the rare person who finds stepping in cat feces in the dark while on a middle of the night bathroom run enjoyable, therefore, you are in an exclusive group. Sure, I'll give it to you, that is an exclusive group. Bravo. But is it an exclusive group because of its positive attributes and desirability, or is it an exclusive group because most don't want to join? You do see there is a difference, right?

Just so you know: I do agree that this car is no more/less exclusive; if you have the money and want to spend it, you're in.

emilner

Your first sentence contradicted itself, I think maybe twice but we will have to analyze it because it is so twisted. I said they do not have a V8, you said they do and I should get my facts straight and then you proceeded to say they just don't have it ANYMORE. Ooooooooh. I get how we do this now. If it once had it then that still counts? And no, we aren't counting AMG/S/M etc. That's a different line.

It's not fanboyism, heck- I don't even like the S580. But when you make silly comments like "since no one wants to buy the car I own I am in an exclusive club" and "they have a V8, just not anymore" you enter rare super fanboyism. I mean textbook definition. Audi will produce an A8 for any person who wants to buy the car right up to the limit of the factory. And if they maxed that out they would work to increase production. If Mercedes only sold 2000 S classes you wouldn't say it's exclusive, you would call it a failure. But since we are so used to Audi being in those shoes it is just normal. I'm not saying it's a bad car, it's probably a good car, but the market doesn't think it is worth buying over an S class.

TSA

eqs is basically non-sense. nobody thinks that it is an mercedes. it looks like nissan micra.

superangrypenguin

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMF7AJ3Gj/

Merry Christmas all

The twisted logic here is hilarious. The Audi A8 60 TFSI existed from 2019 to 2022. You don't count an S8? LOL - if anything you compare a AMG to an RS8, and the latter doesn't exist, but okie dokie. If you don't like the S class, I don't even know why you're on this forum then, but you do you.

Whoa there, lump of coal for Christmas? Let me refine this for you. An EQS is exclusive, a RR Ghost is exclusive, a S480 is exclusive, and heck, even a F150 is exclusive (in the UK).

It depends on what you're comparing things against. An A8 is far more exclusive than an S class, and just because people buy S classes in drove doesn't make it a selling feature for the rest of us But go ahead, be proud that the S classes sells in spades and is everywhere in places like NYC or HKG. You do you!

emilner

The 2021 was the last year for 60 V8 in the US, so 2 model years ago. The AMG compares to a car that doesn't exist? Who has twisted logic? The S8's direct competitor is the S63 AMG. You are all over the map. It would also be helpful if you knew the definition of exclusive. But who cares at this point....

superangrypenguin

This thread really encapsulates well the type of persona Mercedes wants to capture with the S class.

This thread started off with a thorough review of the major flagships. It started off, fairly well, and then completely went off the deep end. The turning point was when it didn't "sit" well with some S class owners that the A8 is, comparatively, more exclusive.

In the grand scheme of things, to your point, who cares? But this thread is quite telling. The S class owner has to "prove" a point that their car is "superior". Another thread on MBW talks about the 223 looking too "bland" because it's now not show-y off enough like in the past.

I think this just says a thousand words.

No, a S63 AMG is not compared to an S8. There is no Audi comparable to the S63 AMG. Any reasonable person would compare a 55 TFSI to a S450, and a 60 TFSI to a S550 (or whatever the numbers are now). Engine size to engine size, and price to price. A S63 is in a league of its own, especially since prior models had a V12.

But hey, maybe the latter is a point of opinion. Would any of you turn down a S63 AMG if it was the same price as a 550/580? (I forget what the numbers are these days). Of course not.

That said, I'm out. Carry on with the whole tape measure competing contest. The rest of us prefer to be in rarer cars that fly under the radar because we don't want to show off. If anything, this thread reinforced my decision to not buy a W223, as it came down between the D5 and waiting for the soon to be launched 223 at the end of the day and I was literally tossing a coin deciding between the two.