Not really.. Incentives and rebates, FYI, are only for "cheaper" models. The expensive sedans above 55K are not eligible (hence not a single EQE, EQS or Tesla Model S, or even the Tesla Model 3 Performance few months ago, are all not eligible and you still see a bunch of them!. Same for SUVs and trucks, the limit is 80K. And, you still see a bunch of EVs and trucks above that limit, including many Model X (which if you just spec it with white interior, it jumps the 80K limit). EVs would still service without incentives (just take a look at how many EV cars are sold in markets and counties that don't offer any incentives). You are not a fan of EVs, but what most people are missing that there is a lot of people who prefer EVs... Companies are only going to listen to what majority of people want, and I feel very soon, most people would only want EVs. Anyway, enjoy it now when you still get the chance to choose any drivetrain you want. Soon it will become just like the manual vs automatic transmission discussion long-time ago, as we all just digested the automatic transmission and can't live without it.

I agree with you though that it makes no sense to make it an EV-only market; 100% agree. I myself would even hate that. My daily driver from now on will ALWAYS be an EV and forever, but I still want to have at least one V8 or V12 in my garage... always... But for my daily-driver, or even for long trips now, I would rather be in an EV now.

 

If you had ever driven an EV you would be as enthusiastic about an EV S Class as I am. EV drivetrain is perfect for the S Class.

Has nothing to do with executives at MB trying to "save the planet", its the regulatory environment. They forsee a future where they cant sell ICE cars in a bunch of markets and they are jumping on the train with everybody else to make sure they are prepared for that.

 

I'm in an EQS 450+ loaner at the moment since yesterday. My AMG is in for its 5th service, getting new spark plugs and also an alignment. Should be done today. I've driven the EQS 580, EQS AMG and the EQE AMG before, but first time I have an EQ for a couple of days. As some of you know I've been critical of the S Class and I continue to be. I like this EQS way more. It's the ultimate smoothness for a daily luxury car. Biggest plus over the S Class is that the EQS has a proper throttle response instead of that neutered mess the W223 has. The W223 felt outright clunky in comparison. Those of you that have complained about the transmission in the W223, you should really consider an EQS. I'm driving it in Sport, because like with the S Class, the suspension is just too floaty for my taste in Comfort, but where the W223's AIRMATIC in Sport didn't feel very refined, the EQS suspension in Sport just absorbs bumpy roads with confidence and feels refined and composed. I suspect that in this case, the additional weight is actually a benefit. The overall driving experience is just so much better than the S500 loaner I had last year. I liken it to having the throttle response of my AMG combined with the expected smoothness of an S Class that the W223 doesn't necessarily deliver. What's not to like for those who are into smooth luxury cars? My only issue is that MBUX continues to be a disaster. CarPlay won't stay connected for more than 5 minutes, so that's been super annoying, and I suppose we could debate over the styling choices.

 

Your experience matches nearly every single anti-EV person after he gets to drive an EV long enough. I bet the majority of anti-EV folks would understand how much they are missing by sticking with their ICE vehicles once they get the chance to drive an EV long time.... any EV. There is just no comparison. The driving experience in an EV is just better in every-way. As I've always said, I would like to have at least one V8 or V12 in my garage, but my daily drive will always be an EV....I truly believe the ICE to EV switch is very similar to the Manual to Automatic transmission switch (different styling as far as driving, but much much more fun and comfortable).

I've been an anti-EV person in the past.... I decided to take the risk to the fact I even bought an EV while I still think I will hate it. As a car guy, once I get bored with my car I just move to the next one to enjoy it.. I made that decision just for the fun of it, and I'll never look back. I would still buy a V8 or V12 in the future or even near-future, but my EV will remain the king in my garage. I've never in my life owned a car for 6-months and still feel that there is no way I can let it go or that there is not even a single car in the market that I'd like more.

 

I had an EQS SUV loaner for a week and it's crazy how much easier it was to drive than my GLE. Even though it's 8" longer, it felt smaller and more svelte, maybe it had rear wheel steering? The instant torque was addictive.

​​​​​​I also love my V8TT.

