SL/R230: First SL purchase: SL55 or SL600
08-21-2008, 05:32 PM
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BMW M3
First SL purchase: SL55 or SL600
I'm considering my first SL purchase and torn between the SL55 and the SL600. I have yet to drive either but came close to purchasing a SL500 two years ago. The car will be a weekend car and never see DD duty. Wanting a luxury car with some *****. Just sold my BMW 6Speed and wanting something that is fun to drive but has all the comforts as well. The SL55 seems to have it all but it's hard to pass up a V12TT, especially when modded it seems to respond well. Is the handling night and day difference between the SL55 and SL600? Is the AMG THAT much better?
08-21-2008, 06:41 PM
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2005 SL55, 2000 CL500
Its a great question. But its been a long standing back and forth on this subject.
Personally. My choice is the SL55. And I have driven all of them.
Including the SLR.
The SL is my choice for the Following.
1. Exhaust Note
2. Lighter handling. Its like 200 Lbs.
3. The AMG Goodies. Seats, Brakes, Suspension, Pedals, Etc.
4. The seat in your pants torque of the SuperCharger kick.
5. Its an AMG hand built Motor.
The SL600 is great as well.
1. Easy to Mod for HUGE gains in HP.
2. Super smooth and lots of power. The SL55 will kick and buck.
3. Slightly higher costs of owning a V12 over a V8.
Personally.
Just get the SL65 and avoid this entire situation.
Personally. My choice is the SL55. And I have driven all of them.
Including the SLR.
The SL is my choice for the Following.
1. Exhaust Note
2. Lighter handling. Its like 200 Lbs.
3. The AMG Goodies. Seats, Brakes, Suspension, Pedals, Etc.
4. The seat in your pants torque of the SuperCharger kick.
5. Its an AMG hand built Motor.
The SL600 is great as well.
1. Easy to Mod for HUGE gains in HP.
2. Super smooth and lots of power. The SL55 will kick and buck.
3. Slightly higher costs of owning a V12 over a V8.
Personally.
Just get the SL65 and avoid this entire situation.
08-21-2008, 07:29 PM
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It's funny, that for most the SL55 seats are "better" and for me the SL600 seats are "better". I had an E55 previously and sitting in the SL55 felt the same. It's like sitting on bricks to me. They are definitely supportive (as they should be!), but certainly not meant for "cruising" in comfort.
You can't beat the handling of the SL55 and the lighter weight. I personally went for the 600 just because it was a torque monster and chipping it was a piece of cake (real world gain of ~65hp at the wheels). I don't do a lot of twisties in my neck of the woods, so my main love of the 600 engine is going from 60-100. It's an absolute rocket (as is the SL55, of course).
Of course, to one up BLT, I say just get the SL65 BS! And while you're at it, buy one for both of us too!
You can't beat the handling of the SL55 and the lighter weight. I personally went for the 600 just because it was a torque monster and chipping it was a piece of cake (real world gain of ~65hp at the wheels). I don't do a lot of twisties in my neck of the woods, so my main love of the 600 engine is going from 60-100. It's an absolute rocket (as is the SL55, of course).
Of course, to one up BLT, I say just get the SL65 BS! And while you're at it, buy one for both of us too!
08-31-2008, 12:19 AM
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V12-Biturbo
It's funny, that for most the SL55 seats are "better" and for me the SL600 seats are "better". I had an E55 previously and sitting in the SL55 felt the same. It's like sitting on bricks to me. They are definitely supportive (as they should be!), but certainly not meant for "cruising" in comfort.
You can't beat the handling of the SL55 and the lighter weight. I personally went for the 600 just because it was a torque monster and chipping it was a piece of cake (real world gain of ~65hp at the wheels). I don't do a lot of twisties in my neck of the woods, so my main love of the 600 engine is going from 60-100. It's an absolute rocket (as is the SL55, of course).
Of course, to one up BLT, I say just get the SL65 BS! And while you're at it, buy one for both of us too!
You can't beat the handling of the SL55 and the lighter weight. I personally went for the 600 just because it was a torque monster and chipping it was a piece of cake (real world gain of ~65hp at the wheels). I don't do a lot of twisties in my neck of the woods, so my main love of the 600 engine is going from 60-100. It's an absolute rocket (as is the SL55, of course).
Of course, to one up BLT, I say just get the SL65 BS! And while you're at it, buy one for both of us too!
What about the 600+ rwto??Do you have a post tune dyno sheet?
