Premature bearing failure due to pulleys
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From: So Cal
2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
Premature bearing failure due to pulleys
I just got off the phone with Cory and he advised against installing any pulley larger than 168mm as this will lead to premature bearing failure on the supercharger. The bad part is that you cannot replace just the bearings but must replace the entire supercharger. These factory SCs are hard to find brand new and their are no aftermarket remanufacturers either.
I also learned that the E55 SC is only 1.8litre capacity but because the rotors are hollow they can spin much faster (24K rpm stock) up to 30K rpm with an oversized pulley. The gear ratios also allow for the faster rotation speed. The hollow rotors are more fragile than the solid rotors of other blowers and are another potential failure point.
Has anyone's supercharger with a 180mm or 190mm pulley had bearing failure after extended drag duty and high mileage?
The reason I called Cory is because I wanted to install an OEM E55 blower if it can spin faster than my Kleemann Autorotor twin-screw.
I also learned that the E55 SC is only 1.8litre capacity but because the rotors are hollow they can spin much faster (24K rpm stock) up to 30K rpm with an oversized pulley. The gear ratios also allow for the faster rotation speed. The hollow rotors are more fragile than the solid rotors of other blowers and are another potential failure point.
Has anyone's supercharger with a 180mm or 190mm pulley had bearing failure after extended drag duty and high mileage?
The reason I called Cory is because I wanted to install an OEM E55 blower if it can spin faster than my Kleemann Autorotor twin-screw.
Last edited by AMGSC; Oct 13, 2009 at 05:41 PM.
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Makes sense that the bearings would wear more spinning faster, but then will it all just be primarily usage (mileage) based? Big question, what's that limit? Kleemann should kinda know the answer, since they made the statement. Or is it simply all theoretical?
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From what I gathered, it's the heat and friction that increases exponentially as the rotation speed increases.
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06 E55
I just got off the phone with Cory and he advised against installing any pulley larger than 168mm as this will lead to premature bearing failure on the supercharger. The bad part is that you cannot replace just the bearings but must replace the entire supercharger. These factory SCs are hard to find brand new and their are no aftermarket remanufacturers either.
The reason I called Cory is because I wanted to install an OEM E55 blower if it can spin faster than my Kleemann Autorotor twin-screw.
The reason I called Cory is because I wanted to install an OEM E55 blower if it can spin faster than my Kleemann Autorotor twin-screw.
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V12-Biturbo
Robert, there's a seller on Ebay that sells remanufactured 55k Blowers
I just got off the phone with Cory and he advised against installing any pulley larger than 168mm as this will lead to premature bearing failure on the supercharger. The bad part is that you cannot replace just the bearings but must replace the entire supercharger. These factory SCs are hard to find brand new and their are no aftermarket remanufacturers either.
I also learned that the E55 SC is only 1.8litre capacity but because the rotors are hollow they can spin much faster (24K rpm stock) up to 30K rpm with an oversized pulley. The gear ratios also allow for the faster rotation speed. The hollow rotors are more fragile than the solid rotors of other blowers and are another potential failure point.
Has anyone's supercharger with a 180mm or 190mm pulley had bearing failure after extended drag duty and high mileage?
The reason I called Cory is because I wanted to install an OEM E55 blower if it can spin faster than my Kleemann Autorotor twin-screw.
I also learned that the E55 SC is only 1.8litre capacity but because the rotors are hollow they can spin much faster (24K rpm stock) up to 30K rpm with an oversized pulley. The gear ratios also allow for the faster rotation speed. The hollow rotors are more fragile than the solid rotors of other blowers and are another potential failure point.
Has anyone's supercharger with a 180mm or 190mm pulley had bearing failure after extended drag duty and high mileage?
