SL/R129: 1996 SL500 electric windows and convertible top
Junior Member
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
From: Arkansas
97 SL 320 Triple Black
Bow Module
Klaus,
I followed your interactions, using flat bladed screwdriver to slide along surfaces of he bow part. It did not seem to be particularly crushed or misshapen and when I again initiated the top cycle, nothing changed. I tried a couple of times using the top switch and everything works correctly until it gets to the point at which the top should unlock from the windshield. Also, after sliding the screwdriver, still no noticeable click when I manually lift the top.
There is the faintest of sounds on both sides of the top mechanism once it stops the cycle midway but very faint and not a definite clicking noise.
Attached are pics of the mechanism on my car.
I followed your interactions, using flat bladed screwdriver to slide along surfaces of he bow part. It did not seem to be particularly crushed or misshapen and when I again initiated the top cycle, nothing changed. I tried a couple of times using the top switch and everything works correctly until it gets to the point at which the top should unlock from the windshield. Also, after sliding the screwdriver, still no noticeable click when I manually lift the top.
There is the faintest of sounds on both sides of the top mechanism once it stops the cycle midway but very faint and not a definite clicking noise.
Attached are pics of the mechanism on my car.
SPONSOR
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 475
Likes: 41
From: On the beautiful Oregon Coast
03 SL Kleemann, 97 SL320 pano top, 95 Lorinser E320 Cabrio, Ferrari 360, Tesla X
Klaus,
I followed your interactions, using flat bladed screwdriver to slide along surfaces of he bow part. It did not seem to be particularly crushed or misshapen and when I again initiated the top cycle, nothing changed. I tried a couple of times using the top switch and everything works correctly until it gets to the point at which the top should unlock from the windshield. Also, after sliding the screwdriver, still no noticeable click when I manually lift the top.
There is the faintest of sounds on both sides of the top mechanism once it stops the cycle midway but very faint and not a definite clicking noise.
Attached are pics of the mechanism on my car.
I followed your interactions, using flat bladed screwdriver to slide along surfaces of he bow part. It did not seem to be particularly crushed or misshapen and when I again initiated the top cycle, nothing changed. I tried a couple of times using the top switch and everything works correctly until it gets to the point at which the top should unlock from the windshield. Also, after sliding the screwdriver, still no noticeable click when I manually lift the top.
There is the faintest of sounds on both sides of the top mechanism once it stops the cycle midway but very faint and not a definite clicking noise.
Attached are pics of the mechanism on my car.
no click - no work.
The top not unlocking from the windshield is a typical sign of the black plastic piece on the switch assembly being stuck (thus never pushing on the tiny micro switch which creates a closed circuit when released). Maybe the adjustment was a bit too much. I would suggest familiarizing yourself a little more with the function of the micro switch assembly (as illustrated in my previous post), so that you know it is working as opposed to getting stuck. Try to recreate how the brass-colored rod end on the cylinder triggers this switch assembly, and make sure that the black plastic piece comes back by spring power when the cylinder is not triggering it. When the black plastic piece comes back down, it is supposed to be pushing the tiny micro switch inside the assembly and make it click again.
The clicking when the top is in the highest position is a switch that initiates "differential operation", i.e., it makes the top move slower towards the windshield. This switch is only on the left side, and not to be confused with the switch assembly you have just worked on. I am not sure why you would be hearing a click on both sides. This switch could also have been affected by the canvas replacement artists, but it is normally the one on the bow extension cylinder and you have to take care of the latter one first.
Klaus
www.tophydraulicsinc.com
Junior Member
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
From: Arkansas
97 SL 320 Triple Black
Klaus,
Returned from my travels and got back to the top project. I worked with the mechanisms as you suggested and then recalibrated the windows, VIOLA!!!! It works and I can't thank you enough for your help on the project. Now, as time permits, I'll begin working through other items I have on the list so you may well be hearing from me again.
Returned from my travels and got back to the top project. I worked with the mechanisms as you suggested and then recalibrated the windows, VIOLA!!!! It works and I can't thank you enough for your help on the project. Now, as time permits, I'll begin working through other items I have on the list so you may well be hearing from me again.
Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
From: Worthington, OH
1995 SL500 / 85 380SL
Leaks tons of hydraulic fluid
Rats. After my triumphant repair of my controller board, and several weeks of perfect operation, I have massive hydraulic fluid leaks ... two leaks, each just in front of the rear wheels (sniff sniff). So, visual inspection strongly suggests it is the Bow Extension Cylinders. Today, using the Top Hydraulics instruction sheet, I removed both of the Bow Extension Cylinders.
