DougE

Renntech offers a menu of mods for the new 5.5L engine, which may prove to be irresistible. Any other tuners out there with packages ready to go?

SLequalsHARDON

I tell ya, if I run into an E55 and 40 grand, I sure as hell would... but if we get lucky, I might be privelidged to get an E55.

JamE55

Yes...KLEEMANN!! Not sure if it's available yet but the claimed HP is 640!!

DougE

I'm a loyal Renntech guy, but if Kleemann can offer something superior in some way, great. Aren't there some Kleemann guys on the board? I'd love to hear about their stuff.

alz

coupled with a less restrictive exhaust system and that should be good for a significant boost in hp

James F. Cannon

I assume you are speaking of a W211 E55. I can vouch for RENNtech as they have modified my W210. I see Kleemann has a modified W210 E55 similar in HP to mine. Good luck and have fun!

DougE

Yeah. I can vouch for them, too. They did a helluva job on my SLK 320, turning it into an SLK38K that is downright scary (but alas not as quick as your E55 (Bob sent me your timeslips...holy crap!) , at least not yet...a 2X increase in power seems to require a gearing change, which we'll work out in the coming months). Not likely I'll go elsewhere with the E55, but I thought perhaps some of the posters here might have other plans or suggestions.

Lucas

If the Renntech is near the KLEEMANN in power, somebody must have pulled off a few plug wires on the KLEEMANN, while the owner had his back to the car

DougE

I've never seen performance numbers (e.g., 1/4 mile times/trap speeds) from a Kleemann car. Can you post something that tops Cannon's Renntech E55K performance?

JAYCL600

Iam looking into doing the RENNtech CEU and pukkey upgrade on the new E55.

Lucas

DougE

Do you mean 210 or 211 E 55 ????

As far as I know, ( I don't follow what Renntech offers ), Renntech
have never had anything to offer a NASP 55 engine that will even come close to the Kleemann output. Mabye I am wrong ???.

The new W 211 55, Kleemann approach this engine different from other tuners. All other tuners and I mean all, BRABUS, Carlsson,
MKB, Renntech, etc. Simply change the drive ratio on the compressor, program the chip and change a little to the exhaust.

Kleemann change the whole AMG S/C system and replace it. The AMG system has a quite bad design, where it's flow capasity is at
it's max at only 5000 rpm. This can clearly be seen in the power
and torque curves, the power curve is flat from 5-6800 rpm. and the max torque is dropping like a stone from approx 4000 rpm.
The new AMG cars feels fast and brutal in low engine speeds, but
to me they are a dissapointment in the high revs.
Changeing the drive ratio in a system which already have flow problems, is in my eyes not the optimal solution.
Changeing the pulleys, will give some more HP in the low revs.
but it will flatten out and could even feel worse in the high revs, because of the limited flow in the system.

Thats why Kleemann designed a new system, lifting the output to 640 HP.
The only thing holding us back, is that AMG changed their S/C system in Dec. 2002 and build in a nice large bypass throttle, so we had to modify our tools again.

So where is Renntech :

KLEEMANN 210 E 55 - 562 HP
KLEEMANN 211 E 55 - 640 HP

Why did Renntech pull out their cars from the competition at the MB owners club meeting, just because MB Autowerks in Atlanta
entered a standard CLK 55 with Kleemann S/C and suspension.

DougE

211 55

Lucas:

What Kleemann offers may be interesting. I do, however, have a couple comments concerning your post:

You said, very clearly, that you don't follow what Renntech offers. You later said just as clearly that you know exactly what they offer. This inconsistency will cause scepticism.

Your claim of 640HP from a 55K motor sounds termendous, but my scepticism makes me wonder it it might be a teeny bit exagerated.

Renntech has permitted auto magazines to test and report on their cars where they have no say in what is written. They have also run their cars in published competitions where they don't even know what the competition will be. I can't imagine that they would pull out of some club event because of potential competition from a Kleemann car.

Is there a source of information containing and written claims by Kleemann concerning the performance and output specs of their cars? I've not found it on their website.