The reason I called Cory is because I wanted to install an OEM E55 blower if it can spin faster than my Kleemann Autorotor twin-screw.
based outt've Malibu, CA $3750 O.B.O.http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MERCE...Q5fAccessories
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From: So Cal
2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
You've come this far, I say spin the sheet outta it! if it grenades replacement around the corner based outt've Malibu, CA $3750 O.B.O.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MERCE...Q5fAccessories
based outt've Malibu, CA $3750 O.B.O.http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MERCE...Q5fAccessories
Do you have the remanufacturers contact info? Maybe other E55 owners know where to look but maybe not.
Last edited by AMGSC; Oct 13, 2009 at 06:55 PM.
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1 ) This offer is for a brand new original Mercedes Supercharger
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This is not a rebuilt or after-market , this is a brand new original AMG / Mercedes Part !
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For more info please e-mail or call ( 310 ) 457 1709
Last edited by Thericker; Oct 13, 2009 at 07:01 PM.
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'03 SL55
If you asked the engineers at AMG, they would say any pulley size larger than 154mm leads to premature failure. And they should know: they designed the engine! If the 168mm pulley was perfectly safe, they'd have used it instead of the 154mm.
Bottom line: if you want the longest lived supercharger possible, stick with the AMG pulley. A larger pulley will necessarily shorten the supercharger life. The larger the pulley, the shorter the life.
Bottom line: if you want the longest lived supercharger possible, stick with the AMG pulley. A larger pulley will necessarily shorten the supercharger life. The larger the pulley, the shorter the life.
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From: Texas
2003 CL55
I just got off the phone with Cory and he advised against installing any pulley larger than 168mm as this will lead to premature bearing failure on the supercharger. The bad part is that you cannot replace just the bearings but must replace the entire supercharger. These factory SCs are hard to find brand new and their are no aftermarket remanufacturers either.
I also learned that the E55 SC is only 1.8litre capacity but because the rotors are hollow they can spin much faster (24K rpm stock) up to 30K rpm with an oversized pulley. The gear ratios also allow for the faster rotation speed. The hollow rotors are more fragile than the solid rotors of other blowers and are another potential failure point.
Has anyone's supercharger with a 180mm or 190mm pulley had bearing failure after extended drag duty and high mileage?
The reason I called Cory is because I wanted to install an OEM E55 blower if it can spin faster than my Kleemann Autorotor twin-screw.
I also learned that the E55 SC is only 1.8litre capacity but because the rotors are hollow they can spin much faster (24K rpm stock) up to 30K rpm with an oversized pulley. The gear ratios also allow for the faster rotation speed. The hollow rotors are more fragile than the solid rotors of other blowers and are another potential failure point.
Has anyone's supercharger with a 180mm or 190mm pulley had bearing failure after extended drag duty and high mileage?
The reason I called Cory is because I wanted to install an OEM E55 blower if it can spin faster than my Kleemann Autorotor twin-screw.
It is kind of a general statement that could be applied to any mod or even driving a car fast.. Most mods create more wear and tear on a car, just like driving them hard. Super charger is damn cheap compared to the amount of tire wear I get from my 180mm pulley..lol
Plus1 on spinning the hell out of everything!
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E63 Biturbo, UPD Cold Air induction kit, UPD performance crank pulley and UPD adjustable rear suspension with ride height adjustment.
CL55 UPD Cold Air Boost kit, UPD 3000 stall converter, UPD 77mm SC clutched pulley and beltwrap kit, Custom long tubes, UPD crank pulley , UPD suspension kit, UPD SC pulley, Aux. HE, Trunk tank w/rule 2000 pump, Mezeire pump, UPD 5pc idler set, Aluminum rotor hats.
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C55,SL55,C63
I've recently contacted Whipple, one of the techs there who I was talking with via email, feels the AMG supercharger can be fitted with Whipple's internals. I don't think anyone has done it, But it might be worth looking into.
Maybe Autoroter can fit some cool parts to your kleemann blower?
Maybe Autoroter can fit some cool parts to your kleemann blower?
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if that was to happen to me..
i would use my auto club to tow me back to my garage, hire my mechanic to remove the pulley, put the stock piece and call the auto club to take me to the dealer.
Chrysler Warranty!
Dealers don't care how you raped your car, as long you have extended warranty.
