Reddawgy

Help,

I really appreciate the feedback, and the congrats noted in my first post here.

I want to start this post because the same people who were so happy for me yesterday (work and home), are all doom and gloom about cost to own today.

I checked with my local, reputable shop, the owner, on taking care of the 65, he assured me they could and they do maint and repairs on many auto's including german. I got price and availability on a few things like tune up, brakes, oil change and while front rotors are $1000 in any book, a standard brake job without rotors from him, no biggie. OK, if the ABC fails it may be a problem, but i see fixes posted here. One reason i am buying a MB is because of quality. You get what you pay for: John deere versus Case, Peterbuilt versus Ford, Bayliner versus Chris Craft, no offense to anyone. I understand things cost more and there are more things to break on the 65, but i don't expect them to break. In all my years i don't expect newer cars to break, and they haven't generally. They wear, I expect maint, but i would hope a car selling for close to $200k new would not be prone to breaking!

Tires every 20-30k
Oil changes and lube/maint every 3-5k
brakes every 20-30, rotors every 40-50k
cooling flush anualy,
wipers, filters as needed.
Lotsa gas

after 100k i would expect some moving part wear/failure, turbo maybe, exhaust but not in Portland OR so much. I only use dealer shops when under warranty, otherwise i use a good local shop. Dealers are great, but the most expensive and mine is an hour away. I will look into a warranty and have read some on here. I need to check with the local MB dealer and my local shop about warranty acceptance, recommendation...

So thats what i expect. Did i miss a page?

Am i deluded?

HELP!

Whats your reliability per miles driven been like???

Quadcammer

yeah, if you expect it not to break cause it was expensive originally, you're going to be in for some unpleasant surprises.

alx

you will blow up a valve block or two. same applies to a shock or two. and a tandem pump. or two.

the vario roof will act up. all bushings on the back will go (they are actually prolly gone already at 40k). radius arm bushings on the front will go (if not gone already). a coil pack or two will go.

if this is too dry for you add industrial amounts of pentosin chf 11 to lube the rearending that the abc will arrange for you.

other than that- the v12 tt cars are awesome. when they work

welcome to the club

Reddawgy

I don't see the humor, lol. I know some of what could go wrong and actually priced coil packs before i jumped in. I hated to, but a call to MB and yes Timmy, you can get an extended warranty, probably, for many many dollars. Whatever.

and yes i know things break. I am just saying, i have not broken much on cars in the past and this should be ...better. Stronger and heavier that. I might expect a front end bushing, i haven't had to replace a coil in decades, i know, don't say it. And i searched this forum for ABC and suspension before i decided on the 65 and there are not that many posts.

So pretty reliable huh?

falconsprint

If a part is unique to the 65 than expect it will be significantly higher priced than the equivalent part on a V8 car (MB luxury tax). Repairs in the engine compartment can take significantly longer due to the limited space to work. It took the tech at my MB service department a day and a half to replace the leaking tandem pump and rodeo my car (at 19,000 miles under warranty).

Don’t forget you’ll need 24 new spark plugs at 50-60K miles. Intercoolors and coil packs have to come off first. Intercoolors have to be bled for at least an hour afterwards.

I’m not forecasting doom and gloom, nothing will break that can’t be fixed. I just saying you have to expect repairs to cost more than a V8, in some cases significantly more. I also think your mechanic might be optimistic about what he can handle if he has never worked on a M275 or a MB with ABC before. My service department only has one tech that’s been officially trained for the M275.

Vabene7

I've got to agree with these guys..... No doom and gloom..... You will be in love with you're car, as I am/we are, but you must expect the items listed and then some. These high end cars are expensive, but prone to certain, common issues. I knew those facts going in when I purchased my 05 S600. I have made a bunch of repairs but if I had to do it all over again, I would buy my 600 again in a heartbeat.

-Chris

Reddawgy

I have had a lot of cars and trucks, many performance, a couple mark 8's when they were hot, a few supercharged lightnings new, i have 350z now i bought new and it has 166k miles, a new vette in 2005 and other than a couple minor things when new, no major breakdowns or failures.
I know this is complex machine, but for $180k plus new i would not expect all the very expensive and it seems common problems reported. I can afford the and maint, and the occ little problem, but from a third party perspective you all make these cars sound prone to major breakdowns. I can't afford a car thats not at the least reliable.

Looks like i'll cancel my deal and look for a car that doesn't have major breakdowns all the time. If the price of admission is 5-10k a year for breakage maybe that is too steep for me. While I can afford it, its just silly.

I can't express how very very disappointed i am. Thanks for the heads up i guess.

Benz-O-Rama

As long as you're comfortable budgeting 3-4 grand a year for maintenance and repair, don't cancel the deal.

