joshd

Exactly, and I'm willing to wait. This type of thorough development and OPENness with the community is exactly what I like to see. It inspires way more confidence than unsubstantiated marketing claims.

jangy

You don't have long to wait. VRP is going full bore on all their projects and the E55 is one that they are almost done with. There was an interesting thread we had a few weeks back regarding tuners and I argued for PC in that, because I had met them and seen what they were about. They are focussed on MBs, that is all I can say. There is no other way to say it. They could easily have done a minor tune to mine and called it a day, but VRP wanted more. In my case, I get a custom tune. For those that have a similar setup, it is as close to a custom tune as you will be able to get. Like you say, the OPENness and desire to do it right is GREAT!

vrus

That is how VRP came to light, and that is the only way it will continue to operate going forward.

We are always open to suggestions and comments from the community and we value the support that we get from everyone.

bfnnrgn

Just curious, but does the reflash issue affect the SL55 as well? I had an E55 and it had the reflash but it's gone and an SL55 has taken it's place. Was thinking about doing something to it.

jangy

What year SL55? As far as i know, the hurdle is the same up through '06. The '07 SL55 has the 80mmTB and I do not know how they react to modding.

bfnnrgn

It's on '06 and so was my E55.

jangy

Hmmm, I really do not know. I'd assume you will have the same issues, but dunno that anyone has been there. Do you know of anyone that has installed a VRP or ASP pulley? Do they have dynos they can provide?

Where are you? If close to Power Chip, they do the money back guarantee AND are honest enough to acknowledge the glitch. Most tuners will tell you to get an IC kit or that the belt is slipping. If you are far, hang back. I am sure this tune will be tsted on all later model 55ks by VRP.

joshd

I'll be honest, I'm basically on hold with mods until this tuning issue is resolved and VRP completes this package and/or the next level packages with throttle body/headers/airbox, etc.

So get busy over there guys

I had a local Kleemann dealer (Funktion Auto) call Kleemann and they claimed that they were aware of the issue but that the latest flash wasn't a problem for them. I'm not exactly sure what that means, but I'm just going to wait until I hear the final results of the VRP/Powerchip tuning. No matter what, I'll get before and after dynos on the same dyno with A/F and hopefully boost plotted.

bfnnrgn

I'm in Dallas, TX. I guess I'll just hold tight and see what VRP comes up with. No point wasting time with kleemann, renntech as his stuff is better and not at near extortion prices.

jangy

Kleeman is indeed aware of the issue. I'm glad it isn't an issue with them. It must just be a Powerchip thing? LOL, tuners are so funny. Call Kleeman and let them know that the days of just saying it is all good are DONE. SHOW ME THE MONEY!!!!

By the way, Dyno alone won't do it. VRP is using tons of datalog data as well. You won't have long to wait. I am leaving my car all of next week, so they will get lots of time to dial it in.

Once mine is up and running, lets set up a real life race involving the various tuners. I will rep for VRP. Anyone with a pulley and ECU tune hop in and lets see which one is the "best". VRP has nothing to hide. The only challenge I am curious about will be the VRP pulley + EVOtech tune. All others are lost in the dust (IMO).

jangy

I won't speak about Kleeman, other than to say that they also had their chance to take advantage of this market about a year ago and they chose the easy way out. Those that had the issues can speak up on how it was handled. RennTech doesn't even have a larger pulley. Also, I have yet to see a properly running Renntech Pulley + ECU on a newer car.

AdamG@NorCal

Ok, any local 55 kompressor with VRP pulley here? We're going to dyno tune the car and have a match up with jangy...

rflow306

What we need to do is stop using plug and play cookie cutter flashes instead of emulating and tuning on the dyno. Just my 2 cents.

blackbenzz

I agree 1000% (yes thats one thousand). Only problem is finding tuners

DFW01E55

I agree entirely, that's why I haven't had mine done.
$2,000 for REAL tuning is acceptable. Cookie cutter flashing is worth $500.

jangy

HAHA!!! You all should have to give me a kickback for bringing it up enough to finally have a tuner listen. We are in good hands. I would never even consider leaving my car for R&D with too many people, but Vadim is one. On top of that, I hear good things about Jeremy @ Powerchip so it made it an easy choice.

On a serious note, I think the E55 guys are gonna be pretty happy with the outcome of this even if you don't get a VRP/PC tune. It will FORCE the other tuners to step up and add substance to their tunes.

