*** 55 Heads Project ***
04-24-2013, 07:49 AM
#302
Former Vendor of MBWorld
So BLEEK did all this work on the heads, sold a few sets, but never gave out any actual numbers of gains??? Has anyone dyno before and after ported and polished heads? Just looking for some actual figures. More than just, the car was really fast after the new heads lol.
04-24-2013, 07:59 AM
#303
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Dirt Scooters
Blackbenzz dyno'd after putting on a set of ported heads done by the same guy that ported mine and picked up 50rwhp i believe it was with room to make more if the tune was more aggressive.
04-24-2013, 03:35 PM
#304
MBWorld Fanatic!
I have a spare 500 engine I'm not using. Instead of boring out my good 55 amg engine. I was gonna bore out the 500 to 6.2 then port my good n/a 55 heads.
50 hp gain just from ported heads? Am I hearing that correctly?
edit: i'm a novice when it comes to building these engines from scratch, but after tackling swapping the engine in my w215 i feel like i'm capable of doing much more. i'm just over here taking notes on what you more experienced people are doing!
my ideal set up would consist of-
6.2 bored out block, beefed up internals, ported N/A 55 heads, with the weistec twin screw for the final touches. performance oriented torque converter and possibly an upgraded rear end
also looking to beef up the tranny at some point in time as since i have an extra tranny from my cl500(722.633) (bad oil pump)that i could build from the ground up also. i have an amg tranny(722.636) coming in the mail that will go on my car for the current time as she is technically my "daily driver"
also trying to figure out best option for exhaust as i still want to be able to move to california and pass smog
50 hp gain just from ported heads? Am I hearing that correctly?
edit: i'm a novice when it comes to building these engines from scratch, but after tackling swapping the engine in my w215 i feel like i'm capable of doing much more. i'm just over here taking notes on what you more experienced people are doing!
my ideal set up would consist of-
6.2 bored out block, beefed up internals, ported N/A 55 heads, with the weistec twin screw for the final touches. performance oriented torque converter and possibly an upgraded rear end
also looking to beef up the tranny at some point in time as since i have an extra tranny from my cl500(722.633) (bad oil pump)that i could build from the ground up also. i have an amg tranny(722.636) coming in the mail that will go on my car for the current time as she is technically my "daily driver"
also trying to figure out best option for exhaust as i still want to be able to move to california and pass smog
Last edited by ctravis595; 04-24-2013 at 04:00 PM.
02-05-2016, 03:14 PM
#305
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1988 300CE totaled due vandalizm 1998 E430 Sold, 2000 S430 Daily driver, 2003 S55 project
Couple Quick Questions
Hey guys just wanted to share a little project with you guys that i've been working for awhile.
Many many hours spent research, learning and understanding what i was up against. Being a true drag racer at heart, and been turning wrenches for some time, this was a whole different kinda monster that i was up against and i realize how important it is to do things right.
I got lots of pics so please bare with me. Also there will be things that i will be sharing with you guys, so you don't get scamed or screwed out of your hard earned money.
I started off with my car fresh off the show room floor and sent it out to get a complete K4 set-up, the work was done in Atlanta and i had to then send the car out to Brandon (Kleemann) to fix some bugs, once it was broken in, it's made tons of power! The car made 580hp in Colorado, and that was with only 500miles on it in the super thin colorado air.
So as time passed the racer in me came out searching for more power! i won't get into what other tweaks i'm doing right now, but i will share later!
So back to the heads, i purchased a spare 55 kompressor motor out of a wrecked SL and i was gonna use the heads off that motor to port. But plans changed and now that motor will be my stroker motor (6.2)
I researched our 55 heads and i found out alot about them! PAY ATTENTION! There are some people out there that have never turned a wrench buying up E500 heads and selling them as 55 heads!!! Now here's where it gets tricky!!! From 430 to SLR's the heads all have the same part number! But here's what i learned, castings from real 55's are actually better casting, they have more meat in critical areas for porting and also runner volume, vavle size are different on real 55 heads! See older 430 and 500 heads have smaller vavles and smaller runner volume then our heads, and also the 430's and 500's have a thinner casting. I found out the hard way!!!
So here lies the grey area. Every head will bolt up the same and should work the same, but the potential and power is what will be different! Here's an analagy, kinda like using 305 smallblockchevy heads on a 350, or 289 ford heads on a 351w. Will bolt up and will run, but no room for improvement! Just some food for thought before someone gets stuck with crappy casting or worse yet buys someones ported heads that aren't real 55 heads.
So let's get back to the fun! I bought up 3 sets of real 55 heads, one set was off a N/A motor, and the other two sets where off wrecked kompressor cars.
For all you engine guys we all know air flow makes HP, so on a N/A motor it is important to get as much flow and not sacrifice too much velocity(losing throttle response) I can't even remember but on a N/A motor the intake is suppose to flow a certain percentage more then the exhaust.
For out kompressor cars and turbo cars, we need to get the most out the exhaust!!! I don't have any stock pics, but VRUS took pics of my heads before they were ported, so if you want to compare before and after shots of my heads go look at VRUS's head project post where he posted pics of my heads, you can see how small my stock exhaust ports were.
We spent alot of time sonic testing the heads with my cylinder head porter! He actually does alot of killer work for some big drag racing teams, so this project took time as we wanted to do things right! Once the porter figured out where all the thin spots were, and made all his moulds he began to reshape the runners for max air flow!
Here's a few quick pics and i'll continue the story. Enjoy!
