resoplez

Hi folks

I'm looking for an S63 here. I've red a lot abut M157. So, regardless of price, with similar features on the car, and same mileage around 70K, which engine would be preferably M157 or the new 4.0L (I cannot recall the code name M...)

Thanks

TripleDown

Spend some time here and read about both before you decide. Neither is going to be a Lexus motor when it comes to reliability and you can find posts about serious issues with either. It really comes down to maintenance history in my book and overall car condition.

Oh and the real one you want is the M156 ;-). Legendary hand built AMG motor designed by them but you will be looking for a 15 year old S63 to get one. I tried and gave up when I could not find a nice one. The M157 is a beast and the w222 is widely recognized as being more reliable than the w221. But it does not sound like an M156 heading to 7k on the tach ;-).

chassis

4.0TT hot vee is M177. Oil vapor separator issues leading to rear main seal failure have been reported by more than a few owners on this site.

5.5TT cold vee M157 is well known for bore scoring, oil and coolant leaks. In other words a time bomb.

carlosinseattle

I disagree with the above post. All he ever does is scare people about Mercedes cars. He's never met an engine or car from Mercedes that he likes. Take it with a grain of salt.

Here's my advice. Search out 100+ cars using Carfax, and read ALL the Carfax maintenance reports. Take notes and look for patterns. When you find cars that have had problems, compare them to cars that haven't had problems, and see how the service history affects reliability. If you get really ambitious, do the same for 7 Series BMW's. I laugh when people cry about S-Class cars being poorly built; it's obvious they've never owned a BMW, Audi, Infiniti, Jaguar, or Genesis. I've owned all except a BMW and I own a MB for a reason.

As a bonus, I'll give you one to start with: https://www.carfax.com/VehicleHistor...kJTTBolzzR_nYw

resoplez

Thanks for all the answers guys.

I've never seen an M156 S63, but I can imagine those 6.3L would sound amazing.

In regards to the look of the car, the w222 platform is the one that gets all my attention, even more than Today's new models.

Somehow I like more the looks of a facelift W222 than pre-facelift, but I think the M157 sounds much better and much more real than M177. Just my opinion.


Not planning on doing any tuning.

I dont see many M177 on the market, and almost none of them have the premium sound or are fully loaded, and the mileage for the price is kind of a no no.

I've been checking Carfax reports as adviced, but most of them only have tires changed, batteries, oil and brake pads. I haven't seen any major engine repair on a Carfax so far. I will keep looking. But, I will not waste time looing into BMWs lol

I've been checking VINs though https://www.lastvin.com/ as a way to compare features and see what would be the best pick.

2014-2016 E63s with midnight package also gets my attention, but cannot compete with the confort and space of the S63.

Thanks guys

carlosinseattle

To answer your original question, I'd definitely go with the M177 engine in the 2018-2020 S63. If everything else was equal I'd go with the M177. And if the engines were the same I'd also go with the newer car. 5000+ parts different between the W222 V1 and V2, which we call facelifted, cars.

resoplez

Hi CarlosinSeattle

Considering identical cars in looks and everything, why you prefer the M177 engine?
Do you think is more durable in the long run? Or is it about HP and torque?
Or is it about being newer, more parts, or? Just curious

carlosinseattle

Considering identical cars in looks and everything, why you prefer the M177 engine?
The M177 motor makes more power and quicker. The hot V design brings the turbos closer to the intake so you have quicker throttle response.

Do you think is more durable in the long run? Or is it about HP and torque?
Not sure about durability. I'm of the belief that long term durability is NOT all about the original build. While it is important to build something that "can" stand the test of time, I believe that long term durability has more to do with usage and maintenance. All things being equal, I'd choose the used car that had the better traceable service history. I paid a bit of a premium for a 1 owner impeccably maintained 2018 S63 last year.

Or is it about being newer, more parts, or? Just curious
I had a 2017 S550 that I owned for less than a full year. There are so many differences between 2017 to 2018, more than I could name. Beyond the engine, almost everything is improved, even if it kept the same name. Everything from interior lighting, to infotainment to driver aids wer improved. The 2018-2020 S63 even has a bespoke rear subframe that's lighter and stiffer, with different bushings. The car handles much better than the 2014-2017 cars. If you like hard acceleration, especially as you exit corners, it's a no brainer on which one to choose. That's not to say the 14-17 cars aren't awesome, they are, it's just that pretty much everything was improved. An S63 is special, regardless of which one you get. Keep in mind, the W223 S63 came out 4 years after the S550/S580. It's even more unique, but it goes to show that MB really works hard to set their AMG cars apart. I didn't realize what that meant until after I bought my S63.