08-31-2008, 12:58 AM
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E500(Sold), SL500(Sold), C350(Sold), ML350, SL65
Man..my pick would be the SL600 just a few mod and you taking off the run-way..lol but not bad 55or600 you would have a great ride with power
08-31-2008, 02:18 AM
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SL55AMG, Ferrari 348, Ferrari Testarossa, Ferrari F40, Ferrari Mondial t, Ducati 916, Indycar
They are both great cars and extremely modable. We do them both.
I find that the 55 chassis has a better set up and is more of the driver's car, and the 600 is the straight away tq monster.
My choice is the 55, but I love them both.
I find that the 55 chassis has a better set up and is more of the driver's car, and the 600 is the straight away tq monster.
My choice is the 55, but I love them both.
08-31-2008, 03:14 PM
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2006 SL600
My car dynoed almost 470 stock this week on a day over 90 degrees on a dyno jet (reads at the high end of dynos) that should be about the same at Metalica's in stock trim. These cars (all V12 TT) appear to be underestimated by MB in horsepower. Veloce's after dyno showed a dyno dynamics reading of 508 / 602 that he indicates equates to 630 / 740 at the wheels.
The fact is without the baseline dyno most companies are using MB's figures of 500 horsepower to show the 100 hp gains.
Actually I think a gain of 65-70 hp on a dyno dymanics would be great (the difference between Metalica's dyno and Veloce's after is only 55 rwhp apart.
I know this is
I will try to post in Metalica's thread on SL600 mods as soon as I have other figures to post as well as dyno graphs, right now we are till expecting a lot of bad weather from hurricane Gustov.
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08-31-2008, 03:44 PM
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V12-Biturbo
This is going to be an interesting subject very soon, I think real world before and after dynos will show that Metalica's estimate is closer to reality that the 100 hp claims. On the dyno dynamics dyno (with usually reads lower than others) we see his car dyno at 453 rwhp, that should equate to about 543 crank stock (considerably better than the advertised 500 crank hp)
My car dynoed almost 470 stock this week on a day over 90 degrees on a dyno jet (reads at the high end of dynos) that should be about the same at Metalica's in stock trim. These cars (all V12 TT) appear to be underestimated by MB in horsepower. Veloce's after dyno showed a dyno dynamics reading of 508 / 602 that he indicates equates to 630 / 740 at the wheels.
The fact is without the baseline dyno most companies are using MB's figures of 500 horsepower to show the 100 hp gains.
Actually I think a gain of 65-70 hp on a dyno dymanics would be great (the difference between Metalica's dyno and Veloce's after is only 55 rwhp apart.
I know this is
I will try to post in Metalica's thread on SL600 mods as soon as I have other figures to post as well as dyno graphs, right now we are till expecting a lot of bad weather from hurricane Gustov.
My car dynoed almost 470 stock this week on a day over 90 degrees on a dyno jet (reads at the high end of dynos) that should be about the same at Metalica's in stock trim. These cars (all V12 TT) appear to be underestimated by MB in horsepower. Veloce's after dyno showed a dyno dynamics reading of 508 / 602 that he indicates equates to 630 / 740 at the wheels.
The fact is without the baseline dyno most companies are using MB's figures of 500 horsepower to show the 100 hp gains.
Actually I think a gain of 65-70 hp on a dyno dymanics would be great (the difference between Metalica's dyno and Veloce's after is only 55 rwhp apart.
I know this is
I will try to post in Metalica's thread on SL600 mods as soon as I have other figures to post as well as dyno graphs, right now we are till expecting a lot of bad weather from hurricane Gustov.
He quotes 25-30 more rwhp available when using 93 octane tune, even more w/100
I tried 100 mix while stk and difference in SOTP was 
His base stock dyno was right inline w/both you & Metalica's dyno...Could you please post your 470 rwhp Dyno? I'd love to see that! nice #'s
Veloce's after dyno of 508 wouldn't be 630 crank HP, it = 508/.82 = 619 Crank HP
Last edited by Thericker; 08-31-2008 at 04:05 PM.
08-31-2008, 06:11 PM
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SL55AMG, Ferrari 348, Ferrari Testarossa, Ferrari F40, Ferrari Mondial t, Ducati 916, Indycar
This is going to be an interesting subject very soon, I think real world before and after dynos will show that Metalica's estimate is closer to reality that the 100 hp claims. On the dyno dynamics dyno (with usually reads lower than others) we see his car dyno at 453 rwhp, that should equate to about 543 crank stock (considerably better than the advertised 500 crank hp)
My car dynoed almost 470 stock this week on a day over 90 degrees on a dyno jet (reads at the high end of dynos) that should be about the same at Metalica's in stock trim. These cars (all V12 TT) appear to be underestimated by MB in horsepower. Veloce's after dyno showed a dyno dynamics reading of 508 / 602 that he indicates equates to 630 / 740 at the wheels.
