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Question: What is the percentage of W223 models that experience significant issues beyond the typical service/shop days? If this percentage remains below 5% “though that’s a high %s”, I believe I would be willing to take the risk and enjoy owning a W223, regardless of the experiences or stories shared by others. In my opinion, an S-Class is an S-Class, and throughout the years, there have always been some variations in reliability from one generation to another. Nevertheless, they have consistently been exceptional flagship sedans.
I suppose we need someone with insider knowledge at MB to confirm whether the average number of days spent in the shop for W223 models is higher compared to W222 or previous models. Making a conclusion based on the nature/majority of forum posts is not a definitive answer. I am seeing this on the BMW X7 forum. First 2 years it was mostly issues being reported (picky people with vehicle issues tend to be more active on forums than happy customers during the first couple of years when a new vehicle is introduced”, and then 4 years now (since 2019 when the X7 was introduced), majority of posts are customers praising the X7 and it’s reliability. I still got an X7 at that time regardless and I truly enjoyed it. I still expect the W223 to follow similar trend.
Thats actually not the case. There had been quite a few instances where the cars would shut down the engine while driving, requiring the driver to try making it to the shoulder.
Those were typically S63 models, if memory serves.
Here is a video of a disgruntled owner… https://youtu.be/ZsXUpdJh_f8
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Destroying the car for nothing... That engine stall issue is something we could have easily fixed in minutes remotely anywhere in the world. Perfect for customers without factory warranty or free recalls.
2020 S560 Sedan, 2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, '24 BMW I7 on order...
Originally Posted by SW20S
I didn't fully read what you said, I only read the part about the GLS Maybach. Yeah thats definitely wrong!
Actually, I apologize for playing “GOTCHA” with you. I don’t like it when folks do that to me and I guess I wasn’t thinking. I’m sorry, it wasn’t a cool thing to do.
It does go to show how much erroneous information there is out there on the web.
I suppose we need someone with insider knowledge at MB to confirm whether the average number of days spent in the shop for W223 models is higher compared to W222 or previous models. Making a conclusion based on the nature/majority of forum posts is not a definitive answer. I am seeing this on the BMW X7 forum. First 2 years it was mostly issues being reported (picky people with vehicle issues tend to be more active on forums than happy customers during the first couple of years when a new vehicle is introduced”, and then 4 years now (since 2019 when the X7 was introduced), majority of posts are customers praising the X7 and it’s reliability. I still got an X7 at that time regardless and I truly enjoyed it. I still expect the W223 to follow similar trend.
Its not a definitive answer, but it does gice you some insight comparing discussions in one forum over another...the X7 truly did have reliability issues that they fixed, and you see that in the run. Might that be the case here too? It might be. With my Pacifica they had a LOT of issues with 17s and 18s, and the forum was a disaster, and that was deserved I had a 17 and it was a disaster. However, in 19 they turned a corner and you saw that in the forum, and my 20 Pacifica has been fine...
Its not a definitive answer, but it does gice you some insight comparing discussions in one forum over another...the X7 truly did have reliability issues that they fixed, and you see that in the run. Might that be the case here too? It might be. With my Pacifica they had a LOT of issues with 17s and 18s, and the forum was a disaster, and that was deserved I had a 17 and it was a disaster. However, in 19 they turned a corner and you saw that in the forum, and my 20 Pacifica has been fine...
Agreed. The reason that worked well for the X7 because >90% of the issues were addressed via a simple OTA update, so within 2-3 years from market intro, nearly all issues got resolved and the day-to-day customer experience as well as forums posts started to look much better. Am not sure if that is the same case for W223 as I don’t have the ownership experience of the W223 or the common issues. Usually, most new gens have issues, which is why the facelift is always the best vehicle u could get out of any car on the market (at least most of the time) - unless the issues can be resolved via OTA updates or so (as in the case of the X7).
I can only speak from my personal experience but my 2020 BMW X5 M50i was flawless. Build quality was perfect and not one glitch or issue other than a weird gas pedal position that caused my leg to cramp, but I got used to that. I just wasn’t use to BMW’s gas pedal position and angle and I wasn’t the only one. One thing I miss the most was the luggage compartment package. It had raised rubber rails on the floor and it was like voodoo magic in that grocery bags wouldn’t tip over while driving. I regret trading that thing in for the GLE. The only reason I did was because I got $10k equity during the used car madness. However, new BMWs, notably the 7 and X7, are god-awfully ugly to me.
My 2022 GLE was a nightmare. With my personal and very biased experience, and many forum and Reddit anecdotes on build quality, I will never touch anything coming out of that factory. My car was recently sold and I still get CarFax maintenance notifications and sure enough the new owner had to take it back to the dealership with less than 1k eclipsed miles lol.
