I will be buying a BMW...
Super Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 974
Likes: 1
From: fremont, ca
04 E55
Originally Posted by amg55
Let's agree on one thing in the arena of opinions about BMW styling: the majority of car magazine writers (who have always been heavily biased in favor of BMW in almost every way) have criticized BMW harshly for the Bangle designs.
Sure, there will be many buyers who will like them. Everyone's taste is different. taste is not an objective entity.
But BMW's most visible supporters---the car mag writers---have sent a message.
I was at my wife's BMW dealer last week and he very apologetically admitted that BMW has internally acknowledged that they moved in the wrong direction on many of their designs. The 7 series was the worst offender (his statement, not mine).
An aside: European opinions about the Bangle designs have been at odds with general US opinions according to many people. Fewer complaints 'across the pond'.
Sure, there will be many buyers who will like them. Everyone's taste is different. taste is not an objective entity.
But BMW's most visible supporters---the car mag writers---have sent a message.
I was at my wife's BMW dealer last week and he very apologetically admitted that BMW has internally acknowledged that they moved in the wrong direction on many of their designs. The 7 series was the worst offender (his statement, not mine).
An aside: European opinions about the Bangle designs have been at odds with general US opinions according to many people. Fewer complaints 'across the pond'.
BMW sales are also up world wide. Yes, i know the US magazine writter (notably C&D) have killed BMW on new designs. To some extent I agree, but like majority of BMW current customer base, I really do like some of them.
Anyway taste is a personal thing.
Super Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 974
Likes: 1
From: fremont, ca
04 E55
Originally Posted by shoes
I can understand why BMW's sales are up for now- I have purchased three in the last 12 months. But I hated all three of them, sold them and won't buy again. I think it will take time for people to have experience with the new models, decide they don't like them and the brand's image will be tarnished and then sales will fall.
In addition, if people are dumping BMW left and right their residue value would suffer a great deal. But the truth is that the E now has far worse residual value than E60.
Again reality is different from your perception.
I am probably going to dump both W211 very soon. So by your logic, i can now claim that mercedes design is going to the wrong trend. Sales are up because I bought many cars and sold them again and will not buy again.
All of your logic will fit my case very shortly. Do you think I am going to say Mercedes Sales are up because of me?
Sometimes reading the post on this forum is very amusing. The logic presented is just out of this world.
Super Member
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 791
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From: Monroe, Louisiana
SL 65 AMG and E63s AMG
I've owned numerous BMW and Mercs and I think basically think both are living on their previous reputations. I love my E55 and I think that it is an exception in the MB lineup.
My folks just traded a 2001 S430 and I think they were dissappointed in the car. They owned 4 S models before this and kept all for 6+ years (an eternity for my Dad who traded every 2 years for my whole life). I think he felt that it was a step backward compared to previous versions.
My first MB was a 400E which was possibly the most fantastic road car that I have ever had. I loved the suspension although it was a bit heavy compared to today's fare. It was the last of a long line of similar Benzs.
In the 80's and 90's BMWs were the best handling cars on the market but they have always lacked the glisteny smoothness of the Benz. Interiors were OK but again IMO could not compare to the MB.
W211 is a competent car but MB made a lot of compromises to reduce to price. The electronics are a laugh. Cadillac and Lincoln are far superior. For that matter Chrysler is significantly better in regard to software glitches and electronic creature comforts. IMO I prefered the coil springs i my W210 to the air suspension in my E55. I think the W210 E55 suspension could have been tweaked to quicken the steering ratio and this would be superior to the airmatic.
Bangled BMWs are hideous and I don't like the way they drive. They feel really heavy and slow. Ponderous. They may be able to out handle the E at the limits but they still lack that nimbleness that they used to have. There are significant quality control/design problems with the newer BMW motors. My niece traded their 745i and they couldn't wait. They hated the car. The car was in the shop for 6 weeks getting a new motor after 12k miles. They got a Ford. I had 3 motors in my M3 before it was traded back to BMW.
My point is that the German manufacturers are all having growing pains. I have no doubt that all will get thru it just fine. The good thing is that all cars are light years better than they were in the bad old 70s. I guess we're all spoiled.
My folks just traded a 2001 S430 and I think they were dissappointed in the car. They owned 4 S models before this and kept all for 6+ years (an eternity for my Dad who traded every 2 years for my whole life). I think he felt that it was a step backward compared to previous versions.
My first MB was a 400E which was possibly the most fantastic road car that I have ever had. I loved the suspension although it was a bit heavy compared to today's fare. It was the last of a long line of similar Benzs.
In the 80's and 90's BMWs were the best handling cars on the market but they have always lacked the glisteny smoothness of the Benz. Interiors were OK but again IMO could not compare to the MB.
W211 is a competent car but MB made a lot of compromises to reduce to price. The electronics are a laugh. Cadillac and Lincoln are far superior. For that matter Chrysler is significantly better in regard to software glitches and electronic creature comforts. IMO I prefered the coil springs i my W210 to the air suspension in my E55. I think the W210 E55 suspension could have been tweaked to quicken the steering ratio and this would be superior to the airmatic.
Bangled BMWs are hideous and I don't like the way they drive. They feel really heavy and slow. Ponderous. They may be able to out handle the E at the limits but they still lack that nimbleness that they used to have. There are significant quality control/design problems with the newer BMW motors. My niece traded their 745i and they couldn't wait. They hated the car. The car was in the shop for 6 weeks getting a new motor after 12k miles. They got a Ford. I had 3 motors in my M3 before it was traded back to BMW.
My point is that the German manufacturers are all having growing pains. I have no doubt that all will get thru it just fine. The good thing is that all cars are light years better than they were in the bad old 70s. I guess we're all spoiled.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,149
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From: NW Ohio
2008 335 vert, 2004 MDX
As a current E39 owner and soon to be W211 owner (bye bye BMW), I would love to know what percentage of BMW sales are to repeat customers and what percentage is to new customers. Increasing BMW sales does not necessarily mean they are retaining their base. I wonder if the new designs are lost on previous owners, like me, yet play better with people new to BMW. If you could change your product knowing for every customer you lose, you are going to gain 1.2 more, wouldn't you do it?
Super Member
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 587
Likes: 1
From: New Jersey
2005 E55 Delivered 01/07/05
Originally Posted by neutronium
Add me to the list...
We've owned several BMWs -- and still have an X5
I was looking at both the M5 and the E55. When I saw the first pictures of the new M5 my wife and I looked at each other and walked to the MB dealer and bought our Silver E55.
We love the E55...and still shudder at the new BMWs
We've owned several BMWs -- and still have an X5
I was looking at both the M5 and the E55. When I saw the first pictures of the new M5 my wife and I looked at each other and walked to the MB dealer and bought our Silver E55.
We love the E55...and still shudder at the new BMWs
Happy Motoring,
MBH
2005 E55
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,882
Likes: 1,212
From: In my garage
E55, GLS450, GL63, GLE350
if that was the case, the sales figure would already been dropping. The 7 has been out for 3 years, the 5 has been out for 2 years. The sales are increasing.
7 Series sales totaled 1,137 units in November, a 51.6% fall from the 2,349 units sold in November, 2003. Sales for the first 11 months of 2004 totaled 14,579 units which was a 22.9% decrease from the 18,910 7 Series sold during the first 11 months of last year.
5 series sales are down too!
Source: http://privacy.autospies.com/images/...roup_Sales.pdf