I would definitely consider an EV as a second vehicle but my wife drives less than a thousand miles a year so it doesn't make sense to switch out her vehicle nor does she care to.

 

Interesting. My feeling is that the negatives about the W223, were addressed years ago in the W222. Wonderful throttle response, more comfortable ride quality and more nimble handling. Everything in the handsome, traditional cabin worked as it should and the car had a basic elegance that was lost with the 223 styling, both inside and out, in my opinion. When I test drove the EQS, I was so underwhelmed. My feeling was that it was in no way an S Class and I still feel that way. The only car I have driven that has come close to the comfort I experienced in my W222’s with Magic Body Control, was the BMW I7.

 

Let me first clarify that I was never an EV hater. Just in case some people think I've suddenly seen the light. I've always said they make excellent daily drivers and commuters for those with home charging capabilities. My issues with EVs is everything around them. The botched rollout, lack of infrastructure, long charging times on long trips, cold temperature issues, the nearly religious believes of some that they are gonna save us from extinction, along with the real risk of thermal runaways if the battery got damaged. The latter is increasingly leading to some real disasters such as entire car parks melting down.

I was actually underwhelmed the first time I drove the EQS 580. It was during the tour they did around the country. I signed up, but the drive was less than 15 minutes, and it was in city traffic. Since then I've attended a couple of AMG events in Europe where I drove the EQ AMG models and now this loaner. I'd recommend you live with one for a bit to really experience it. I'm not gonna give up my V8 AMG. I'm not buying into EVs when it comes to performance models. Weight is a big issue there and so is the lack of emotional engagement, but for a regular daily car they are hard to beat.

Yes, ICE cars used to have excellent throttle response especially with naturally aspirated engines. My wife's almost 20 year old VW Bug has a better throttle response than anything comparable out there today and I like it for errands around town. But the quest for better fuel efficiency has lead to throttle and turbo lag in modern regular cars. I come from naturally aspirated engines and I hate most turbo charged engines due to all the lag. The AMG biturbo V8 is a major exception, because AMG set out to make it feel like a naturally aspirated engine. Most regular newer ICE cars these days are frankly terrible. Small turbo charged engines with all kinds of lag. They are terrible to drive quite frankly. I don't just drive performance cars as some here might think. I quite regularly drive normal cars as well and they are getting worse if they still have an internal combustion engine, or get overly complicated in case of hybrids.

 

Actual numbers for EV performance from AMS

 

I 100% agree with all of this, the issue is its in a vehicle I think is hideous with an interior that feels really cheap IMO. If that powertrain were in the W223 S Class I would go for it without hesitation. Just like I would choose an i7 vs a 760 for just driving enjoyment every time.

I would point out though that a lot of your unhappiness with the W223 S500 would have been solved with the S580, it just feels much better all the eay around, and you need to defeat the engine start/stop. Still though, can't beat the EV powertrain for a big luxury car.

I just wish charging when traveling were better sorted around me.

 

Yeah, the exterior is at least an acquired taste, but as far as the interior goes, I can't really see much of a difference. The W223 feels rather cheap as well. The S500 had standard leather. Nappa would step it up in both cars. This EQS doesn't have the Hyperscreen, which I'm not really a fan of anyway, so it doesn't look much different from the S. Same increased use of cheap plastic as in the W223. Vent and door handle designs are different between them, but otherwise brothers from the same mother. I might drive an S580 at one point just to see if there's anything I missed, but the engine wasn't really the issue with the S500 for me.

 

I wouldn’t be in the market for an S500, so what I would buy would have Napa leather as standard etc. Finishes are considerably better in the W223 than the EQS, EQS has hard plastic on the sides of the console, hard vinyl sunvisors and leather seating materials that just aren’t as nice. An EQS is more similar to an E Class than an S Class in interior finishes. You’ll find that mentioned in many reviews as well as all over this forum.

The V8 changes the whole way the vehicle feels, what you have described your issues being would be largely solved with the V8.

