Thread for those Banned by MHP
10-01-2008, 04:52 PM
#77
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'09 C63 AMG
Honestly, I'm glad! I do hope you do well, I really do. I call 'em like I see 'em. I'm not saying you can't or won't have the best, but you know that it doesn't happen overnight.
You're excited about your stuff, so you post about it & defend it. The problem is that many members here have been burned by "tuners" who came off just like you do. You get to pay for others "crimes". After MIR, we'll have much better picture of whats going on at MHP, until then it's mostly just escalating BS that doesn't really help the community. Next year, when you've got tunes out there with real miles & use on them; then we'll really know.
You're excited about your stuff, so you post about it & defend it. The problem is that many members here have been burned by "tuners" who came off just like you do. You get to pay for others "crimes". After MIR, we'll have much better picture of whats going on at MHP, until then it's mostly just escalating BS that doesn't really help the community. Next year, when you've got tunes out there with real miles & use on them; then we'll really know.
10-01-2008, 05:02 PM
#78
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10-01-2008, 05:59 PM
#80
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Here is an excerpt from a Kleemann dealer's write up on the 65 tune (this may be helpful for people who think 18-20lbs of boost post-tune is the right figure...another freebie):
The SL65 turbos are not big, faster to spool, and therefor cannot support large high output power increase. The focus of the upgrade is to get the power sooner. Peak torque gains are very nice, and is also available much earlier in the RPM range and this is really what you feel under acceleration. Very nice increases in the most useful spot of the RPM range. The SL65 stock programming has two distinct boost levels. The cars boost is set at 17-18lbs with a 22-23lb overboost setting. The Kleemann software upgrade removes this staggered boost level and ups the boost to 22-26psi depending on the load. The factory has set the car to run teh lower boost below 3500 rpm's and then higher boost at 3500rpm. Kleemann noticibly changes the power curve to take affect much earlier. These cars have extremely sensitive knock sensors so please check with your salesperson to check the details on your octane ratings. The program is undetectable to DAS systems (factory tools) unless the technician is riding with a DAS machine monioring boost curves.
Tom
The SL65 turbos are not big, faster to spool, and therefor cannot support large high output power increase. The focus of the upgrade is to get the power sooner. Peak torque gains are very nice, and is also available much earlier in the RPM range and this is really what you feel under acceleration. Very nice increases in the most useful spot of the RPM range. The SL65 stock programming has two distinct boost levels. The cars boost is set at 17-18lbs with a 22-23lb overboost setting. The Kleemann software upgrade removes this staggered boost level and ups the boost to 22-26psi depending on the load. The factory has set the car to run teh lower boost below 3500 rpm's and then higher boost at 3500rpm. Kleemann noticibly changes the power curve to take affect much earlier. These cars have extremely sensitive knock sensors so please check with your salesperson to check the details on your octane ratings. The program is undetectable to DAS systems (factory tools) unless the technician is riding with a DAS machine monioring boost curves.
Tom
10-01-2008, 08:58 PM
#84
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V12-Biturbo
1 of our forum members (Metallica) just got K2 Kleemann on his 2004-up not sure of the exact yr, SL600 post tune results on a Dynodynamics in 90 degree heat were 503rwhp 680rwto on Dynojet they'd easily fetch 520+rwhp 700rwto
So another nod to Kleemann for krazzeee power
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...2&d=1220556678
I'm still waiting on VRP/Vadim's re-vised 93octane 600 TT ECU/TCU
Should have news next couple of weeks, & don't forget our Airbox/intercoolers are the same, Vadim's upgrading both
I read Oxygen's post on how the 65 heat exchanger is twice as wide/thick vs 600's, I wonder if this would be an easy direct replacement to help cooling
So another nod to Kleemann for krazzeee power
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...2&d=1220556678
I'm still waiting on VRP/Vadim's re-vised 93octane 600 TT ECU/TCU
Should have news next couple of weeks, & don't forget our Airbox/intercoolers are the same, Vadim's upgrading bothI read Oxygen's post on how the 65 heat exchanger is twice as wide/thick vs 600's, I wonder if this would be an easy direct replacement to help cooling
Last edited by Thericker; 10-01-2008 at 09:04 PM.