SLK55R

I've been saying for ages that Renntech (Oliver) and Evotech (Oliver) have been doing custom tunes... Of course both use datalog data ... how do you think they do a custom tune?

jangy

Honestly, I don't. This is my opinion, butI think that Oliver developed a tune for the older E55s with the older flashes. All was good. Thing is that the car evolved as did the flashes, but the tunes remained the same. From there, the best anyone did was try to slightly tweak that same file to no avail.

Now, Powerchip and VRP are starting fresh and doing it right. Vadim has more dat than a solid clinical trial. dataloggers, dynos, etc. he has also identifed exactly the areas that need improvement (which i agree with). PC has been able to change those parameters, but just hasn't been able to get it to Vadim's standards.

jangy

Save your cash. I think VRP will be releasing the pulley and flash for $2500. Quite a deal for 60hp.

BenzoBoi

Hey Jangy...is the pulley/ecu combo yer talkin about the same as the ecu/pulley combo that VRP has been sellin for a while now? Is that gonna be some special pricing? When is the release date for this and how will it differ from what they offer now?

MB_Forever

This is a very interesting discussion........ but I'm still confused on what the "official" position of all the "major" tuners in regards to this controversial flash. If Kleemann, RennTech, and EvoTech claim that the flash is no problem for them, then a simple dyno on a late model E55 should prove or disprove their claims, right?

Does anybody have a 2006 E55 with a RennTech, EvoTech, or Kleemann tune with a before and after dyno?

Zod

Well I can tell you that two cls 06’s here in Kuwait stock, have dynoed in the range of 435 whp and this holds true to vrus claim on later models power outputs.

Jangy do you have any proof that all the other tuners have sub par tunes?
Especially for 06 models? (what do you base your finds on?)

CA_E55

I do think that most of this pulley talk has the physics totally backwards – just read the GM press release on the ZR1 and tell me you were not scratching your head and asking yourself the obvious question: The claim is the latest generation Eaton SC has improved SC efficiency to lower crank pulley power loss from 120 to 80 HP – that is a whooozzee! Imagine to get 40 crank HP simply by means of a more efficient SC!!
Contrast that to the larger pulley approach: Everybody with some physics background remembers that increased delta-p decreases efficiency in an asymptotic function, i.e. in the real world you get ever higher discharge temps, need more parasitic power to achieve ever smaller gains in delta-p to the point where there is no gain anymore, no mater how many miles diameter the pullet is. The challenge than for any serious tuner is to take the SC apart and blueprint that thing to the limits – I am convinced that is where the real power is!

GM will pull 620 HP from an engine design far inferior to the AMG (2 valves vs. 3 valves, 1 sparkplug vs. 2 sparks, overhead vs. in block cams etc) the LS9 is a glorified truck engine (just look at all the GM trucks and vans that use that identical basic engine!) massaged by the immensely capable GM marketing machine – with a better SC!

jangy

I have no clue what they are selling now and for how much. You got details? I was always under the impression that what had been sold to date was a pulley by VRP and an ECU tune from PC, but not a package that had been made together. I know that the work being done on my car is to cater to the people that want pulley and ecu. I will be getting more mods, so the tune will have to be re-done. I am not in on the business side, but knowing them, I would assume that some option wil be given to their current clients to upgrade to the latest and greatest. I don't think that is how they are with just this case.

There is no set release date that I know of. I just think that they will blend in what they learn from my car into all of the data they are aquiring and have. The tune is just not ready for release, yet. Vadim has some very high expectations and I like that, because they were the exact feelings I had with my butt dyno. A tweak here and a twomp there and I will be off to 80mmTB land and beyond!!

jangy

I know of three E55s (2 '06s) that RennTech still hasn't gotten tuned to the level that I expect. The '06s obviously have the most issues.

I do not deal with Kleeman and have nothing good or bad to say, other than I remember thinking that they were holding info back when the flash episode occurred.

As far as EVOtech, read Adam's post. Note he said that he would TUNE a car and then wants to race me with my Powerchip tune. Both cars are to have VRP pulleys. If EVOTech had already worked it all out, I would have been called out already. Still, I would say that EVOTech is at least coming around and joining the enthusiast's fray. Between Adam and Oliver, I think they will be fine.