My 2023 S 500 has been great. A far cry from my GLE. Just the build quality differences is amazing. I did have some minor glitches but nothing to write home about or make me feel negative about the car, unlike the constant and very annoying barrage of issues from my GLE. I will very seriously consider another S class or maybe just get the last V8 Yukon Denali, assuming it’s available at lease end.
Although not new anymore, my 2019 S63 AMG has been the best MB I have owned in over 35 years. I have been an S Class owner for over 30 years and the W222 S63 is the best S class I have owned. This is the third W222 that I have owned (2014 was totaled in an accident and I traded the 2016 S Class for the 2019). The worst MB I have owned was the purchased new 2000 ML320 with that engine failing at 27000 miles.
My 2019 S63 has had absolutely trouble free 45000 miles. I am on my dealers list for the 2024 S 63 E Performance but with all the negative W223 info I cannot conceive trading my 2019 for a 2024 S63.
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Interesting. Which new Mercedes model do you think would fit your description of trouble-free and well liked? No G-Wagon please...
Although not new anymore, my 2019 S63 AMG has been the best MB I have owned in over 35 years. I have been an S Class owner for over 30 years and the W222 S63 is the best S class I have owned. This is the third W222 that I have owned (2014 was totaled in an accident and I traded the 2016 S Class for the 2019). The worst MB I have owned was the purchased new 2000 ML320 with that engine failing at 27000 miles.
My 2019 S63 has had absolutely trouble free 45000 miles. I am on my dealers list for the 2024 S 63 E Performance but with all the negative W223 info I cannot conceive trading my 2019 for a 2024 S63.
I remember the pictures of your crash well. The car delivered on its safety promise.
I wish Mercedes would have kept it simple and just left the AMG 4 liter V8 instead of adding another 1000lbs with the ePerformance. Added complexity/weight with very little added performance.
The new S63 looks great though. Definitely worth taking one for the weekend when available before making up your mind.
Although not new anymore, my 2019 S63 AMG has been the best MB I have owned in over 35 years. I have been an S Class owner for over 30 years and the W222 S63 is the best S class I have owned. This is the third W222 that I have owned (2014 was totaled in an accident and I traded the 2016 S Class for the 2019). The worst MB I have owned was the purchased new 2000 ML320 with that engine failing at 27000 miles.
My 2019 S63 has had absolutely trouble free 45000 miles. I am on my dealers list for the 2024 S 63 E Performance but with all the negative W223 info I cannot conceive trading my 2019 for a 2024 S63.
I, like the Wolf, recall that accident too.
Nice to hear the 63 is still doing well. I've loved my 63 and the one I had before this one too. Just can't beat the extra power!
I feel you about not wanting the '24. I hope the 'screens' of todays cars go back to not being screens but that's probably a pipe dream.
Thank you Wolf !
It is good for this forum to stay decent !
Well, I saw posts via the emails updates and came here to respond to one offensive term I read in one post, and it’s sad, but apparently it has been taken care of by others before I got time to sign in and make a comment about it myself or at least report it. At least thanks Wolfman for cleaning things up, and also thanks tx170754 for voicing your opinion though i did not read all exchanges. Regardless of how, am glad things got resolved and I apparently the offense is removed thanks to the moderators. Wish that we the forum community don’t need to deal with such unfortunate off-topics and continue to focus on cars and our passion.
This thread in particular has been a great one with a ton of valuable information and respectful exchanges… and I don’t mean to keep talking off-topic, but we all (or maybe some of most of us) have a hard time digesting off-topic offensive stuff even when it’s not towards us directly, that’s how we’ve been raised by parents who cherished respect as it’s not a bad idea to voice our opinions promoting respect… in the end we are a community of educated people (I guess again, most of us at least) and I hope we can maintain high quality conversations that is aimed to helping each other rather than self-serving!.
Going back to the main topic, as for the W222 vs W223 topic in general, I recall similar discussions in a different forum of another brand. Wish people understand that cars are just cars, and mocking a certain design or vehicle is of course different from making offensive statements or words against a human-being. I own a certain car, and someone tells me it looks trash, I won’t get offended, but I guess that’s just me.
Did not know the meaning of a RABBLE-ROUSER, sorry, but there it is :
"a person who says, writes, or does things that make crowds of people excited or angry, usually intentionally in order to make them act in a particular way"
And I've thought we are a kind of.... forum , hm !
Well, respectfully I do not agree, to me, he brings a lot of value to the forum even with some of his controversial posts, but that is how is supposed to be, otherwise we wouldn't have any open dialogue....