You like to keep mentioning the MSRP on the SL65, in relation to perceived lack of unexpected repair costs. Thats a huge mistake. Yes, the car was very expensive when it was new. But as the cost of initial investment drops on these cars, the maintenance and repair costs are still based on its original MSRP.

I bought mine with 11k miles on it, and anyone that has seen it, will confirm that it's a cream puff at it's current 44k miles. I do track the car, but I've had exactly zero problems with the drivetrain. But, in my 33k miles of ownership, the car has had over $10K in repairs, and that's without a single ABC problem.

Mostly Vario roof stuff. Hell, it was 2 grand for a passenger xenon ballast control module swap. Another 2 grand for the Vario roof pump. $1200 for intercooler pump and ABC flush.

I'd call my car reliable. It's never left me stranded, other than when the roof pump broke, while it was closing. But again, trying to direclty correlate the car's window sticker, with perceived lack of repair costs, is setting yourself up for a huge dissapointment in ownership experience.

sf65

Reddawgy, I'm with Benz-O-Rama.

Two years of ownership going from 25K miles to 35K, spend few grand/yr at the stealership on few relatively small things but MB parts and dealership labour is expensive. Some of that work an indy could've done but I didn't want to take the risk. You don't want inexperienced people touching many parts of the car.

If you look at forums here you'd see that real major problems (as in $7K-15K jobs) are very rare to non-existant, but with so many expensive low volume parts and age stuff can happen.

For a 7yo car overall build quality is still incredibly strong. I love mine and toying with keeping it forever but have to wonder what will happen in say, 2015?

You didn't say how many previous owners and whether they leased the vehicle, age of driver, etc..

allenjdmb

When I had my SL65 last year, I was bound and determined to own one. I did my homework and got an exceptionally nice one. But I spent nearly every mile listening for a funny noise, watching the gauges (not much help) , and making sure the suspension height was all good. For some reason, I never felt that way about any of the 55's I had. I suppose that really didn't make good sense, in retrospect. But some problems on the 65 are in fact exponentially more expensive than those on the 55. In retrospect, I should have enjoyed it more and worried less. My fault for jumping in the deepest end of the pool without thinking.
BTW, if you think that a big msrp is a predictor of reliability, then you are right---but you have it backwards. Generally, the more dollars, the less reliability. I wouldn't buy any late model performance car without realizing they are incredibly complex....and that means a relationship with a good tech/shop.

abiazis

SEARCH FOR PREVIOUS "Annual maintenance costs SL 65 AMG" THREAD

"If you care to post your annual maintenance expenses for comparison/tracking on your 65 or 55:

Tracking my expenses for maintenance the last three years on my 2005 SL65 with 43K:

It is a second car driven 5,000 miles a year....insurance is $ 1,000 a year....

2009 - Brake pads/fluid change - 1,000, spring link bushings replace- $ 800, suspension TSB issue - $ 200, oil change $ 150;
TOTAL = $ 2,150

2010 - Wipers - $ 45, Front Rotors $ 1500, oil change - $ 150, suspension TSB - Service Bulletin (suspension squeak) $ 200;
TOTAL = $ 1,895

2011 - Warranty deductible (ignition module replacement)- $ 200,
Oil change - $ 150, brake fluid change and transmission service - $ 300, trunk struts $ 65, new plugs/MAP sensor - cracked - $ 600; new starter battery $ 110; new tires - $ 1,100;
TOTAL = $ 3,625.00

So.....it looks like maintenance averages about $ 2,800 a year with warranty covering another $ 1,100 for ignition module work........"

Quadcammer

These are not major breakdowns, and thats kinda the point. You will get a misfire...in your Mark 8 or Corvette, thats an $85 coil and you're on your way. On a V12 twin turbo flagship mercedes, its $1200. Is it logical that the MB part costs about 15 times as much? of course not...but it does.

you are trying to use logic here...and with high end cars, its not about logic. The buyer of a new Sl65 probably lost $100k in value within 3 years? Think about the people who pay $40k to restore a Ferrari 308 thats worth maybe $50k in good condition. You pay these insane repair costs because you love it.

maybe you get a car that needs nearly nothing, and maybe you get one that costs you $10k per year. You just don't know.

The point is that if you can't pay the repair costs (which could be huge) and smile, the car is not worth it, because you will grow to resent it.

alx

very nicely put oliver

carlsturm

my former car was a V10 M5 which I kept past warranty period and paid grandly for some costly repairs. this prompted me to buy my SL65 as a CPO vehicle with extended warranty. I'm a relative newbie compared with others on this forum...but my researched opinion is the two more costly repairs are with ABC and retractable roof.