However, the Top Hydraulics website has convinced me that this is not a job for me (even with my experience and skills).
So, Klaus, what do I do to send in my two Bow Extension Cylinders for rebuild?
However, the Top Hydraulics website has convinced me that this is not a job for me (even with my experience and skills).
So, Klaus, what do I do to send in my two Bow Extension Cylinders for rebuild?
Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
From: Worthington, OH
1995 SL500 / 85 380SL
Hot dog ... life is good again
Thank you Klaus and Top Hydraulics. FYI to the other members: My 2 bow cylinders were leaking badly, so I sent them to TH to be rebuilt. Top Hydraulics did the job and got it all back to me in less than a week (and most of that time, was my mistake using US snail mail). However, in the meantime, I managed to crush my micro-switch (on driver's side). Found another on eBay, put it all together and my top works perfectly again.
Not a particularly hard job removing/replacing the bow hydraulics, but lots of patience is a good thing.
Not a particularly hard job removing/replacing the bow hydraulics, but lots of patience is a good thing.
Newbie
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
1997 SL500 Mercedes
Replace battery
Hi, I had to replace the battery in our 1997 SL500, now the roll bar light and soft top control button remain lit. I have resynched windows etc and to no avail, any suggestions?
Thanks in advance
Thanks in advance
Newbie
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
98 Sl500
1998 SL 500 top problem
I have a 1998 Sl500. When I bought it the guy told me the front seals for the convertible top were bad. He hit the button and fluid went everywhere. He told me the front ones were easy to fix so i ordered the parts and did it myself. When I took the hard top off with the tool it made the convertible button turn red and stays red while i drive. and beeps. I replaced the seals and hit the button and i just hear noise. The windows go up and down and i can hear the roof trying to work but nothing happens. There is no fluid leaking and the red light is continuously on. What is wrong with my top???
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Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
From: Worthington, OH
1995 SL500 / 85 380SL
Herky jerky rollbar and windows
Dang nab it. OK, so my top down, as it should. Going down is perfect. However, going up is not quite perfect, and consequently, my red top light blinks and I get the annoying warning sound when I start the car.
So, here is what it looks like: Top is down. Press top button forward, everything works perfect; windows/rollbar goes down, top goes up, and the top locks, and then (and this is the weird part), the car tries to raise the rollbar and the window. But they only go up about 3 inches, and then the bar, goes down; and then the windows and bar start to go up again (another 3 inches), and then the cycle repeats (herky jerky).
I usually stop the cycle after the tops goes up, and then just put the rollbar and windows up manually. The top is locked down nicely, but something in the UP cycle is odd. Any ideas?
So, here is what it looks like: Top is down. Press top button forward, everything works perfect; windows/rollbar goes down, top goes up, and the top locks, and then (and this is the weird part), the car tries to raise the rollbar and the window. But they only go up about 3 inches, and then the bar, goes down; and then the windows and bar start to go up again (another 3 inches), and then the cycle repeats (herky jerky).
I usually stop the cycle after the tops goes up, and then just put the rollbar and windows up manually. The top is locked down nicely, but something in the UP cycle is odd. Any ideas?
SPONSOR
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 475
Likes: 41
From: On the beautiful Oregon Coast
03 SL Kleemann, 97 SL320 pano top, 95 Lorinser E320 Cabrio, Ferrari 360, Tesla X
rgp717,
See http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r129...new-front.html. Almost certainly, you need to adjust one of the front lock micro switch levers. The soft top controller checks the micro switch position of the front locks while the windows are going up, and one of the front lock micro switches is signaling OPEN once the canvas is pulled down in the rear and thus is pulling up in the front.
I will get into more detail when I have a chance. Meanwhile, please check out the thread linked above and let us know what you find.
Klaus
www.tophydraulicsinc.com
See http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r129...new-front.html. Almost certainly, you need to adjust one of the front lock micro switch levers. The soft top controller checks the micro switch position of the front locks while the windows are going up, and one of the front lock micro switches is signaling OPEN once the canvas is pulled down in the rear and thus is pulling up in the front.
I will get into more detail when I have a chance. Meanwhile, please check out the thread linked above and let us know what you find.