10-01-2008, 09:01 PM
#85
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2004 S55 AMG
Here is an excerpt from a Kleemann dealer's write up on the 65 tune (this may be helpful for people who think 18-20lbs of boost post-tune is the right figure...another freebie):
The SL65 turbos are not big, faster to spool, and therefor cannot support large high output power increase. The focus of the upgrade is to get the power sooner. Peak torque gains are very nice, and is also available much earlier in the RPM range and this is really what you feel under acceleration. Very nice increases in the most useful spot of the RPM range. The SL65 stock programming has two distinct boost levels. The cars boost is set at 17-18lbs with a 22-23lb overboost setting. The Kleemann software upgrade removes this staggered boost level and ups the boost to 22-26psi depending on the load. The factory has set the car to run teh lower boost below 3500 rpm's and then higher boost at 3500rpm. Kleemann noticibly changes the power curve to take affect much earlier. These cars have extremely sensitive knock sensors so please check with your salesperson to check the details on your octane ratings. The program is undetectable to DAS systems (factory tools) unless the technician is riding with a DAS machine monioring boost curves.
Tom
The SL65 turbos are not big, faster to spool, and therefor cannot support large high output power increase. The focus of the upgrade is to get the power sooner. Peak torque gains are very nice, and is also available much earlier in the RPM range and this is really what you feel under acceleration. Very nice increases in the most useful spot of the RPM range. The SL65 stock programming has two distinct boost levels. The cars boost is set at 17-18lbs with a 22-23lb overboost setting. The Kleemann software upgrade removes this staggered boost level and ups the boost to 22-26psi depending on the load. The factory has set the car to run teh lower boost below 3500 rpm's and then higher boost at 3500rpm. Kleemann noticibly changes the power curve to take affect much earlier. These cars have extremely sensitive knock sensors so please check with your salesperson to check the details on your octane ratings. The program is undetectable to DAS systems (factory tools) unless the technician is riding with a DAS machine monioring boost curves.
Tom
10-01-2008, 09:59 PM
#86
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Thread Starter
1 of our forum members (Metallica) just got K2 Kleemann on his 2004-up not sure of the exact yr, SL600 post tune results on a Dynodynamics in 90 degree heat were 503rwhp 680rwto on Dynojet they'd easily fetch 520+rwhp 700rwto
So another nod to Kleemann for krazzeee power
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...2&d=1220556678
I'm still waiting on VRP/Vadim's re-vised 93octane 600 TT ECU/TCUShould have news next couple of weeks, & don't forget our Airbox/intercoolers are the same, Vadim's upgrading both
I read Oxygen's post on how the 65 heat exchanger is twice as wide/thick vs 600's, I wonder if this would be an easy direct replacement to help cooling
So another nod to Kleemann for krazzeee power
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...2&d=1220556678
I'm still waiting on VRP/Vadim's re-vised 93octane 600 TT ECU/TCU
Should have news next couple of weeks, & don't forget our Airbox/intercoolers are the same, Vadim's upgrading bothI read Oxygen's post on how the 65 heat exchanger is twice as wide/thick vs 600's, I wonder if this would be an easy direct replacement to help cooling
There is an answer to that... unfortunately, given how competitive (almost adversarial) and proprietary it has gotten around here recently... I am not sure I am at liberty to share it with anyone...
Tom
10-01-2008, 10:33 PM
#87
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'09 C63 AMG
1 of our forum members (Metallica) just got K2 Kleemann on his 2004-up not sure of the exact yr, SL600 post tune results on a Dynodynamics in 90 degree heat were 503rwhp 680rwto on Dynojet they'd easily fetch 520+rwhp 700rwto
So another nod to Kleemann for krazzeee power
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...2&d=1220556678
I'm still waiting on VRP/Vadim's re-vised 93octane 600 TT ECU/TCUShould have news next couple of weeks, & don't forget our Airbox/intercoolers are the same, Vadim's upgrading both
I read Oxygen's post on how the 65 heat exchanger is twice as wide/thick vs 600's, I wonder if this would be an easy direct replacement to help cooling
So another nod to Kleemann for krazzeee power
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...2&d=1220556678
I'm still waiting on VRP/Vadim's re-vised 93octane 600 TT ECU/TCU
Should have news next couple of weeks, & don't forget our Airbox/intercoolers are the same, Vadim's upgrading bothI read Oxygen's post on how the 65 heat exchanger is twice as wide/thick vs 600's, I wonder if this would be an easy direct replacement to help cooling
Sean,
Dynodynamics dynos are like Mustang Dynos in that they're all over the place when it comes to numbers. Some read higher than DJs, others read lower, that's the problem trying to compare numbers from different makes of dynos to others--especially non DJs.
10-01-2008, 11:58 PM
#88
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I thought this would be of interest even though it is a dyno chart for a stock S65. I came across an article online from Automobile magazine and they actually dynoed the car on a Dynojet. The "technical editor" was a complete moron and bashed the S65 but they actually dynoed it from second gear through 4th gear. Interesting results...especially for those who think that car will dyno less horsepower in the taller 1:1 gear (4th in 65/600/55) than in a lower (3rd gear).
