Thinking of purchasing this combo and im looking for some independent (non-tuner) dynos of this package. Also please state if it was a mail order tune of custom dyno tune. Thanks!

 

idk what the car put down before my stage 1 but I just dynoed with 20" wheels and the car put down 440rwhp and 520rwtq on a dyno dynamics with a box tune and a 168 RENNTech pulley idk if that helps but take it for what it is.

 

I would like to know too. I am about ready to run the same setup and want to know what the number differences are going to be.

 

Stock 55's on a dynamic dyno put 400-420 rwhp. Stage 1 pulley and a box tune should be around 450-465. I just did one with a 180mm pulley and a dyno tune on a dynamic put 496rwhp and 550 rwtq........

 

496rwhp and 550rwtq with just a tune and 180mm pulley? what brand pulley and tune seems kind of high especially on a DD they are referred to as the heart break dyno. can you post up a dyno graph? thnx

 

stock on a dd should be around 380rwhp. you may want to have that dyno (or it's operator) recalibrated!

 

HOLY MOLY!

 

Serg,

I know you are a well respected tuner but my experience with the Dyno Dynamics has been quite different. Are you talking about the DD @ Autowave? The one where bassn_07 dyno'd?

In my experience with DD - 390-410rwhp for stock E55. 430-445 for Pulley/ECU/HE, and 450-470 for Pulley/ECU/HE/Shorty Headers/80MM TB.

ECU'd 600 cars make about 460-470rwhp and around 600-620rwtq. Stock 65 cars make around 460rwhp and 600rwtq as well. Only 55 I have seen to do over 500rwhp on dyno dynamics was one with a 150shot of spray.

I think you would agree that picking up 100rwhp with just a pulley and tune seems a bit "generous" - wouldn't you agree?

-m

 

This is a little off topic, but I wanted to bring it up because I really want to understand the reasoning behind it: in the past 4 months or so, I have seen 4 different dyno dynamics machines showing greatly varying numbers: 2 of the dyno machines showed numbers that were "slightly higher" than dynojet numbers, one showed numbers "slightly lower" than dynojet numbers, and finally the last one showed extremely lower numbers. What causes that variation? I've also experienced same results with Mustant dyno

 

Happens with ALL dynos, an inherent problem. Correction factors, configurations, etc., etc. With Benzes it is often difficult to get an RPM signal so at least on Dyno Dynamics they will often try to input the gear ratios/rpm manually at a certain speed and this gives skewed results. It's really kind of frustrating...

-m

 

Yeah, I've noticed when my car was on a Mustang dyno, we could not get an rpm reading easily, so we ended up going through the OBDII port, but that didn't help much because the refresh rate was so terrible... We weren't able to get accurate enough readings. Next time, we'll just go directly off the coil packs.

 

More than likey he's using the same Dyno Dynamics as I used at Autowave. What's the big deal on how high or low it reads when compared to the one at CPT? It makes me laugh the that people put so much emphasis on dyno numbers.... I know for a fact that everyone out there will get different numbers on different dyno's, who cares. So what if my dyno numbers seemed high, did I take it to the track and have good results...yes. Did I back up my dyno numbers, probably not in the eyes of the "heartbreak dyno at CPT". It just get's me frustrated that the same people that taught me not to care about dyno numbers keep on making comments about these numbers. Marcus, I have much respect for you and you have helped me a lot but aren't you the one that taught me to back it up at the track?

I know you're comparing me with the other car in your area that dynode 460 rwhp on CPT's DD. I guess that car trapped 11.4xx and 126 mph during the cooler months and I did 11.2xx at 128 during summer. Maybe my car doesn't make 500+ rwhp on DD but it was good enough to trap higher than any other E55 out there during the dead of heat. Anyone else breaking records out there during summer? Sorry guys, I just got frustrated at some of the pm's and comments I get about my car reading unusually high numbers for a DD. Well crap, I had my car dynode on a dynojet back when I was a VR600 and I got 470 rwhp and 480 rwtq but my car still turned a 11.49 and a best trap speed of 124.5.