So far Chrysler has paid $5k out of their end.. and I'm still making payments on the $3200 for a 3 year unlimited miles.
The same thing is said about turbo cars.. too much boost.. ect..
i would use my auto club to tow me back to my garage, hire my mechanic to remove the pulley, put the stock piece and call the auto club to take me to the dealer.
Chrysler Warranty!
Dealers don't care how you raped your car, as long you have extended warranty.
So far Chrysler has paid $5k out of their end.. and I'm still making payments on the $3200 for a 3 year unlimited miles.
The same thing is said about turbo cars.. too much boost.. ect..
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fwiw, here's a PSE rebuilder, and looks like they use better bearings(?) Seems like if they can replace bearings, somebody else should be able to.
http://www.superchargersonline.com/p...SE-MBZ-AMG-E55
Still kinda pricey, but a lot less than OEM.
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'03 E55, Range Rover Sport Supercharged, Ducati 748R
i've been running a 178-180mm pulley for just short of 100k miles (125k on the car now). i have had my s/c clutch go out due to bearing failure but that bearing is a $17 replaceable part. i'll let everyone know if my s/c bearing ever goes out.
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2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
That's understandable. No doubt there are MB white papers on tolerances with all their components.
fwiw, here's a PSE rebuilder, and looks like they use better bearings(?) Seems like if they can replace bearings, somebody else should be able to.
http://www.superchargersonline.com/p...SE-MBZ-AMG-E55
Still kinda pricey, but a lot less than OEM.
fwiw, here's a PSE rebuilder, and looks like they use better bearings(?) Seems like if they can replace bearings, somebody else should be able to.
http://www.superchargersonline.com/p...SE-MBZ-AMG-E55
Still kinda pricey, but a lot less than OEM.
Thread Starter
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From: So Cal
2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
If you asked the engineers at AMG, they would say any pulley size larger than 154mm leads to premature failure. And they should know: they designed the engine! If the 168mm pulley was perfectly safe, they'd have used it instead of the 154mm.
Bottom line: if you want the longest lived supercharger possible, stick with the AMG pulley. A larger pulley will necessarily shorten the supercharger life. The larger the pulley, the shorter the life.
Bottom line: if you want the longest lived supercharger possible, stick with the AMG pulley. A larger pulley will necessarily shorten the supercharger life. The larger the pulley, the shorter the life.
btw...I just bought that brand new SL55 blower and will keep it in my garage as a backup blower to my Kleemann.
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haters crazy
I was told the reason Kleemann switched from autorotor chargers to eaton is because autorotor went out of business
And yea, spin the charger to its efficiency and not past it! At a certain point you will be making so much heat that its counterproductive. Are you seriously gonna not boost the crap out of it because of premature bearing failure? Come on man, almost anything that makes more power will lead to premature part failure. What is your goal? I think you are getting way ahead of yourself. If my car can run tens on ~7.5PSI do you understand how rediculous 25PSI is (if the charger is even efficient at those levels, which I seriously doubt)? This isnt a 4banger, its a 5.4L V8!
And yea, spin the charger to its efficiency and not past it! At a certain point you will be making so much heat that its counterproductive. Are you seriously gonna not boost the crap out of it because of premature bearing failure? Come on man, almost anything that makes more power will lead to premature part failure. What is your goal? I think you are getting way ahead of yourself. If my car can run tens on ~7.5PSI do you understand how rediculous 25PSI is (if the charger is even efficient at those levels, which I seriously doubt)? This isnt a 4banger, its a 5.4L V8!
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Anyway us N/A guys don't know nuttin' about superchargers anyway.
But good info and a good read.....
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211-55
My previous Eaton M90 supercharged car had a 3.7" stock pulley. I ran a 2.8" pulley from 92,000 miles until 170,000 miles. It's far from the same supercharger in our AMGs but it had no issues when I sold the car.
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i read somehwere tha the E55 Supercharger is a 2.2L while the C32 unit is a 1.8L. just tried looking for the source page but could not find it ...will look more later.