Many many hours spent research, learning and understanding what i was up against. Being a true drag racer at heart, and been turning wrenches for some time, this was a whole different kinda monster that i was up against and i realize how important it is to do things right.
I got lots of pics so please bare with me. Also there will be things that i will be sharing with you guys, so you don't get scamed or screwed out of your hard earned money.
I started off with my car fresh off the show room floor and sent it out to get a complete K4 set-up, the work was done in Atlanta and i had to then send the car out to Brandon (Kleemann) to fix some bugs, once it was broken in, it's made tons of power! The car made 580hp in Colorado, and that was with only 500miles on it in the super thin colorado air.
So as time passed the racer in me came out searching for more power! i won't get into what other tweaks i'm doing right now, but i will share later!
So back to the heads, i purchased a spare 55 kompressor motor out of a wrecked SL and i was gonna use the heads off that motor to port. But plans changed and now that motor will be my stroker motor (6.2)
I researched our 55 heads and i found out alot about them! PAY ATTENTION! There are some people out there that have never turned a wrench buying up E500 heads and selling them as 55 heads!!! Now here's where it gets tricky!!! From 430 to SLR's the heads all have the same part number! But here's what i learned, castings from real 55's are actually better casting, they have more meat in critical areas for porting and also runner volume, vavle size are different on real 55 heads! See older 430 and 500 heads have smaller vavles and smaller runner volume then our heads, and also the 430's and 500's have a thinner casting. I found out the hard way!!!
So here lies the grey area. Every head will bolt up the same and should work the same, but the potential and power is what will be different! Here's an analagy, kinda like using 305 smallblockchevy heads on a 350, or 289 ford heads on a 351w. Will bolt up and will run, but no room for improvement! Just some food for thought before someone gets stuck with crappy casting or worse yet buys someones ported heads that aren't real 55 heads.
So let's get back to the fun! I bought up 3 sets of real 55 heads, one set was off a N/A motor, and the other two sets where off wrecked kompressor cars.
For all you engine guys we all know air flow makes HP, so on a N/A motor it is important to get as much flow and not sacrifice too much velocity(losing throttle response) I can't even remember but on a N/A motor the intake is suppose to flow a certain percentage more then the exhaust.
For out kompressor cars and turbo cars, we need to get the most out the exhaust!!! I don't have any stock pics, but VRUS took pics of my heads before they were ported, so if you want to compare before and after shots of my heads go look at VRUS's head project post where he posted pics of my heads, you can see how small my stock exhaust ports were.
We spent alot of time sonic testing the heads with my cylinder head porter! He actually does alot of killer work for some big drag racing teams, so this project took time as we wanted to do things right! Once the porter figured out where all the thin spots were, and made all his moulds he began to reshape the runners for max air flow!
Here's a few quick pics and i'll continue the story. Enjoy!
My question is about tolerances between camshaft and the head bearing surfaces. I have been all over this forum, another one, WIS and the web and all I can find is that you cannot reuse the rocker arm bridge bolts. I would like to know if there is a min/max clearance between the cam and head bearings.
Second WIS states that the valves are not to be machined they can only be lapped. If a valve needs machined it needs to be replaced. I have had two machine shops tell me that they can be machined and the reason Mercedes WIS says that they cannot is because the dealership does not have the proper equipment to grind the top of valve down to a length where they will not hit the piston. The machine shops say that the WIS is for the techs working in the dealership service department and if the heads were sent out to a machine shop they would have been machined.
Any input on this would be greatly appreciated.
04-10-2019, 09:24 PM
#306
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2001 CLK 55 AMG 1999 SLK 230
Its going to be difficult to not sound like a jerk now that you just had all of this work done on your heads. I'm not claiming to be cylinder head expert but a gentleman by the name of David Vizard is, in fact he is considered one of the best in the world and has published over 100 books and written over 4000 articles on the subject. Many of his writings are about what not to do. Polishing anything in a cylinder head is either a complete waist of time because nothing is gained in fact 90% of the time it results in a loss of power. Polished intake runners cause's fuel condensation in the runner (bad). Polished combustion chambers have no advantage over non polished, carbon still sticks to polished combustion chambers and because polishing involves removing material a loss of compression ratio is possible. increasing port diameter on modern cylinder heads like the M113 55 amg will cost you power by reducing the port velocity. Multiple angle valve grinds and Un-shrouding the valves and reshaping the pocket is the only thing that will improve power on a street engine. Low lift flow is far more important than high lift flow because high lift flow is already good .
04-10-2019, 11:42 PM
#307
MBWorld Fanatic!
Its going to be difficult to not sound like a jerk now that you just had all of this work done on your heads. I'm not claiming to be cylinder head expert but a gentleman by the name of David Vizard is, in fact he is considered one of the best in the world and has published over 100 books and written over 4000 articles on the subject. Many of his writings are about what not to do. Polishing anything in a cylinder head is either a complete waist of time because nothing is gained in fact 90% of the time it results in a loss of power. Polished intake runners cause's fuel condensation in the runner (bad). Polished combustion chambers have no advantage over non polished, carbon still sticks to polished combustion chambers and because polishing involves removing material a loss of compression ratio is possible. increasing port diameter on modern cylinder heads like the M113 55 amg will cost you power by reducing the port velocity. Multiple angle valve grinds and Un-shrouding the valves and reshaping the pocket is the only thing that will improve power on a street engine. Low lift flow is far more important than high lift flow because high lift flow is already good .
You know, there are accomplished people who say the earth is flat...doesn’t mean I buy it