The fact is without the baseline dyno most companies are using MB's figures of 500 horsepower to show the 100 hp gains.
Actually I think a gain of 65-70 hp on a dyno dymanics would be great (the difference between Metalica's dyno and Veloce's after is only 55 rwhp apart.
I know this is
I will try to post in Metalica's thread on SL600 mods as soon as I have other figures to post as well as dyno graphs, right now we are till expecting a lot of bad weather from hurricane Gustov.
My car dynoed almost 470 stock this week on a day over 90 degrees on a dyno jet (reads at the high end of dynos) that should be about the same at Metalica's in stock trim. These cars (all V12 TT) appear to be underestimated by MB in horsepower. Veloce's after dyno showed a dyno dynamics reading of 508 / 602 that he indicates equates to 630 / 740 at the wheels.
The fact is without the baseline dyno most companies are using MB's figures of 500 horsepower to show the 100 hp gains.
Actually I think a gain of 65-70 hp on a dyno dymanics would be great (the difference between Metalica's dyno and Veloce's after is only 55 rwhp apart.
I know this is
I will try to post in Metalica's thread on SL600 mods as soon as I have other figures to post as well as dyno graphs, right now we are till expecting a lot of bad weather from hurricane Gustov.
Most of the time when we tune them, the end results are usually the same... whether the car was on the low side, or the high side originally.....
08-31-2008, 06:52 PM
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2006 SL600
I will have pre/post dynos soon too...Going w/VRP's latest ECU & TCU when available his rwhp was 517 POST tuning ONLY NO TCU, that equates to 630 Crank HP
He quotes 25-30 more rwhp available when using 93 octane tune, even more w/100 I tried 100 mix while stk and difference in SOTP was
His base stock dyno was right inline w/both you & Metalica's dyno...Could you please post your 470 rwhp Dyno? I'd love to see that! nice #'s
Veloce's after dyno of 508 wouldn't be 630 crank HP, it = 508/.82 = 619 Crank HP
He quotes 25-30 more rwhp available when using 93 octane tune, even more w/100
I tried 100 mix while stk and difference in SOTP was His base stock dyno was right inline w/both you & Metalica's dyno...Could you please post your 470 rwhp Dyno? I'd love to see that! nice #'s
Veloce's after dyno of 508 wouldn't be 630 crank HP, it = 508/.82 = 619 Crank HP
One of our clients who has an S600 and our ECU/TCU tuning. His dyno results are 508hp/602lb ft at the wheels. Which is roughly 630/740 at the crank.
I will try to get the dyno posted soon
08-31-2008, 08:45 PM
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V12-Biturbo
Great observations! We have had 'stock' cars dyno in the 405 range to the 450 range. There seems to be a huge variation from car to car. Aside from that, as a manufacturer we have to to state gains from MB's stock ratings, otherwise we end up looking low. But, the numbers are ~ 100 from MBs stock claims... even though their claims seem to be conservative most of the time. Whichever way you slice it the V12tt is a great engine, and if you can't have fun with one of those, you are very jaded!
Most of the time when we tune them, the end results are usually the same... whether the car was on the low side, or the high side originally.....
Most of the time when we tune them, the end results are usually the same... whether the car was on the low side, or the high side originally.....
09-02-2008, 12:37 PM
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I will have pre/post dynos soon too...Going w/VRP's latest ECU & TCU when available his rwhp was 517 POST tuning ONLY NO TCU, that equates to 630 Crank HP
He quotes 25-30 more rwhp available when using 93 octane tune, even more w/100 I tried 100 mix while stk and difference in SOTP was
His base stock dyno was right inline w/both you & Metalica's dyno...Could you please post your 470 rwhp Dyno? I'd love to see that! nice #'s
Veloce's after dyno of 508 wouldn't be 630 crank HP, it = 508/.82 = 619 Crank HP
He quotes 25-30 more rwhp available when using 93 octane tune, even more w/100
I tried 100 mix while stk and difference in SOTP was His base stock dyno was right inline w/both you & Metalica's dyno...Could you please post your 470 rwhp Dyno? I'd love to see that! nice #'s
Veloce's after dyno of 508 wouldn't be 630 crank HP, it = 508/.82 = 619 Crank HP
For instance, you would probably consider Veloce and VRP tunes similar if Veloce is using Dyno Dynamics and VRP isn't. You can easily see 20rwhp disappear between the different dyno methods.
