krispykrme

Wait a second. This is an insult? Look at majority of the post here. Anyone that has good thing to say about M5 are insulted like there is no tomorrow. BY YOUR STANDARD, YOU AND HOST OF OTHERS SHOULD HAVE BEEN BANNED YEARS AGO.

So where did he said American learning a foreign language is a loser? All he said that learning french/german is easy to lose the American accent.

CAN YOU BOTHER TO READ?

BlownV8

Lots of quotes on 0 - whatever but then says that there were no runs from a dead stop. WTF! That's not 0 - whatever it's whatever to whatever. Let's get the facts straight!

Gustav

Actually my point was that it is not easy to loose an accent whether you are Swedish or American learnign a foreignt language...

krispykrme

sorry. I guess i need to take english classes as well.

It's really pointless to talk about M5 on this board vs E55. Every time this threads turns into immature behavior. For the past year and half since i owned my E55 and join this community, it's more than clear that E55 on this forum is a god. Like all god, it must be treated with blind faith and all must accept the "truth" and bow to it. Anyone who disagree is heresy and must be killed in a witch hunt.

The behavior on this forum is like the salem witch hunt or the dark age.

TMC M5

Honestly though... I can't imagine that the new E60 M5 will be faster accelerating in the 1/4 mile than the E55. The E55's torque advantage is huge. I have always said that the Gallardo is the car that closely approximates the M5's engine/drivetrain. The M5 does not have the Gallardo's all-wheel drive, nor the lighter weight. There is no way it will exceed the Gallardo's performance.

More important than the speed aspect, the E55 is so much better looking...it really makes the whole question moot. I prefer my cars to be both fast and beautiful. Something that can not be said of the E60 M5. Yes, I do currently have an E39 M5. However, my next purchase will most likely be either an E55 or Maserati GranSport. We'll see.

Tom

wolverine

Well, check out the quote from a MB fan that was there:


"I certainly dont think im biased to bmw since I drive a C32, RS4 and RS6.
I understand that most have trouble beliving or trusting a moderator for a M5 enthusiast board, but I was at this event to.
I saw the M5 win time after time against the E55, and run tie with the gallardo for atleast 5 rounds.
They tried 0-250km/h races, 50-250, 50-200, 100-250 etc, so the results wasnt the one lucky race kind either.

The E55s only made a few rounds each, 3-6 or something, and the M5 was going back and forth, full throttle the whole day, stuffed with ppl that wanted to experience it. (Me for example).
Atleast one E55 had new tires, and the M5 didnt have any at all (the first thing I noticed when having a closer look at the car in the lineup before we started).

I was so impressed by the performance of this car that I can't even pretend that a E55 is faster in any direction or speed, even though I am a mercedes owner and fan. There was atleast as much difference at 200km/h between the M5 and E55 as there was between my stock C32 and the E55.

If you read my post at the m5board, I tell about the ride in the M5, and this is proabably what pisses MB fans off the most, or scares the MB bosses; the M5 was up to E55 comfort and luxury standars in comfort mode.
And Still, it has handling similar to the 996 turbo. All this in just the push of a button.

Remeber that the M5 was realased after the E55, and the car is also a flagship for bmw, if it would be slower than the E55, BMW would have completely failed. "

I don't really see what is so surprising, the M5 has always been 'the ultimate sports sedan', so as said above, it really HAS to be faster than the 3 year old E55. I'm sure the upcoming E65 will be faster than the M5, so we'll see a new M5...and so on.

Also, engine torque doesn't determine acelleration, it's hp/weight ratio and gearing, both areas where the M5 is superior.

Bilal

WOW, first it used to be light to light with actual cars (M vs AMG), now we have internet forums vs internet forums! Keep it up guys this is really spirited stuff!

and to quote Norb and shut you biatches all up:

"Its all about the torque anyway"

BMWEATR

yup! a roll on wowowowowowowoowowwweeeeeeeeeeee

lets roll it on boys!
I think they were roll'n one up!!!!

BMWEATR

blown v-8 drinks and lap dances are on me buddy! well said.

Porsche Guy

First off I want to say that I'm impartial between the MB and BMW, I like Porsche and have a 996 C4S. Obviously this board is a MB board so most of you are going to be undoubtedly bias towards MB, evident in many of your strong disapproval aimed at anyone supporting the idea the M5 may be superior to the E55 and your apparent discontent for Gustav and the M5 board. Anyways, enough with my intro, as you're probably getting ready to rip me to shreds or label me a troll but I don't really have any control over that. There are super bias people in every thread and for every manufacturer.