Klaus
www.tophydraulicsinc.com
Newbie
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
1995 sl500
1995 sl500
hello, please help just swapped out my rebuilt cly. wow super fast repairs. thanks .. now how do i get the roof reset, i replaced all rear cly.s , did the pillar ones last year..have roof all together now it will not engg to go down or u.. the roll bar works, windows work...?? what is my next step???
what am i doing wrong..my fatherin law gave this 95 sl to my daughter with 40k on it.. i am a old gm guy and i am lost... pleasehelp. the local dealership will not help. thanks ken
what am i doing wrong..my fatherin law gave this 95 sl to my daughter with 40k on it.. i am a old gm guy and i am lost... pleasehelp. the local dealership will not help. thanks ken
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
300SL
Problem with soft top
Hi, I have red the whole tread but it didn't help to solve out my problem. Have bought myself a '94 300SL pre-facelift with no working roof. The car has been out of use for the last 2 years and previous owner meant that the roof doesn't go because of faulty windows. My first step was to fix them (drivers one had a lot of dirt and rust in motor, the other one had a problem with switch on a central panel) Well they are in working order and I learnt them so they goes down by overpressing the switches. But roof is still dead. I checked sensors in the bottoms of the doors - they look OK. Disconnect battery over 24 hours with no effect. Checked wiring around control unit found no damage, changed fuses back (all of them)
So when I press the button backwards nothing happens neither windows and roll-bar nor the roof itself, total silent. When I press forward soft-top cover presses in a bit and something sounds in a trunk (like el-motor probably hydraulic) but still nothing happens. I tried to manually operate soft top with no effect. But when it is unfolded or when the hard top is on by pressing the button forward all 4 latches locks. When driving - no sounds or blinking lamps. Roll-bar operates with it's switch up and down.
Have you any clues on my next step in investigating this?
I am located in Sweden
So when I press the button backwards nothing happens neither windows and roll-bar nor the roof itself, total silent. When I press forward soft-top cover presses in a bit and something sounds in a trunk (like el-motor probably hydraulic) but still nothing happens. I tried to manually operate soft top with no effect. But when it is unfolded or when the hard top is on by pressing the button forward all 4 latches locks. When driving - no sounds or blinking lamps. Roll-bar operates with it's switch up and down.
Have you any clues on my next step in investigating this?
I am located in Sweden
SPONSOR
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 475
Likes: 41
From: On the beautiful Oregon Coast
03 SL Kleemann, 97 SL320 pano top, 95 Lorinser E320 Cabrio, Ferrari 360, Tesla X
Hello Perepel,
welcome to the forum! You have obviously done your homework, and thanks for the detailed description of the problem. I will comment below.
Just to clarify, a late model year '94 in Europe could be a model year '95 in the US, and that's when the electrical system on the top had a lot of changes. However, since you are writing that you checked the sensors in the bottom of the doors, you must have an early '94 with the old system (which makes diagnosis easier).
Good news: you can manually read codes with just the help of a paper clip and an LED on your model. That should tell you what is going on. Go to http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r129...ml#post2419223 for more info.
Did the soft top raise after you removed the hard top?
Klaus
Top Hydraulics, Inc
www.tophydraulicsinc.com
welcome to the forum! You have obviously done your homework, and thanks for the detailed description of the problem. I will comment below.
Hi, I have red the whole tread but it didn't help to solve out my problem. Have bought myself a '94 300SL pre-facelift with no working roof. The car has been out of use for the last 2 years and previous owner meant that the roof doesn't go because of faulty windows. My first step was to fix them (drivers one had a lot of dirt and rust in motor, the other one had a problem with switch on a central panel) Well they are in working order and I learnt them so they goes down by overpressing the switches. But roof is still dead. I checked sensors in the bottoms of the doors - they look OK. Disconnect battery over 24 hours with no effect. Checked wiring around control unit found no damage, changed fuses back (all of them)
So when I press the button backwards nothing happens neither windows and roll-bar nor the roof itself, total silent. When I press forward soft-top cover presses in a bit and something sounds in a trunk (like el-motor probably hydraulic) but still nothing happens. I tried to manually operate soft top with no effect. But when it is unfolded or when the hard top is on by pressing the button forward all 4 latches locks. When driving - no sounds or blinking lamps. Roll-bar operates with it's switch up and down.
Have you any clues on my next step in investigating this?
I am located in Sweden
So when I press the button backwards nothing happens neither windows and roll-bar nor the roof itself, total silent. When I press forward soft-top cover presses in a bit and something sounds in a trunk (like el-motor probably hydraulic) but still nothing happens. I tried to manually operate soft top with no effect. But when it is unfolded or when the hard top is on by pressing the button forward all 4 latches locks. When driving - no sounds or blinking lamps. Roll-bar operates with it's switch up and down.