IMHO the 6.2L V12 bi-turbo motor is a conservatively engineered platform with power coming at low RPM and the engine is not pushed to it's limits to create the power as compared to high-strung motors like the BMW V10 M5 and many of Honda's naturally aspirated VTEC motors.

Buy an extended warranty.

Quadcammer

Is it high strung, revs wise? no.

But...the bloody car runs 22psi in stock form. Thats its own form of stress.

The bottom ends on the v12s are not the issue. its the electronics, and on rare occasion, the turbos.

then again, new motor mounts require you to drop the engine or at least finagle with it for hours, so just the packaging makes things more expensive/difficult.

abiazis

Is failure of V-12 mounts typical at a certain mileage? Guess it may depend on your foot....I have heard some reports but very little.... Cost with labor?

I heard the retractable roof was pretty bulletproof for Mercedes in general and actual number of incidences is relatively low........a cabrio top issue on an older Porsche is a nightmare compared to MB...I guess if it happens to you, it is a bear.......

AMGSport

Generally speaking, the AMG motors are engineered to manage MORE horsepower than what comes stock from the factory, while the M Gruppe builds motors closer to their failure threshold...so I'm told. I will say that I went with a 55 due to the interchangeability of parts with other 55's; I understand the SL65 to have some truly bespoke parts and service regimens that you pay dearly for.

Quadcammer

Meh, most v8+ motor mounts are shot at 60-75k miles. For the v12, you are probably looking at $1500-$2k for motor mounts, depending on who you use.

Btw, welcome to the MB forum. perhaps rennlist got boring?

coughquadcammercough

abiazis

Thanks for info on pricing, etc...........

I bounce back and forth from Rennlist/MBWorld/Benz World/AMG Private lounge/M5Board and 6 speedonline......

Prices are amazing......I remember changing the mounts on my 1968 390 Ford XL with 375 horses with a jack, a piece of wood for supporting the engine on the oil pan to lift the engine up out of the way and remember paying about $ 25.00 at the most for the one mount that broke.......that was back in college doing the repair in the street......time flies.....

NCE500

You have heard just about everything pertaining to maintenance needs and associated expenses from our well heeled owner contingent.

The V12 cars are absolutely awesome, but they were expensive new, are complex, and remain proportionately expensive to maintain.

I've had mine since January 2010, just turned 29K miles yesterday. Have replaced what has failed or needed to be maintained over the past 2 years as things occured. Total warranty tab to date is right around $10K, maintenance (my tab) probably another $2.5K. Like others have said, my car is quite reliable and looks/runs like new in every way. Best car I have owned to date.

The best advice I offer to enhance your ownership experience is to buy a warranty. A warranty will cost you some dough, but it will be money well spent and will repay itself. I don't know who is selling V12 warrantees these days, but I'd check with Bruce at Beck's Imports, who has sold many to forum members, if anyone knows what is available, it will be Bruce.

Enjoy the car, and post some pics when you get it!

abiazis

My warranty is Easy Care.They cover most major stuff.......cost me $ 3,000 for 40,000 miles and 4 years.....from MB dealer...

Reddawgy

I appreciate the feedback. Based on repairs and maint averaging 2k a year, i have no problem. That 10k warranty bill is concerning. That comes out to 6k a year without warranty, that is an issue. MB here says they won't warranty a 2005. I'll buy a warranty if i can find a good one at a reasonable price. The prices noted here seem reasonable.

Anybody want to sell me a warranty? If not I will look into Easy Care or maybe Bruce. I actually killed my purchase based on the posts here, particularly the first couple. I can most likely redo my deal. I have an airline ticket to go get car, i'd hate to waste that, lol. Surprisingly there is another '05 within an hour of the first car, same miles. I have been in contact by e-mail, now I will call and see. He said his car was MB certified, so...

You all have made me feel more comfy with the decision, if i can get a warranty.

Anybody got a great 2005 they want to sell? It has to be cheap though, because the cars are so dang expensive to maintain

abiazis

Go drive them both to compare and pay particular attention to the braking smoothness and look over all service and have a dealer run the VINs for any service done on the car.......Car fax also..less owners the best, but not always the rule.......good luck.....

carlsturm

The engine was designed & built to run with 22psi -- I wouldn't consider it a point of failure to be concerned about.

Quadcammer

This is spoken like someone with very little experience with forced induction.

A car running that much boost needs to be on point mechanically and electronically (i.e the tune). All it takes is a few seconds of a lean condition to absolutely melt a piston. Even with knock sensors, one thing goes wrong and you are looking at a rebuild.

As these cars age and maintenance can become an unknown, the risks of failure go up substantially.