What do I have to say? First off, I think many of you need to be open to the fact that the M5 is more than likely going to be a superior car to the E55. It's not because it's a BMW, an M car or any of that cr@p. Look at it this way. It's more powerful, lighter, has a super sophisticated 7 gear transmition, which probably accounts for it's faster acceleration at most speeds, and has a lot more development time behind it than the E55. I'm not saying that the E55 is a dull or shabby car. Quite the contrary, it's fast as hell and an awesome feat of engineering. But like computers, the new model is pretty much always faster than the one that preceded it. It's also doubtful that BMW and M would want to build an M car, especially one with as much history as the M5, to be beaten in any aspect by a car that has already been on the market for some time. On that note, I end my post, looking forward to the E63 or whatever it is that AMG is going pull out to surpass the M5.

SoulBladeZA

I read these forums as much as I read M5board, yet I post less here because there seems to be alot of kiddies trolling on here, while I have only ever twice picked one up on the M5board. But nevermind that. Currently in my garage : A SLK 55 AMG and a BMW 645Ci until the ///M5 comes. Will post pictures if anyone suspects trolling. Now on to the pleasantries.

Yes the E55 AMG is blisteringly fast, and 700nm of torque is alot, but look at this way. How much of that is actually motivating the tar under the wheels to melt? Quite a bit of it is lost due to the gearbox, powertrain losses and the ever-intruding traction control. Now on to my next point - whoever thinks the M5 is torque-less needs to read more magazine comparisons. 520nm is ALOT, even if it seems dwarfed by the E55. Yes it's made at 6100 rpm, but alot of it is already available at low revs.

This is where the SMG and launch control comes in. The car is launched at at 4400 rpm. That's near max torque already, near 90% of it. Most of that power goes to the ground with just enough wheelspin, giving it it's impressive acceleration numbers. The E55 by my guesstimate propably doesn't put much more to the ground, especially considering the M5's brilliant LSD. Now the M5 shifts faster and pulls VERY hard through the gears. Different philosophies, near same effect. Even if the M5 wins by just 1 car length to say 100km/h, it's still the faster car.

All I'm saying is this : the E55 is an amazing car and has become the new super saloon benchmark, until recently when most magazines crowned the E60 M5 the new king again, especially out of a driver's point of view. I'm sure the next E AMG will make sure the M5 gets dethroned again. Why there has to be such an aura of immaturity is beyond me. The E55 still remains the choice for effortless cruising, and the M5 the enthusiast's choice. This to me is perfect, freedom of choice and all. Why can't we all just sit around a fire and have a few beers like adults

BlownV8

It's a shame that you will be voiding your BMW warranty by launching the car at 4,400 rpm. I've read that the M5 can only be launched like this for 4 to 5 runs before the tranny clutch disks need attention and your warranty becomes void. That's why they were doing rolling acceleration numbers.

E55AMG99

Well said. However, make mine a bottle or two of that great South African Cabernet that is so hard to get in the USA. Bring that and I'm IN!

wolverine

Not sure where you got that information, but I don't think it's correct. Where did you read this?

SoulBladeZA

Doesn't matter really. You can still launch the car the same way a E55 diver would launch his car, with left foot braking. I'm sure this will be prefarable in the rain. The V10 engine in the M5 doesn't have a lack of pulling power down low, contrary to what people who only want to criticise the car believe. You can simply turn the traction control off (or even on or partially on for wet conditions), rev it slighty, same as an E55 driver would, and let go of the brake pedal. There have been sub 5 second times recorded without using launch control, in the wet no doubt, E55 was tested by Sport Auto at 4,9 0-100.

So I still don't see a problem for the robot racers. The car has the weight advantage too, so I'm sure it'd be able to match or nearly match the E55 0-100, after that the M5 will fly away anyway. Glad to see we can still have mature conversation

E55AMG99

I heard something a little different. The clutch system is not covered under warranty for wear and that repeated use of the launch control will wear the clutches "prematurely". Isn't the SMG clutch system in the M3 also not covered for wear?

M&M

Well BlownV8 actually you don't void your warranty. But if it makes you happy to hear that then knock yourself out.

SoulBlade, good post.

Now I have a question. If car A has more horsepower than car B, weighs less, has shorter gearing, incurs less drivetrain loss due to manual gearbox/LSD, is it not beyond the realms of possibility that car A might be faster than car B. I know I'm going out on a limb here & Sir Isaac Newton is probably rolling in his grave at my thoughts but hear me out.

It is a fact that a slushbox with torque convertor saps more power than a manual. It is a fact that shorter gearing gets more power to the wheels as it multiplies the torque by a larger amount. It is also a fact that horsepower, BY DEFINITION, is the rate at which torque is delivered. So if you have less torque, but deliver it faster (like say at 9000rpm) you will have more HP.