JAYCL600

Lucas,

I think 640 hp is great, but i dont see that many E55 owners opting to replace their whole supercharger systems, just doesnt seem "practical".(then again when discussing this subjest we should throw practacility out of the window). I do think that a pulley and ECU upgrade for around 5000 USD, is something that the average E55 owner can stomach. Dont get me wrong, I would have 1000 hp if I could I do appreciate your knowledge and insight, if you dont mind, can you expand on the detriments of a "pulley and ECU upgrade" on the new supercharged 55 motors with ample access to 93 and 94 octane gas? Thanks

Pierre32///AMG

http://www.hs-elektronik.com/datenbl...6ps-700nm.html

Pierre32///AMG

http://www.mkb-tuning.com/content_e/...ertunek55.html

trock3155

What I dont unerstand is how Kleemann can get more HP from the 211 E55 than the 210, considering they both have the same engine. The only difference is that the supercharger is added on th1 211, which Renntech can do as well(with the AMG supercharger). So if Kleemann strips the stock superhcarger on the 211(making it basically a 210 engine) and puts a new one on to make 640 hp, why cant they do it with a 210?
Asa

Brandon @ Kleemann

The W211 E55 has a SC'd engine from the factory- this engine has lowered CR to 9.0:1 down from 10.5:1. As a result you can run almost twice the boost pressure on the lower CR engine, making significantly more power.

The engines have the same displacement- that is all.

JAYCL600

So what is the cost of the upgrade for the E55?

Lucas

The old 55 is a 10,5 : 1 compression engine where we can boost
approx. 7 psi.

The new S/C 55 is a 8,5 0r 9 : 1 engine where we can boost over 14 psi.

Thats why we can pull out the extra HP, they look the same but are not.

No serious tuner would ever touch such an expensive car for 5000
$, as a tuner we have to live with that some times things go wrong, it can be the tuners fault or it can be MB parts which brake but have to be covered by the tuner, try and imagine what
such an engine cost. At the end of the day we run a business.

Kleemann is not looking to serve the masses, there are pleanty off client's arround the world, who want's the best and can pay for it.

I don't even read all on our own Web page, but I see daily tests done by magazines from many different countries which are scanned and can be veiwed on www.kleemann.dk, there should
be lots of independant tests.

Mach430

Every tuner has a say as to what is written about their cars in magazines, it's called money. Magazines make huge amounts of money based on their sponsors and advertisers. An article can easily be influenced by the amount of capital backing it. The slightest change in an advertising budget can lead to enormous changes in the articles. What do you think happens behind articles about the car/truck of the year?

JAYCL600

KLEEMANN or Ben, can you give me any info on the KLEEMANN E55 upgrade?

James F. Cannon

DougE, I have posted performance figures for my car (RENNtech modified) in hopes of getting others to do the same. My times have all been run on my street tires (Bridgestone S-03 285/30 x 19 rear) with the original exhaust (from downpipes back to tailpipes) on an NHRA sanctioned track. I recently had the pleasure of a visit by Pocholin and he remarked that he thought my car was a bit quieter than his own. We had a good time at the track until the rain disrupted things. Anyway, I haven't seen any responses from HPS or Kleemann owners other than a comment about Kleemann setting a top speed record in Europe at 338KPH in a car specially built for the occasion. Just my observations. Hey, anybody want to race?

Brandon @ Kleemann

Perhaps most KLEEMANN owners dont go the the dragstrip?

Brandon @ Kleemann

Heres a timeslip from our SE dealer/installers CLK55K:

DougE

Indeed, Mr. Cannon, until KLEEMANN posted that timeslip a couple posts back, there hasn't been much for results coming out of the Kleemann crowd. Lucas insists that the Kleemann Clk 55K outs out 568HP (if I remember correctly). However, the Kleemann Clk 55K doesn't run as fast as your 530 HP E55 (210) Renntech conversion, even though the CLK is lighter. I surely understand that comparing times on different days, different tires, and different tracks can be misleading, but Kleemann is claiming that they put out significantly greater power than Renntech, so it is only fair that we not resolve uncertainties in their favor. Perhaps the US 55K conversion is not as strong as the EU version of shich Lucas speaks.

I'll post some times myself with my Renntech SLK38K in the appropriate forum, once I get the differential changed so the gearing is appropriate to the power of the car.