FormulaZR

Probably the only one you've come across because it must be a one-of-a-kind custom?

BTW, you want to really compare the potential of the two...compare a tune only SL55 vs a tune only SL600 - you will lose. You really think MB wasn't smart enough to detune the 600s from the factory so as not to overshadow the AMG 55s and make them all but obsolete??? Please, join us in reality!


A tune/throttle body/pulley CL55 went 11.61 @ 120.26 with a 1.75 60' with a -965 DA (that corrects to about an 11.64 @ 120.03 at 0 DA); even with a 1.67 60' that would be an 11.45-11.50 at best.
A tune only CL600 went 11.22 @ 122.31 with a 1.67 60' with a 1375 DA (that corrects to about an 11.17 @ 122.85 at 0 DA)

You may think that .3-.4 isn't much...but that's busses at those speeds and a significant power differential (although it's hard to say exactly how much power and were in the powerband because of the nature of the two engines' powerbands)

GFEAR

OHH MY GOD A I HAD A TYPO? WHAT ARE YOU 7? 66 to 600 really
and .3 seconds is about 50 feet, thats not much at all, certainly not "busses"

dont try to talk to me about drag racing, ive forgotten more about drag racing than you will ever know

FormulaZR

What? I'm supposed to read your mind? Actually thought you got off on the keypad and meant 55...don't blame me for my lack of psychic powers...

But yeah, .3 is about 50 feet and .4 is about 70 feet...in the example above with the two CL's would be .33 difference if they had similiar 60's resulting in about 58 feet; so a bus and half then.


If you knew half as much as you think you do, then maybe you could debate this point with facts...rather than personal attacks.

JAYCL600

for the record you did call it an SL66 twice I still have no idea if it was an SL65 or an SL600 that you "raced"

TopEndS62

Forget all the technical stuff.. At the end of the night, when the club is over most grown and sexy ladies will jump in the benz over the skyline.. And those that jump in a worked skyline will jump right out due to to the gassy exhaust fumes... You, my friend own a car that is the best of both worlds...

GFEAR

WHAT PERSONAL ATTACKS? i have used nothng but facts, MY expirences with MY car, not some " guy who posted his time slip" my point is still valid. see if you can grasp this concept, here is the fact you crave so much:

THE DIFFERNCE BETWEEN A STOCK SL55 AND STOCK SL600 IN A DRAG RACE IS SO MINIMAL OTHER FACTORS SUCH AS THE DRIVER WILL COME INTO PLAY BEFORE THE MINIMAL HP AND HP TO WEIGHT DIFFERENCES DO.

STOP TALKIGN ABOUT CL'S WE ARE TALKING ABOUT STOCK SL55'S AND 600'S HERE.

FormulaZR

Let me correct you here...YOU are the ONLY one talking about stock SL's here. You've managed to get this thread rediculously SO far off topic. Nobody but you cares what a stock SL55 vs a stock SL600 would do. It's been proven, several times, that the 600 will win...you just choose not to believe it because it wasn't vs your car. Also, I believe C&D recorded 11.9 @ 120 with a stock SL600...I don't know the details of that pass as there is no timeslip; but I haven't seen your slip either.

One of my main points earlier was a tune only SL55 WILL lose to a tune only SL600, or anything other 600 for that matter. That is relevant to the original topic, it clearly demonstrates another reason why turbocharging is generally superior to a roots blower. If you uncork both cars to produce the power they are ALREADY capable of, but are limited based on tune, then the 55's don't have a leg to stand on. That is fact, you not liking it or coming up with an alternate reality of your own doesn't change it.

Now, if you have something relevant to the Roots vs Centrifugal vs Turbo discussion, then by all means post it...but if not, pipe down or start your own thread.

GFEAR

You enjoy your life. you are the fastest thign on the internet. you keep racing your keyboard and other peoplec cars in your mind, i'll keep racing my car.

we can talk theory all day, the same motor with a turbo will always make more hp than the same boost with a supercharger, we all know that. you guys think that the v12 is SO MUCH FASTER than ths 55's and my point is that it isnt.
I concede th epoint a tunes 65 or 600 willbeat a 55, everyone knows that, the tt has more potential for sure, but that wasnt the point.

FormulaZR

BUT, the original topic here was that his buddy thinks a turbo is better, and the OP thought a supercharger (roots, in this case) was better. He was requesting information in which to debate or concede. Also, the turbo car in question was a Nissan...so this thread didn't start out as 600 vs 55 as you seem to think it did. But, comparing the 55 to the 600 proves my point...stock for stock is not really a valid comparison in this case because the 600 was hamstrung from MB. But, tuned vs tuned illustrates what I'm trying to prove here...that turbos offer much more tunability regarding power, driveability, and powerband than a roots pump; especially when you factor in that the turbo car requires only software changes and NO parts need to be changed. With a turbo car you can have the best of both worlds (especially with a standalone boost controller); a supercharger requires separate tuning and different parts to even come close.