PFL205.064 with M276.823 (Oil pump solenoid defeated)
Originally Posted by Frenetic
I can only speak from my personal experience but my 2020 BMW X5 M50i was flawless. Build quality was perfect and not one glitch or issue other than a weird gas pedal position that caused my leg to cramp, but I got used to that. I just wasn’t use to BMW’s gas pedal position and angle and I wasn’t the only one. One thing I miss the most was the luggage compartment package. It had raised rubber rails on the floor and it was like voodoo magic in that grocery bags wouldn’t tip over while driving. I regret trading that thing in for the GLE. The only reason I did was because I got $10k equity during the used car madness. However, new BMWs, notably the 7 and X7, are god-awfully ugly to me.
My 2022 GLE was a nightmare. With my personal and very biased experience, and many forum and Reddit anecdotes on build quality, I will never touch anything coming out of that factory. My car was recently sold and I still get CarFax maintenance notifications and sure enough the new owner had to take it back to the dealership with less than 1k eclipsed miles lol.
My 2023 S 500 has been great. A far cry from my GLE. Just the build quality differences is amazing. I did have some minor glitches but nothing to write home about or make me feel negative about the car, unlike the constant and very annoying barrage of issues from my GLE. I will very seriously consider another S class or maybe just get the last V8 Yukon Denali, assuming it’s available at lease end.
Oof, what was the issue and what is this CarFax maintenance notifications, never heard of.
I can only speak from my personal experience but my 2020 BMW X5 M50i was flawless. Build quality was perfect and not one glitch or issue other than a weird gas pedal position that caused my leg to cramp, but I got used to that. I just wasn’t use to BMW’s gas pedal position and angle and I wasn’t the only one. One thing I miss the most was the luggage compartment package. It had raised rubber rails on the floor and it was like voodoo magic in that grocery bags wouldn’t tip over while driving. I regret trading that thing in for the GLE. The only reason I did was because I got $10k equity during the used car madness. However, new BMWs, notably the 7 and X7, are god-awfully ugly to me.
My 2022 GLE was a nightmare. With my personal and very biased experience, and many forum and Reddit anecdotes on build quality, I will never touch anything coming out of that factory. My car was recently sold and I still get CarFax maintenance notifications and sure enough the new owner had to take it back to the dealership with less than 1k eclipsed miles lol.
My 2023 S 500 has been great. A far cry from my GLE. Just the build quality differences is amazing. I did have some minor glitches but nothing to write home about or make me feel negative about the car, unlike the constant and very annoying barrage of issues from my GLE. I will very seriously consider another S class or maybe just get the last V8 Yukon Denali, assuming it’s available at lease end.
Glad to hear. Although I can’t imagine going from an S-Class to a body-on-frame Yukon. Just won’t be the same in terms of ride and comfort.
Well, respectfully I do not agree, to me, he brings a lot of value to the forum even with some of his controversial posts, but that is how is supposed to be, otherwise we wouldn't have any open dialogue....
No worries man, I'm just having a little fun; he knows that.
Oof, what was the issue and what is this CarFax maintenance notifications, never heard of.
I have a CarFax account that I made online. Ever since I made that account long ago, CarFax magically knows every car I buy and will associate it with my account.
I think they get this information from DMV registration and/or directly from the dealers. I do think some or maybe most dealers volunteer this information to CarFax to enable them to get free corporate CarFax data and they do so within the confines of the privacy agreement you sign in the zillion of pages when you buy a car. How else would it know the car was serviced unless that information came directly from the dealer. For example, my S-500 is magically associated with my account and shown on my CarFax dashboard even though I never volunteered that info.
Well, I get monthly emails that tracks any major event. It will, for example, notify me if the car is serviced. But it will not list the details, but as the owner, I can go in and enter detailed information if desired.
Below is the email and I noticed the new owner took the car back to the dealer one month and 1k miles after buying it lol.
Well, respectfully I do not agree, to me, he brings a lot of value to the forum even with some of his controversial posts, but that is how is supposed to be, otherwise we wouldn't have any open dialogue....
I appreciate that! Crabman's just joking around though...
PFL205.064 with M276.823 (Oil pump solenoid defeated)
Originally Posted by Frenetic
I have a CarFax account that I made online. Ever since I made that account long ago, CarFax magically knows every car I buy and will associate it with my account.
I think they get this information from DMV registration and/or directly from the dealers. I do think some or maybe most dealers volunteer this information to CarFax to enable them to get free corporate CarFax data and they do so within the confines of the privacy agreement you sign in the zillion of pages when you buy a car. How else would it know the car was serviced unless that information came directly from the dealer. For example, my S-500 is magically associated with my account and shown on my CarFax dashboard even though I never volunteered that info.
Well, I get monthly emails that tracks any major event. It will, for example, notify me if the car is serviced. But it will not list the details, but as the owner, I can go in and enter detailed information if desired.
Below is the email and I noticed the new owner took the car back to the dealer one month and 1k miles after buying it lol.
I see, I think that is how it works just how you described.
06-06-2023, 05:34 AM