Have you any clues on my next step in investigating this?
I am located in Sweden
Good news: you can manually read codes with just the help of a paper clip and an LED on your model. That should tell you what is going on. Go to http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r129...ml#post2419223 for more info.
Did the soft top raise after you removed the hard top?
Klaus
Top Hydraulics, Inc
www.tophydraulicsinc.com
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
300SL
Hello Klaus!
Thanks for quick answer. I will read those topics and see if I can manage to read faulty codes.
yes, the car is early 94. When I collected the car the hard top was on, then I took it off and tried all the staff above but it didn't work. I put the hard top back on to be able to drive 'cause it's rainy now in Sweden.
Thanks for quick answer. I will read those topics and see if I can manage to read faulty codes.
yes, the car is early 94. When I collected the car the hard top was on, then I took it off and tried all the staff above but it didn't work. I put the hard top back on to be able to drive 'cause it's rainy now in Sweden.
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
300SL
Hi Klaus!
I have come to my next question))) I have made LED diagnostic tool but when I opened the bonnet I have realized that my SL is equipped with an old 8-polig diagnostic connector which is supposed to be only on 124, 126, 201 models... What to do??? Have I missed something?
I have come to my next question))) I have made LED diagnostic tool but when I opened the bonnet I have realized that my SL is equipped with an old 8-polig diagnostic connector which is supposed to be only on 124, 126, 201 models... What to do??? Have I missed something?
Last edited by Perepel; Jul 4, 2015 at 11:07 AM. Reason: language mixing
Newbie
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
sl320 r129 '97
problem after hard top removal
Hi Klaus!
we did not manage to remove hard top by red button, after few attempts we checked some instructions on net and easily removed it by using the wrench.
Right after that soft top refused to open at all, again using wrench we managed to close it but red button did not work and windows stayed down.
After that we decided to reconnect we battery and it started moving but not properly.
Exactly what I have now after every battery re-connect:
1) I do windows sync procedure
2) It opens fine
3) It closes fine at the beginning, but at the very end then rear locks should be locking and windows should be going up something starts crackling again and again (I hear cycles) somewhere in rear, at the same time windows go up and down again and again (not full way) until I release red button. After release we can see that all locks hold the roof fine. At this point I can open and close the roof many times which seems good but that crackling is not a good thing and windows stays in the middle.
And the worst thing is that after I close windows manually the roof again become dead (red button blinks, roof does not move).
In order to start from the beginning I do battery re-connect..
Some clue may be that if I start driving it chimes for a few second and red button continue blinking all the way, like if the roof is not fixed but it fixed by all for locks.
Please help
we did not manage to remove hard top by red button, after few attempts we checked some instructions on net and easily removed it by using the wrench.
Right after that soft top refused to open at all, again using wrench we managed to close it but red button did not work and windows stayed down.
After that we decided to reconnect we battery and it started moving but not properly.
Exactly what I have now after every battery re-connect:
1) I do windows sync procedure
2) It opens fine
3) It closes fine at the beginning, but at the very end then rear locks should be locking and windows should be going up something starts crackling again and again (I hear cycles) somewhere in rear, at the same time windows go up and down again and again (not full way) until I release red button. After release we can see that all locks hold the roof fine. At this point I can open and close the roof many times which seems good but that crackling is not a good thing and windows stays in the middle.
And the worst thing is that after I close windows manually the roof again become dead (red button blinks, roof does not move).
In order to start from the beginning I do battery re-connect..
Some clue may be that if I start driving it chimes for a few second and red button continue blinking all the way, like if the roof is not fixed but it fixed by all for locks.
Please help
Newbie
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
500sl
roof and windows inoperative after fitting new roof controller
I am having a lot of trouble with a 1995 500SL. I replaced a failed control unit with a new one from Mercedes at huge cost. The windows did not work at all with the old control unit but the roof operated fully up and down. With the new control unit the windows work up and down until they hit the limit switch at the bottom of the door. They then stop and will no longer go up. I can hear a click from the control unit when I press either window switch to go down but hear nothing when I press either window switch to go up. I have tried to normalise the window motors many times. I can reset the windows by disconnecting and then reconnecting the negative battery terminal. The battery is good and fully charged. When I attempt to raise the roof from the folded position, the windows start to lower and the roof starts to close. When the windows lower fully, the roof stops in the vertical position. The same happens if I try to open the roof from the closed position. The roll bar is working. The fuses are all good. I have had the car scanned and it is giving two fault codes, 100 power window motor FR M10/4 hall sensor not normalised and 101 power window motor FL M10/3 Hall sensor not normalised. The window motors work all the time when I run a power to them. The motors have two wires, a switchable live and earth. If the motors have hall sensors built in, I do not understand how they can work and how to test them as there are only two wires to the motors. Hopefully i have not been supplied a faulty control unit. I am at my wits end and appreciate any advice to help me fix this car.