To finish of my rant, I've learned so much from many members at MBW and most will agree that dyno numbers don't mean *****...period. I used the dyno at hand for tuning and comparative reasons for my new mods. I was able to see the difference between a 80 and 82mm throttle body, which was 18 rwhp at the top end. The funny thing about it is that some of the people out there make it hard to share the results because we just don't like hearing the ***** that comes with it. IMHO.

 

Whoa whoa whoa... easy there buddy. I barely even mentioned you in my post and really I was just looking to make a discussion, not to question your dyno numbers. What are you getting so worked up for? Yes, I was insinuating that the Autowave dyno seems to show higher dyno #s than other Dyno Dynamics based on what you posted. Why are you coming on here to defend yourself? I told you that I still thought the number was really high but who cares? I'm not trying to discredit you or take away from your car being fast? Did you have a rough day or something?

If Serge is in fact saying that stock 55s dyno 400rwhp @ Autowave, and then he's gotten a pulley ECU car to do 496rwhp - that means he's getting 100rwhp from just a pulley and tune??? That seems very hard for me to swallow, and I don't care what kind of dyno we are talking about. The topic of discussion is in regards to dyno #s for certain dynos and MB_Forever began the discussion about how dyno's vary from one to the other. I am actually personally curious as well because Dyno Dynamics are not very common and I'd like to know what else is out there. I have trouble believing the Autowave dyno because of this 96rwhp gain from minimal mods... but who knows. If I don't ask how will I learn?

Furthermore, EVERYTHING out there in terms of measuring performance is questionable. Dyno numbers, 0-60, even trap speeds. Did you see the video of me versus that M6? That M6 has trapped 121mph. The best I have gotten out of my 65 to date is 117.8mph, but I walked away from that M6 FROM A ROLL. My 65 has been dyno'ing low and trapping low, but I was able to beat an M6 that I KNOW has trapped 120-121mph multiple, multiple times at numerous tracks. He is a personal friend of mine. Now, I can somewhat explain WHY that happened, but it goes against everything that is commonly accepted in regards to dyno and trap speeds. In the end all of this stuff is lunacy and should be taken with a grain of salt.

Your car totally flies and you have the slips to prove it. In this thread the topic of Dyno Dynamics came up and I was just sharing my experience (hence me saying in my post "my experience has been quite different"). I compare to CPT because it's what I know, and if that contradicts your experience well what can I say? I'm not asking you to care about what I've experienced, I'm participating in the discussion here. Maybe I will learn something from Serge? If I don't participate, there is no discussion. If there is no discussion, there is no education.

For what it's worth - I'm not just comparing your car to the other 55 that traps similar to you, I'm also comparing it to other MBs whether they be 55s, 600s, or 65s. I'm not going to say that your numbers "make sense" to me when they don't, because then I would be dishonest. If you don't like that I disagree with your dyno numbers, that is unfortunate, but it doesn't change much. In order for me to broaden my experience I participate in discussions such as these.

I think your 4 page thread really got you worked up, as you normally are a much cooler headed. My questioning of your dyno #s, has NOTHING to do with your integrity, and as far as you know, they are solid #s. I told you that dyno #s are not a big deal and the only reason I mentioned your name was because Serge is now talking about another dyno run that contradicts what I've seen. Pulley/Tune car making 500rwhp on Dyno Dynamics? My experience has told me otherwise. 96 rwhp with just a pulley and tune doesn't sound a little strange to you? How many pulley/ECU 55s do we have out there? I know Serge is good but 100rwhp from those simple mods? Maybe I'm wrong...

-m

 

I'm sorry guys, I didn't mean to stir up controversy with my post. I am actually genuinely trying to understand some of the dyno differences. When my car dynoed between 440 to 500 rwhp on a Mustang Dyno, I was pissed. I wasted 4 hours to get meaningless numbers. Then I was told that dyno dynamics vary less, but to date, I've seen them vary almost the same. As Marcus have mentioned, the operator, the different settings, and conversions all play a roll in such variations. I am going to re-dyno my car on the same dyno (apparently a rep came out from Mustang Dyno corporate to re-caliberate the machine) as well as other dynos and will report the results as always.

