DFW01E55

No other mods, 32k miles on a CL55.

Third gear pull shows an increase of 1 hp to 382 and 53 lbs of torque to 510.

Fourth must show a bit of heat soak, losing 6 hp to 387 and adding 21 lbs of torque to 468.

The tires spin and the back end wiggles at 40 mph on relatively new concrete, which should provide decent friction.

The higher boost is having a definite impact on heat, the local dealer may be able to understand the power loss now.

I'm open to diagnostic comments from those who feel qualified ... and those who don't too.

Thanks to Dan, Wade and Chris at HPP.

tigerlam92

You should read my post on my ASP installation and dyno.
- https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...ght=tigerlam92


I was also stating that the ASP may not be a direct bolt on and may cause some headache. You are experience what I had as well prior to my current fix. The main fix is probably that you have a very marginal or bad IC pump. Check your IAT temp and see if it is sky high. Even with a functional pump, the IAT will increase substantially with the ASP pulley.

good luck

DFW01E55

There's no doubt that the IC pump is bad. I explained the symptoms clearly to the dealer, but unless it throws a code, they won't do anything.

I will probably do some data logging tomorrow and I expect the IAT's to be 210+. I've seen those numbers before - during the 100+ degree days of summer.

stevebez

Max IAT's I have seen so far with 13C ambients (55F), is 65C (149F).

With ambients > 30C (86F) think its going to get marginal pretty quickly...

Car is '06 and has 4500 miles so doubt pump is dodgy ...

There is a crowd here called West Tuning who do a intercooler mod ... and trying to find out more about this mod from them ... once I hear from them I will report back.

SS3E55

Steve - Great! - as soon as you know more on the IC company (West Tuning) let me know as I have a similar (close to exact) feel to my ASP install that you described in the other thread.

Right now is cold here in New England (!) and I have no problems but in summer there might be an issue. Would want to look into the Johnson pump and a new/better IC radiator combo for then.

Steve have you looked at this yet...?
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/167492-larger-ic-heat-exchanger.html

P.S. I'm British by birth (but 25 years in USA now) and I'm in the UK a lot these days and could pick up my own if there are any export/import issues....

Mad TKD

I suggest going to a different dealer then. Tell them your car is cutting out on highway pulls. Mine was and they replaced the pump no problem. Your dyno definately shows a bad Pump

DFW01E55

Agreed on changing dealers, right now it's a convenience factor.

Is the pump/heat the reason for zero increase in hp?

skratch77

you will make some decent power up top once you fix your pump.Have you guys every tried this kit from AA tuning

http://www.aatuning.com/cooling/main.php

its a cheap water/alc injection and would def help you guys out

from the dyno the car is running so rich that it goes off the scale on that run

DFW01E55

I was told the dyno wouldn't measure below 10.
Could it be running as rich as a 4? I hope not.

SSM AMG

Did you put the car in dyno mode? If so, how?

DFW01E55

Dyno mode
To start, turn the ignition key to the first accessory position, making sure the dash display shows the odometer. The SRS airbag light should be on. Press the trip odometer reset button three times rapidly before it goes off. If you do this right, a screen will appear showing a voltmeter. Then press the "up" arrow on the left side of the wheel twice to take you to the "ESP dynamometer test" screen. Using the plus (+) button on the right side of the wheel, select "on." And then start the car. Warnings will appear informing you that the ESP, ABS, and BAS (brake assist) aids are now turned off and you're on your own.

If you did it right, you've put the car in a mode intended for diagnostic testing on a rolling dynamometer-all electronic supervision is unplugged. Unhindered by techno-aids, the SLK's grip on the skidpad improved by 0.03 g compared with simply hitting the ESP switch on the dash. To return all the safety technology, scroll back to the dyno test screen and select "w/t. 15 off" with the minus (-) button. Shutting off all the electronic aids isn't easy, and that should tell you something. Owners are not generally privy to the dynamometer mode; therefore, we will continue to publish test numbers attained with the dashboard ESP switch turned off. We just thought you'd want to know.

Vadim @ FD

DFW01E55:

To troubleshoot your problem you will need an access to a code scanner. If you have a laptop or a PDA, try www.nology.com. I have used them over a number of years with great sucess.

First, check for any troublecodes. Whatever they are fix them. Secondly, do a couple of runs and look at Intake (Charge) Air temperature. During normal driving it should be around 20-30F above ambient. Under WOT it should rise to about 70-90F. More importantly it should go down to 20-30F above ambient within 30 seconds after WOT.

This will tell you if your pump is functioning properly.

Start there.

Good Luck!

DFW01E55

Thanks Vadim, you'll be amused to know I just came back from data logging!

IAT's started at 151F with coolant temp at 183, ambient was 51 - after 5 minutes of driving at 10 to 40mph, the IAT is 147.

Going from 0 to 110mph the IAT goes from 147 to 250.

Acceleration goes flat at 110 when some thermal sensor cuts power.

7 minutes of speed limit driving and the IAT never gets below 151.

stevebez

OK for comparison with 5deg HIGHER ambients (55F) my Max IAT rise over ambient is 94F for WOT after about 5 seconds and drops off very quickly down to around 25-30F over ambient very quickly - probably as Vadim says within 30 seconds... the Scangauge is quite slow to update so its not easy to tell exactly ...

So in absolute terms my IATS under cruise are around 80F and peak at 149, and settle down to around 80F pretty quickly with ambients around 55.

I still need to see where the IATS peak though have not been able to hold a gear long enough to assess this...

If your IAT's start at 147F your pump is definitely fried ....

At what temp is the S/C disengaged?

Also has anyone done the math for WOT what is ~10deg IAT worth in horsepower?

DFW01E55

It's hard to be precise but somewhere between 240F and higher, which equaled 110mph on that run.

I'll be talking to the SA this mowning, it will be interesting to see if he accepts it.

stevebez

Make sure the I/C system has been bled properly - it needs some MB special device to do this ... Also they can pull the pump out to see if its running to spec or not. Only way to be sure - the impeller could be all chewed up...

Vadim @ FD

Excellent! Yes, my friend you have a bad pump.


Correct, bleeding is essential, but there is no special tool required. Impeller do not fail, pump motors do. So visually it looks OK, and it might even run when 12V is applied to it. But it is bad under load.

DFW01E55

The reply from my SA (after explaining the data logging and power loss) was, "Okay, so is it throwing a code?"
Me: "No codes."
Him: "How can you be sure?"
Me: "My data logger can see them."
Him: "I'll have to talk to the shop foreman, without a code, they can't do anything."

I would think that a combination of the dyno printout, the excel data file and the clear description of the problem would be evidence enough.

Let's see what tomorrow brings.

Vadim @ FD

DFW01E55:

What city are you in?

DFW01E55

Dallas, so I have a choice of 3 dealers within 15 miles east, south or west.
Two are decidedly unfriendly toward mods.

Eurocharged Rick

so just replace the pump yourself...it is an easy job and you can pick up the pump on ebay for around $100...

OzE55

Some photos and instructions would be helpful to all.

stevebez

Its pretty straight forward swap out from what I can see from the pump fittings - but you need to get under the car - a car lift will reduce the swearing factor during replacement considerably...

tigerlam92

This is what I had found before to use for my installation later on.

Note these are not my pictures but what I found on this site.

Pic 1 - Stock
Pic 2 - Aftermarket

Vadim @ FD

Pic 2 looks like a Renntech setup.

I am not sure on brand of the pump, but it does look about the same size as Johnson.