Tom
Tom
10-02-2008, 12:01 AM
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'09 C63 AMG
I thought this would be of interest even though it is a dyno chart for a stock S65. I came across an article online from Automobile magazine and they actually dynoed the car on a Dynojet. The "technical editor" was a complete moron and bashed the S65 but they actually dynoed it from second gear through 4th gear. Interesting results...especially for those who think that car will dyno less horsepower in the taller 1:1 gear (4th in 65/600/55) than in a lower (3rd gear).
Tom
Tom
10-02-2008, 12:04 AM
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'09 C63 AMG
As my final post in your waste of bandwidth thread, and before I again put you on my ignore list, I have just two statements to make:
1) You've just proven that you can find info to back anything on the internet.
2) Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.
1) You've just proven that you can find info to back anything on the internet.
2) Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.
10-02-2008, 12:20 AM
#91
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I swear...he makes this stuff way too easy for me....I almost feel bad...
Tom
10-02-2008, 12:21 AM
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'09 C63 AMG
10-02-2008, 12:40 AM
#93
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Now I know that I said I wasn't going to give you free advice....and I am struggling with that fact that I am about to go back on that statement... but here goes.....
Andy... you need to work on that graceful exit from this thread...you said it was your last post...and yet you post again. I don't really mind...it will just damage your credibility further. I'll let you off the hook this time.... since I wasn't particularly nice with my comments and you felt the need to retort.
Good luck,
Tom
10-02-2008, 12:43 AM
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'09 C63 AMG
If you must know...I make a decent living doing research and working with numbers....so this stuff is second nature to me...and all those dyno charts I posted were already on my computer...but yes I mastered Google (my brother works for them so I hope that wasn't a shameless plug).
Now I know that I said I wasn't going to give you free advice....and I am struggling with that fact that I am about to go back on that statement... but here goes.....
Andy... you need to work on that graceful exit from this thread...you said it was your last post...and yet you post again. I don't really mind...it will just damage your credibility further. I'll let you off the hook this time.... since I wasn't particularly nice with my comments and you felt the need to retort.
Good luck,
Tom
Now I know that I said I wasn't going to give you free advice....and I am struggling with that fact that I am about to go back on that statement... but here goes.....
Andy... you need to work on that graceful exit from this thread...you said it was your last post...and yet you post again. I don't really mind...it will just damage your credibility further. I'll let you off the hook this time.... since I wasn't particularly nice with my comments and you felt the need to retort.
Good luck,
Tom
Tom,
(Yep, another post)
You crack me the **** up.
10-02-2008, 11:45 AM
#95
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Another interesting dyno run of an SL65 pre and post tune. The dyno is in German and I BELIEVE (not saying for sure) that this is on a Bosch dyno. Run #1 is the tuned one and Run #2 is the stock. This dyno gives both the power hp (using the metric: kilowatts) at the crank ("Motorleistung") and at the wheels ("Radlesitung"). The toque figures are also in the metric Newtonmeters.
Some helpful conversion factors: For the 65's 612PS = 450kW = 604hp (SAE) or 1.34222hp (SAE) per kW. 1000NM = 738lbs-ft
I am not disclosing the tuner's name associated with these figures because of conflicting tuners claiming these figures. This was posted on the internet by one tuner....however another tuner I talked with quoted the same exact (to the kW) results (pre and post tune ) from his German connection . So without a clear provenance of who can lay claim to these #'s... I don't want to advertise either party.
Tom
Some helpful conversion factors: For the 65's 612PS = 450kW = 604hp (SAE) or 1.34222hp (SAE) per kW. 1000NM = 738lbs-ft
I am not disclosing the tuner's name associated with these figures because of conflicting tuners claiming these figures. This was posted on the internet by one tuner....however another tuner I talked with quoted the same exact (to the kW) results (pre and post tune ) from his German connection . So without a clear provenance of who can lay claim to these #'s... I don't want to advertise either party.
Tom
10-02-2008, 12:08 PM
#97
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When I started researching the 55 tune comparisons...it seems like an incredibly difficult task. There are soooo many different combinations of aftermarket parts being used by people.... different T/B's, pulleys, airboxes, headers...etc. It makes it nearly impossible to kind of isolate the tune. I guess I should focus on the 63's...but even they have more options now for other parts...the V12TT's seem to have just tunes...maybe some airboxes/drop-in filters and that is it. Yes, there are I/C pump upgrades... but realistically they probably don't add HP (if car properly cooled before a run) ...so much as make sure you don't lose any after back to back runs.
Tom
Tom
10-02-2008, 12:10 PM
#98
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10-02-2008, 12:12 PM
#99
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10-02-2008, 12:17 PM
#100
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