 

Yeah, the EQS doesn't have a transmission tunnel, so I give you the center console. That just feels more solid with a transmission tunnel than essentially a plastic construction. On the other hand the EQS offers a ton more storage as a result below the center console. I just drove it back to the dealership to pick up my car and I continue to have to say the EQS just feels more solid overall and better noise insulated. Not surprising as any kind of rattle and squeak is doubly annoying in an electric car. BTW, it's raining today and guess what? The wipers were dead silent. I think you were the one with noisy wipers, right? Got new wipers on mine as well as part of the service and they are also dead quiet, so perhaps a different issue. Yes, a V8 definitely makes some difference. I have one after all and wouldn't wanna downgrade, but an inline 6 is a very nice and smooth engine.

 

Just overall the EQS is a step below the S Class inside. The powertrain just has a huge impact on the overall feel of the car, as does the much lower quality seats and material in the S500. I took an S500 out to test drive it and I turned it right around and took it back.

Case in point, the EV powertrain just gives you a much more favorable impression of the car as a whole, same is true of the V8. The S580e plug in is also great on EV mode, as soon as the engine kicks on I like it a lot less.

 

I definitely get that. Within a given model range, stepping up makes a big difference and cars are built to a price point. I mean a C300 feels like a Camry compared to my C63. However, I'm comparing the EQS 450 to the S500. If stepping up to the S580 it has to be compared to the EQS 580. I suppose I don't get hung up on slightly less plush materials in the interior if the car drives and feels better. I'm not really buying cars for the interior. I'm buying them for the driving experience.

 

Most S Class buyers though buy the S580, something like 75% of sales are the S580...the EQS580 is the same inside as the EQS450, only difference is the Hyperscreen.

People who buy cars like this, the interior is really important. The interior is the only reason I don't have an S580 right now. The EQS just disappoints me in every way but the drive feel, I hate both the exterior and the interior (materials and design)

 

Yeah, we all have our preferences and what you state mostly applies to North America. In Germany for example it's the diesel models that are most popular. Each market has its preferences. Americans buy large, Europeans buy small, Chinese buy only the long wheelbase.

 

Well, there certainly isn't going to be another ICE S-Class after W223. After what they did with this once glorious car, I say good riddance. As far as I'm concerned, Mercedes is completely destroying the brand and I will never buy another one.

 

Well, even though I have no interest in any of their current offerings, I will refrain from using the word “never.” I agree that the models launched for 2021 & later have not been well designed and have not been thoroughly sorted, but I am hoping that MB will get their house in order, hopefully starting with the 2025 S Class facelift, if not before. Keeping my fingers crossed.

 

I am not hopeful. There are too many corners being cut. I think this car is beyond saving. I think this is unhappiest I’ve been with a car in the past 20 years.

 

 

Let's see on that, I have to think if MB goes all electric in 2030 I can't imagine their sales numbers hold strong. EV is still a segment and not the whole, even in 2030. I hope they walk some of this back and get their act together. We'll see.

 

Well, telling me that the W223 has many issues is like preaching to the choir. I hated mine, it was nothing but trouble and after 18 months, MBUSA bought it back.

 

I can't tell you how much I like NOT buying gas. The more I don't buy gas the more I don't want to buy gas. The stuff stinks, literally and figuratively.

 

Oh, I know, sir! And trust me at this point I am dreaming of the same outcome!

 

The new MB EVs have been reported to have HYDROGEN FUEL CELL technology powering the four motors. That is infinitely better as a continuous source of energy then the untenable charging stations and home charging which can take up to 24 hours.
If the filling stations are abundant, and they can be with no major infrastructure changes in cables and new energy plant sources by simply adapting current fuel stops to now offer H, that is the way to go - especially for diesels. The new 2026 MB Sclass is said to have 1000km+ range. A fuel cell EV, if the energy source is readily available, is something I can buy into and ditch my ICE. Personally, LPG is a much cheaper transition until the fuel cell tech and widespread availability is there. It emits 30% less CO2, is clean, abundant, cheap and we have 200+ years of reserves and little or no trillion-dollar infrastructure to create which will likely be old tech sooner than later, apart from the fact that whole climate "emergency" is a scam anyway. I am looking forward to the 2026 Sclass if this is the case.