Not that 520NM is inadequate in the torque department. With the right gearing & high redline 520NM is more than enought torque. Not to mention the fact that the M5 is a few hundred pounds LIGHTER than the E55. So you need less torque to start of with.

Then there's the fact that when racing you need to compare the last 2000rpm of each car. You get a dyno of the M5 look at the 7000-9000rpm RWHP figures. THen you get an E55 & look at the 5000-7000rpm figures (or whatever). Now you compare the RWHP & curves. Note the M5's power is rising while the E55's is dropping. I'll bet the M5 is making a good few more HP in the racing zone. Well each company has diverse philosophys in how to deliver power & AMG customers don't want to rev high, while ///M customers do.

But both cars have enough torque for relaxed driving at low rpm. So to the naysayers, I ask this. Did you pass physics class in college or what. More power, less weight mean anything to you?

SoulBladeZA

We have family in Stellenbosch (wine district near Cape Town) so we get a case or so every month! I'll be sure to bring one if we ever do have a nice bushveld evening social

As for the clutch warranty issues, I think we'd better ask one of the guys who already own a car as I've heard many conflicting stories and frankly I don't think BMW would like it if you wanted a clutch replacement after 500 launches They would propably not limit it to 10 or some other small number, seeing as they place great emphasis on it, especially at press days. I'm sure there is a limit however. Let's get someone in-the-know to shed some light.

M5KILLR

oh my god, now the blazers have mbzers against mbzers! youve posted 620 times and you dont know i kid???? isnt that obviously a rediculous assertion i made? i guess a sense of humor is needed here and that unfortuantely i cannot bestow upon anyone.

so, ill even give that if an m5 is faster its not faster than mine. YES GOD! I AM THE ULTIMATE HUMAN AS I HAVE THE FASTEST E55 AND ANYONE WHO DOUBTS ME IS STRICKEN TO HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!! dont care if mine is modded, what are you going to do to mod an m5, headers, high flow intake, exhaust (its got em) ecu? mbz retards theirs for drivability. youd think the bmr is cranked up anyway? so, mod for mod theres a lot more in ours and i appreciate the fact i can personlaize my car whereas every m5 will be just like every other m5 except cosmetics. SO DONT DISAGREE WITH ME AS I AM UNDISAGREEABLE!!!!!

E55AMG99

A case or so every month? I'm drooling!

Very true. I think BMW learned its PR lesson from all of the 10K mile clutches in the older M5 and brakes in the older 7 series. People were a little upset with the response "that's the way it is" from the dealers when their first oil change included a very expensive wear item as well.

It wold be nice to hear how the clutches hold up from abuse. I drive my cars fairly hard and reliabilty/repair costs are a huge consideration.

E55AMG99

WOW! Where can I get some of what you're on? Do you mind if I use that last statement? I'll give you credit of course.

M5KILLR

M&M it must be nice saying such reckless things here. douchstav would certainly ban you there so enjoy your freedom. the speedshift transmission shifts 35% faster than the regular unit and has lockup torque converter in gears 2-5 so no slushiness there huh mr. newton. what about this launch control question. is it designed to withstand 10, 50, 500? sounds like the m3 engine grenade problem in waiting to me. from every euro trash mag out there they have the 55's pulling high 12 low 13's in the 1/4 err.....0-250k what ever that is. yet real world performance and us mags are ALL low 12's. so all those mag tests seem strange to us, as does your post. the good thing about torque is smooth linear power delivery. you know like how all mx riders have gone to 4 strokes versus the revhappy 2 strokes. you can go faster and have better whole shots with more tq. if i wanted high hp with little tq i would have bought an s2000. and yes im going to try to avoid this thread now because the trolls are out in full force and we dont have the opportunity to reciprocate on douchtav's forum.

SoulBladeZA

We are wine lovers what can I say? :p

Same here. Would be VERY interested to see, the brakes too. Also I drive in alot of stop-and-go traffic, wonder how well the brakes and clutch will cope with that. Also, how comfortable the whole experience will be.

Excuse the spam, it's 1:24am here and I can't sleep due to the flu medication I'm on Strange, usually these types of medicine knock me out

It's nice almost having a real-time conversation though

M5KILLR

sure, i grow my own...um...sage that is! and use away. now make like a tree and scram!

E55AMG99

Wine lover too. So much so that I planted 1000 vines and opened a small winery! If you want to cure that cold, pop the cork on some Rustenberg, Rust en Verde or Thelema. Have a couple of glasses, relax and get some sleep.