And as mentioned, when I said 65rwhp, I'm talking "real" world. The 493 number that my car was advertised as is garbage. The tuners have to use that number because it's what's people see and know. In the real world, you're not getting a 125+hp boost at the crank, more likely around the 75-100hp range depending on your car, weather etc.
I'll keep everyone in the loop on the "other thread":
https://mbworld.org/forums/sl-class-r230/248761-sl600-mods.html
09-02-2008, 04:27 PM
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V12-Biturbo
My post dyno will come this week. I promise. I'll try to call today and make an appt. Anyway, it's really tough comparing dyno sheets from one person to the next. The cars are different, the weather is different, the machines are different.
For instance, you would probably consider Veloce and VRP tunes similar if Veloce is using Dyno Dynamics and VRP isn't. You can easily see 20rwhp disappear between the different dyno methods.
And as mentioned, when I said 65rwhp, I'm talking "real" world. The 493 number that my car was advertised as is garbage. The tuners have to use that number because it's what's people see and know. In the real world, you're not getting a 125+hp boost at the crank, more likely around the 75-100hp range depending on your car, weather etc.
I'll keep everyone in the loop on the "other thread":
https://mbworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=248761
For instance, you would probably consider Veloce and VRP tunes similar if Veloce is using Dyno Dynamics and VRP isn't. You can easily see 20rwhp disappear between the different dyno methods.
And as mentioned, when I said 65rwhp, I'm talking "real" world. The 493 number that my car was advertised as is garbage. The tuners have to use that number because it's what's people see and know. In the real world, you're not getting a 125+hp boost at the crank, more likely around the 75-100hp range depending on your car, weather etc.
I'll keep everyone in the loop on the "other thread":
https://mbworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=248761
09-04-2008, 04:06 PM
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FYI...after dyno now available on the other thread...
I'll keep everyone in the loop on the "other thread":
https://mbworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=248761
https://mbworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=248761
11-01-2008, 09:14 PM
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MANY!
I'm considering my first SL purchase and torn between the SL55 and the SL600. I have yet to drive either but came close to purchasing a SL500 two years ago. The car will be a weekend car and never see DD duty. Wanting a luxury car with some *****. Just sold my BMW 6Speed and wanting something that is fun to drive but has all the comforts as well. The SL55 seems to have it all but it's hard to pass up a V12TT, especially when modded it seems to respond well. Is the handling night and day difference between the SL55 and SL600? Is the AMG THAT much better?
The SL55 and 600 are both great vehicles I would highly recommend both of them.
11-03-2008, 12:27 PM
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$4,500. BTW, the cold weather has seemed to have brought on a nice increase in power. The problem is I can't use it all! If I floor the car at 40mph, I lose the entire back end. The torque is just crazy! Hard to believe that I have to actually feather the throttle through about 50-60mph...
11-03-2008, 04:59 PM
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V12-Biturbo
$4,500. BTW, the cold weather has seemed to have brought on a nice increase in power. The problem is I can't use it all! If I floor the car at 40mph, I lose the entire back end. The torque is just crazy! Hard to believe that I have to actually feather the throttle through about 50-60mph...
ps...Have you had any limp mode @ 1-2 shift under full throttle yet? I've read this happens w/Kleeman/RENNtech ECU/TCU
or maybe they've found a fix for it w/latest files?
11-04-2008, 03:08 PM
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I can "guess" at what limp mode is, but I'm not 100% sure. Anyway, I haven't had any instances where the power was either missing or suddenly stripped away. I get sharp shifts that happen at ~5800 RPMs. I just put it in 1st and let her rip.
The only thing I'm "disgusted" with is that I can't put the pedal to the floor even at 40mph. I need to find a way to get those tire sticking! Maybe I just need better rubber (stock rubber on there). I'm not sure how much of a difference just getting slightly wider (285 --> 295?) will really help.
The only thing I'm "disgusted" with is that I can't put the pedal to the floor even at 40mph. I need to find a way to get those tire sticking! Maybe I just need better rubber (stock rubber on there). I'm not sure how much of a difference just getting slightly wider (285 --> 295?) will really help.