Marcus, Serge mentioned that he saw stock E55s putting down 400 to 425 rwhp.... so maybe the car that dynoed at 496 rwhp was a strong stock car, in which case, it may have been around 425 or even 430 rwhp when stock. That would make the gains only 65 to 70 rwhp with pulley + tune..... still a very high number but much more realistic than 100 rwhp. Also, there are a couple of suggestions that may explain the recent high numbers from Autowave's dyno dynamics....

- The tuning companies keep revising their tunes as they unlock more and more power of the 55k engine.

- Better parts and "smaller" mods are much more available now and are being used more effectively, and they do add up.

These are just general suggestions that I thought of and are by no means any claims to Alan's or Serge's cars.

 

That is absolutely possible Mo but like I said, you will only find these things out through discussion/debate. If tuners are now magically unlocking this kind of power then I need to get Serge or Powerchips out here to Chicago ASAP... I could use another 70rwhp...

-m

 

Hey Marcus, You're absolutely correct, I did have a crappy day at work. Like you said I'm typically a cool headed person but I received a few pm's that just didn't sit well with me.

I really didn't mean to direct my post toward you but I did and there's no doubt I'm becoming more and more sensitive to the matter. I just hate the fact I had good dyno numbers and some decent track numbers to back it up but still find myself defending my numbers. I basically just saw my name, autowave, and high numbers and felt like I was once again going to defend myself. I know I shouldn't let these things get to me but sometimes they just do.

Please except my apologies because you've been very helpful and I appreciate it. I should have posted my thoughts without directing them towards you. I always enjoy reading your post as they are always honest and insightful. I probably should stay off the monster drinks after a bad day at work...

 

bro, you backed up your numbers so there's nothing else you need to worry about on the subject, regardless of what is said or possibly implied.

on the other topic at hand, almost 500rwhp from a pulley and tune only is unheard of on any dyno, especically a dd machine. that's more than 10hp than i had when i ran a famoso last year so that car theoretically should be running 11.1x on just a pulley and tune! sorry but i have to call bs.

put that dyno in shootout mode then take that car to the track and post the data so we can figure this out.

 

LOL..... everyone could use another 70 rwhp, especially my slow E63

I'm not saying the tune alone attributed to that, but I'm suggesting that the tune (combined with the newer parts) "may" have attributed to some good numbers. Remember, Alan has the all new 82 mm TB and Serge has been developing a 90 mm TB, and I'm sure it may have contributed some of the increase.... but then again, maybe not... who knows

I do agree that it is better to talk about the differences in a healthy discussion than just ignore them. To me personally, it allows me to learn more about a subject that I love.

Regarding Alan's car, I think it is one strong machine..... it is very worthy of the 530 rwhp on the dyno And after Famoso, it may trap 130 mph

 

Thanks Mike. I over reacted on a subjet that has been bugging my for a while....

I have no problem posting my thoughts but they should be done in a manner without pointing fingers or attacking someone.

Regardless, Serge's number do seem high but after posting high numbers myself and being questioned, I'll give him the benifit of doubt. I'll anxiously await track numbers and comment afterwards.

 

 

Spot on Mikey... that is exactly what I was thinking. I didn't mean to drag Alan into this but honestly I raised a brow when Alan posted his numbers (again Alan, not trying to discredit you!!!) and if this same dyno is now showing 55k cars gaining 80-100rwhp with JUST pulley and tune... it would just seem all to be a little "strange". I can accept Alan's dyno being that he's run 128mph more than I can accept a 55 getting 80-100rwhp from pulley/tune.

I know where you are coming from Mo, and what you are speculating is really what I am trying to figure out. I'm sure everyone on the forums would love to make that kind of power with such minor mods, so best thing to do is find out what the whole story is.

I have never questioned whether or not Alan's car is flying... trap speed says it all...

-m

 

Here's my before and after, 172mm eurocharged pulley, cm30 pump, and custom let tune.

https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...e-numbers.html

 

Thanks, i saw those when they were originally posted and was hoping there were more. Did you ever run your friend again with the stock cls?

 

Correction to my earlier post. As many as you have guessed, I forgot to mention that the 496RWHP also includes my equal length shorty headers, secondary cat delete, upgraded H/E and CM30 pump. Here is the dyno...

 

Here is an E55 that I recently did my Stage 1 + cooling on...