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2006 E55 AMG
And yea, spin the charger to its efficiency and not past it! At a certain point you will be making so much heat that its counterproductive. Are you seriously gonna not boost the crap out of it because of premature bearing failure? Come on man, almost anything that makes more power will lead to premature part failure. What is your goal? I think you are getting way ahead of yourself. If my car can run tens on ~7.5PSI do you understand how rediculous 25PSI is (if the charger is even efficient at those levels, which I seriously doubt)? This isnt a 4banger, its a 5.4L V8!
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From: Glendale Arizona
C55,SL55,C63
I was told the reason Kleemann switched from autorotor chargers to eaton is because autorotor went out of business
And yea, spin the charger to its efficiency and not past it! At a certain point you will be making so much heat that its counterproductive. Are you seriously gonna not boost the crap out of it because of premature bearing failure? Come on man, almost anything that makes more power will lead to premature part failure. What is your goal? I think you are getting way ahead of yourself. If my car can run tens on ~7.5PSI do you understand how rediculous 25PSI is (if the charger is even efficient at those levels, which I seriously doubt)? This isnt a 4banger, its a 5.4L V8!
And yea, spin the charger to its efficiency and not past it! At a certain point you will be making so much heat that its counterproductive. Are you seriously gonna not boost the crap out of it because of premature bearing failure? Come on man, almost anything that makes more power will lead to premature part failure. What is your goal? I think you are getting way ahead of yourself. If my car can run tens on ~7.5PSI do you understand how rediculous 25PSI is (if the charger is even efficient at those levels, which I seriously doubt)? This isnt a 4banger, its a 5.4L V8!
I wonder if you could get some stuff from kenne bell?
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2015 S212
That is a blanket statement that is in the grey zone. As has been asked, why 168 and not 175?
As mentioned, you pay to play. Honestly, I am starting to wonder if a stage 5 should run a 178mm. It may be that we need better cooling. The reason I ask is that there are many EVOsport / RennTech cars that are very fast with 168mm pullies. I am dying to see data from the guys converting from 168mm to the 178mm and see what they think. You listening, Terence?
Last thing, The 55k is 2.3L. At least one car has shown that the AMG SC makes more power than the Kleeman SC. Isn't that what this is really all about?
As mentioned, you pay to play. Honestly, I am starting to wonder if a stage 5 should run a 178mm. It may be that we need better cooling. The reason I ask is that there are many EVOsport / RennTech cars that are very fast with 168mm pullies. I am dying to see data from the guys converting from 168mm to the 178mm and see what they think. You listening, Terence?
Last thing, The 55k is 2.3L. At least one car has shown that the AMG SC makes more power than the Kleeman SC. Isn't that what this is really all about?
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From: Orange County, CA
GMC - Miata - Trek - P-Car
Any reciprocating component’s load increases at the square of its speed. It’s simple physics.
AMG’s IHI-sourced supercharger bearings are available from selected aftermarket sources when their replacement owing to excessive wear is, in fact, deemed necessary. Any such trivialities ought to be the furthest thing from your mind at this point during your build, AMGCL65. Know you’ve a substantial bankroll to fund your quest for speed. Get the bloody thing roadworthy first – and only then worry about conquering its potential ancillary hardware longevity demons. Crank pulleys are easy enough to have your technician swap in order to finalize its boost.
All due best wishes of course, but you’ll likely have several far more pressing challenges which need to be addressed long before then.
AMG’s IHI-sourced supercharger bearings are available from selected aftermarket sources when their replacement owing to excessive wear is, in fact, deemed necessary. Any such trivialities ought to be the furthest thing from your mind at this point during your build, AMGCL65. Know you’ve a substantial bankroll to fund your quest for speed. Get the bloody thing roadworthy first – and only then worry about conquering its potential ancillary hardware longevity demons. Crank pulleys are easy enough to have your technician swap in order to finalize its boost.
All due best wishes of course, but you’ll likely have several far more pressing challenges which need to be addressed long before then.