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: Corpus Christi, Tx.
1998 SL500
I've read most of the thread above, however my problem seems a little more nuanced.
After changing my battery (disconnecting negative first and connecting negative last) and changing my back vertical window seals to decrease wind noise my right (passenger) side rear latch will not fully latch. I had to stop the top midway in order to replace my window seals and I held the top open with a bungee cord to maintain the best working position.
After trying to cycle the top several times everything (windows, all other latches, etc.) are working fine except now my right rear latch will not fully engage and draw the right rear side of my top in the full down position.
Any suggestions??
After changing my battery (disconnecting negative first and connecting negative last) and changing my back vertical window seals to decrease wind noise my right (passenger) side rear latch will not fully latch. I had to stop the top midway in order to replace my window seals and I held the top open with a bungee cord to maintain the best working position.
After trying to cycle the top several times everything (windows, all other latches, etc.) are working fine except now my right rear latch will not fully engage and draw the right rear side of my top in the full down position.
Any suggestions??
Newbie
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
1996 MB 320SL
1996 320SL Roll-Bar Issue
I have a 1996 320SL on which the batter went dead, had it replaced but then the top, ro--bar and widows were out of sync. Removed the negative battery cable for about 20hrs. as mentioned in other posts and suggestions. Then re-connected cable and performed the re-sync procedure with moving the windows down and up and holding the window switch down for about 10sec. That worked and the top now does go up/down normally. However, at the end of the up or down cycle the roll-bar goes up and the roll-bar switch does not operate. The red light on the top switch stays on and the lights on the switch are on as well. Need some help on this.... /RJ
Banned
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,982
Likes: 393
From: Atlanta, unfortunately
'09 S600, (2) R129 300SLs, '03 SL500, '03 SL55
There is a fault set in the roof controller for the roll bar system. I suggest taking the car to an independent shop that has Star Diagnosis or an equivalent scanner that can read the code and erase it.
Super Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 619
Likes: 5
rgp717..great work on that repair. I've got the exact same issue and have gone through basically the same detective work with the only conclusion being the controller. Sent it to BBA who returned it "fixed"...but the same problem. That is, no DS window. Returned it to them under warranty which they returned as fixed again but still, no DS window. Even purchased another reman. controller from them with the same outcome..no DS window. Fortunately they will take that one back but I have to wait 4 weeks to get a refund. Not real happy about that, anyway, I am at a total lose....I might start checking grounds.
Last edited by Brian McL; Apr 14, 2017 at 11:34 PM.
Super Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 619
Likes: 5
UPDATE ON BBA REFUND POLICY....beware when dealing with BBA. Notwithstanding their seemingly common issue with items not repaired properly the first time,.... if you require a refund they will hold onto your money for upto 6 weeks. That is outrageous and clearly their way of keeping your money long enough to make some interest on 30 day investments. It's slick and sneaky and they should be ashamed of that sort of conduct. There is no other reason why they can't refund to a credit card within 48 hours of receiving the item back...like every other reputable merchant does.
It may also explain why they don't use PayPal!!
We will never use them again.
It may also explain why they don't use PayPal!!
We will never use them again.
Member
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 213
Likes: 31
From: SW Florida
1995 SL500 - 2017 AMG GLC 43
UPDATE ON BBA REFUND POLICY....beware when dealing with BBA. Notwithstanding their seemingly common issue with items not repaired properly the first time,.... if you require a refund they will hold onto your money for upto 6 weeks. That is outrageous and clearly their way of keeping your money long enough to make some interest on 30 day investments. It's slick and sneaky and they should be ashamed of that sort of conduct. There is no other reason why they can't refund to a credit card within 48 hours of receiving the item back...like every other reputable merchant does.
It may also explain why they don't use PayPal!!
We will never use them again.
It may also explain why they don't use PayPal!!
We will never use them again.