GFEAR

MY POST WAS IN RESPONSE TO THIS :
So what are the advantages of a 55 to a 600/65 if any? besides the weight and cost (well not really cause a 600 and 55 used are around the same market point)...

there has to be some advantages to the 55 or SC setup...assuming that no lag is there in either setup...SC in the 55 vs. small quick spool turbos in the 600/65

Thats where it turned 55 vs 600, i didnt do it like you claim

FormulaZR

You still have to admit though, that comparing stock for stock in this case isn't a valid comparison. We all know the 55 is tuned from AMG closer to its peak potential than the 600 is from MB. A car that was factory limited vs a car with an aggressive factory tune isn't apples to apples when you are talking potential...especially when it's the turbo car that was limited!

sound 8

Clarkson on Top Gear said it takes 100 bhp to turn a supercharger.
I prefer turbo's as they give a bigger rush of power, the supercharger feels
more like naturally aspirated, even if there the same power.

FormulaZR

Really depends on the supercharger there...the smaller superchargers don't require anywhere near 100 hp to turn. If they did, the Mini Cooper S for instance would be better off without FI.

sound 8

Sure, he was referring to either the Jaguar XKR or the SL55, his guest had
the Jag and he had the SL55. They also differ, the way they work, I think he said his was a screw, I can, remember what the Jag was.

JAYCL600

no one keeps their car stock these days anyways so this "argument" is moot, as well the term "stock" is relative.....

GFEAR

The only results i can find comparing a 55 and 600 same driver same conditions.

both cars identical 0-60, the 600 slightly faster 60 to 120mph, the 55 better braking and faster slalom time. just as i expected. there is the differences for you.

Sunir

That was my post I was curious about the sl55 vs. the 600 and the 65...it's from a conversation I had with Jay over the weekend, it was just a discussion we had that's all. Didn't mean to get this whole thing off kilter or cause any ill feelings...

GFEAR

ohh dont be crazy, 85% of these cars are kept bone stock as far as performance goes.

GFEAR

who's got ill feelings?

JAYCL600

i try not to be crazy but man it takes effort sometimes. I look at realistic statistics...and thats the people I encounter here daily on MBWorld as well as in "real life"...and id say 85%+ of those peoples cars are modified, most heavily.

GFEAR

Maybe the majority of the cars on here, are modified, but there is no way the majority of the cars out there are modified. I have made my living in the automotive performance aftermarket for 14 years now, and believe me, its not even close to half and half, it just doesnt work that way.

JAYCL600

I agree but thats not what I said. I said the majority of Benz owners that I know.

Thericker

Oh O.K. open n' shut case then It must really get your panties in a bunch that your 55 isn't the king of the road as you'd like to imagine? You could use DR's on your SL55 as others have in the Dragtimes examples, hell even w/ECU/TCU & Drag Rad's your SL55's NOT running 11.9x ET's you'd need to add a pulley to that list...

P.S. Cat-back mufflers do Zero-Zip-Nada towards HP/TQ gains, though you should know this considering your mighty credentials LoL! Know this 40-50 more RWHP & 100 more RWTO in nearly equal curb weight SL600 will put you in high heels 24/7/365 on any road/track. Also the difference becomes more apparent @ speed, say you're on the frwy & want to pass a (4) door S600? Not gonna happen if the S600 owner isn't feeling courteous.

I added the CL600/S600 models to this infantile discussion w/you due to lack of lighter STOCK SL600's having actual Dragtimes data I.E. Slip/track info etc... Point being ALL records show heavier S600/CL600 handily beat similarly modded or STOCK SL55 dwn the 1/4 in (1) case by up to half a sec or 5+ lengths.

Did you find that 1/4 mi slip w/your 113.9 Trap in 90 deg Tropcial Thunder heat? Maybe after you figure out how to type w/OUT USING ALL CAPS? You can focus your attention on finding it, instead of being a hypocrite citing other viable data posted in this thread as bogus?

You should go to Lens Crafters & have your peepers chk'd I've never seen this Uber rare SL66 that you keep mentioning, & if you beat it? No doubt (1) of your infamous Miami/FLA Posers in action sportin' a tricked out SL500 w/K&N's

GFEAR

Yes in the circle of benz owners in the more money than brains club( im including mysefl) we tend to modify our cars, but the VAST majority of sl's and cl's remain bone stock

GFEAR

it was a typo jackass. let the 66 go. i type in caps alot because my work software is 100% caps and I forget to turn it off sometimes. if you dont like it, i dont really care.

yes i did find my time slip.


who said i thought my car was king of the road? its not even in the top ten fastest cars i have owned. its not eveninthe top 3 now. i drive this car because its comfortable, roomy and has enough power i dont get bored and i like convertables.

you got some sort of ***** size issue that you gotta have the bigest fasted car bla bla bla. they are all the ****in same man, you are making a huge deal about tenths. and im not going to put drag radials on my car, know why? its not a damn race car! i will probably never run the car again, i have actual race cars for that. sorry that i let the car out of the bag your big bad v12 isnt any better than my little ittle v8.