Having said that, if I were a tuner, or my car was for weekends only, I'd probably buy the older car. No replacement for dispacement...LOL
Lastly, the wet clutch n the 2018-2020 will take some time to get used to...and you probably won't let anybody drive your car, not even for a second. It's excellent, but prioritizes fast shifts over smoothness. Once you figure it out, nobody riding in the car will notice a difference...until you floor it - then they'll all scream. It feels like being shot out of a cannon....freaky!

JohnLane

OP... Best engine in a 222 AMG car is the 279. It is an updated version of the 275 so no more coil pack drama and port fuel injection so none zero zip nadda disasters with direct injectors that the V-8 engines all suffer with as they age. (V-8 guys ask yourself why one would end up with a scored cylinder..... answer to the question being uneven fuel delivery in the cylinder due to a crummy injector! It causes detonation. Really if I owned one of them with DI I would see to it ALL injectors get replaced at least every 60,000 miles or at the first sign of misfiring that isn’t a coil or spark plug.) The 279 lasts a long time with minimal fuss and makes 621hp 740lb/ft stock in a car with all the nicest features and finishes. Traction limited until 30mph at which point I’ll show Carlos’ car taillights while riding nicer and being more fun through the twisties. *wink Carlos! My next car will be a facelift 222 S-65. Meanwhile I love how she goes... Love Magic Body Control and the Carbon Ceramic brakes that just don’t wear out or leave wheels filthy. 279 will have the seven speed behind it with a torque converter for smoother shifts than the wet clutch box so many cry about. Have Peter do some fun software updates to make it a lot better.

chassis

False. Personal attack.

The M276 in both 3.5L NAV6 and 3.0L TTV6 configurations is the best engine MB has produced in 20+ years. Generally found in W205, W212 and W/X166 platforms. All good rides.

chassis

Agree the M279 seems to be pretty robust. The V12 and the M276 V6 which came in the S450 are solid vehicles. Any German car has high maintenance cost at higher mileage. S-Class at the higher end of the cost spectrum, because of low production volume systems which, by their low production volume nature, do not receive the test and development attention that high volume systems have. Low volume examples are any of the several suspensions that S-Class has used over the years. High volume MB example includes the M276 V6 engine. High volume non-MB examples are the widely used VAG EA888 2.0L 4-cylinder engine and the globally common ZF8HP transmission.

JohnLane

Certainly MB gets credit for learning with the years. 220 vs 221 vs 222.... My 222 car is much better than the 221 I enjoyed (with a fair amount of babysitting!) for the almost 90,000 miles I had it. Not just that I’m not having to babysit engine issues.... things like front lower suspension arms that needed just two of them replaced at 90,000. Upper front control arms at 125,000. The 221 needed front suspension lower arms every 30,000. It needed engine mounts annually. It got an A/C compressor at just over 120,000. Blower motor and controller at 80,000. The 221 needed (expensive!) front brake rotors that would warp horribly every 20-30,000. CCB in the 222 car got pads replaced at 90,000 for the first time. Never needed to touch the CCB rotors. Considering that CCB adds very little to resale I’d not ever have one with iron brakes.
S Class are not made in big volume but my 221, and both 222 cars have been dramatically better to live with than what I see produced by other manufacturers generally.... the AMG cars can really only be compared with BMW and Audi. I’ve seen enough disasters from them.

Wolfman

The engine was just one part of the W222 AMG Facelift. Part of the reason the car is so much quicker and better riding than the predecessor is the complete suspension overhaul, variable AWD drive and the quicker transmission along with the 4 liter engine.

MB_Fahrer

I call BS on the 157. They are greatly reliable engines. What, you heard about one engine that suffered from this problem?

MB_Fahrer

What do two V6's have to do with the OP's question about two V8 engines?

resoplez

Much appreciated for the answer. What I like about the M157 is basically it is a bigger engine, the M177 being smaller and more power being squeezed out of it, get me concerned a little bit, but all your opinions are very valued, My plan is just daily drive the car and have some joy going to and from work. M177 will do. I've noticed around 60k-70k are not very well optioned, but I will keep looking

Thanks!