Supercharger Info
#1
Supercharger Info
I was thinking it would be nice to have one thread that has a bunch of info in regards to the AMG supercharger on the 55k motors in one thread. I don't know much about them but I know if we all post what we know we can build a wealth of knowledge on them. If someone could post the sc pulley diameter and if there is a internal gear ratio I could post how fast the Sc is spinning with different crank pulley sizes. If someone knows what these sc are rated to spin to or an efficiency map, post it. Then we can see what size would be overspinning the sc and out of its efficiency. I have heard differing opinions on the size of the blower, anyone know for sure what size it is? I heard it is an IHI unit. Also read it is a Lysholm unit . I have heard everything from 1.8 to 2.3L
Last edited by blackbenzz; 05-19-2010 at 11:12 AM.
#2
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From: Brooklyn, NY/Tampa, FL
2005 BLK/BLK E-Double Nickel.
Great Idea
its a IHI unit?.. that would mean our superchargers are made in Japan? i think IHI is a japanese company... don't know why i thought it was lysom..
#4
I was told it was an IHI unit, maybe it isn't Thi sis one of the reasons why I started this thread, to get clarity on what is true and what isn't.
This thread has alot of good info in it:
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...essor-map.html
This thread has alot of good info in it:
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...essor-map.html
#5
Former Vendor of MBWorld
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From: Valley of the Sun, Arizona
C63, SL55, E55, CLS55, ML63, C55
IHI makes some good stuff, they make turbos for a bunch of cars. Mercedes is the only supercharger that I currently know they make, I wouldn't be surprised if IHI has other cars running IHI superchargers. I just haven't seen any, not like I've been looking though.
The AMG/IHI supercharger is a Lyshom style supercharger. Mercedes runs this supercharger with a 2:1 ratio. The stock crank pulley is twice the size of the supercharger pulley. Stock crank pulley being 152mm and the the supercharger being 76mm. With that said the supercharger spins at double the engines RPMs in a stock application.
The AMG/IHI supercharger is a Lyshom style supercharger. Mercedes runs this supercharger with a 2:1 ratio. The stock crank pulley is twice the size of the supercharger pulley. Stock crank pulley being 152mm and the the supercharger being 76mm. With that said the supercharger spins at double the engines RPMs in a stock application.
Last edited by MBH motorsports; 05-19-2010 at 11:20 AM.
#6
That is another topic that has people stating different things. Stock crank pulley diameter and interal ratio of sc. I've heard 1.66:1 for 55k cars and SLR has 1.83:1 It is so hard to find out what the real values are. For the crank I've heard from 150 to 157mm
If stock crank is 152mm and sc pulley is 76mm then at 6500rpm the supercharger pulley is spinning at 13000rpm. Depending on what the internal gearing is it would be even higher.
If stock crank is 152mm and sc pulley is 76mm then at 6500rpm the supercharger pulley is spinning at 13000rpm. Depending on what the internal gearing is it would be even higher.
#7
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2003 E55 & 2014 GL550
Well the guts are not spinning at 13,000rpm
but 23,000rpms!!
And that is a stocker. Imagine me with a 185 and smaller supercharger pulley.
I know I am well over the law of dimishing returns but it feels so good to swing a big stick sometimes.
http://autospeed.com/cms/title_Supercharger-Steal-Part-Two/A_110295/article.html
The most potent supercharged Mercedes is the SL55 AMG. With a 5.4-litre V8 thumping out 350kW and 700Nm (from just 2650 rpm) that should come as no surprise!
The SL55 AMG’s highly efficient Lysholm-type supercharger (manufactured by IHI) features Teflon coated compressor screws and is driven at more than 23,000 rpm at an engine speed of 6500 rpm. At this speed, the blower displaces 1850kg of induction air per hour and generates up to 12 psi of boost pressure. The supercharger is also equipped with an electro-magnetic clutch that is used to switch it on/off depending on rpm and load. A water-to-air intercooler is also used to help achieve that magic 350kW.
And then there’s the smaller Mercedes SLK32 and C32 AMG.
but 23,000rpms!!
And that is a stocker. Imagine me with a 185 and smaller supercharger pulley.
I know I am well over the law of dimishing returns but it feels so good to swing a big stick sometimes.
http://autospeed.com/cms/title_Supercharger-Steal-Part-Two/A_110295/article.html
The most potent supercharged Mercedes is the SL55 AMG. With a 5.4-litre V8 thumping out 350kW and 700Nm (from just 2650 rpm) that should come as no surprise!
The SL55 AMG’s highly efficient Lysholm-type supercharger (manufactured by IHI) features Teflon coated compressor screws and is driven at more than 23,000 rpm at an engine speed of 6500 rpm. At this speed, the blower displaces 1850kg of induction air per hour and generates up to 12 psi of boost pressure. The supercharger is also equipped with an electro-magnetic clutch that is used to switch it on/off depending on rpm and load. A water-to-air intercooler is also used to help achieve that magic 350kW.
And then there’s the smaller Mercedes SLK32 and C32 AMG.
Last edited by Jakpro1; 05-19-2010 at 05:17 PM.
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#8
Well the guts are not spinning at 13,000rpm
but 23,000rpms!!
And that is a stocker. Imagine me with a 185 and smaller supercharger pulley.
I know I am well over the law of dimishing returns but it feels so good to swing a big stick sometimes.
http://autospeed.com/cms/title_Supercharger-Steal-Part-Two/A_110295/article.html
The most potent supercharged Mercedes is the SL55 AMG. With a 5.4-litre V8 thumping out 350kW and 700Nm (from just 2650 rpm) that should come as no surprise!
The SL55 AMG’s highly efficient Lysholm-type supercharger (manufactured by IHI) features Teflon coated compressor screws and is driven at more than 23,000 rpm at an engine speed of 6500 rpm. At this speed, the blower displaces 1850kg of induction air per hour and generates up to 12 psi of boost pressure. The supercharger is also equipped with an electro-magnetic clutch that is used to switch it on/off depending on rpm and load. A water-to-air intercooler is also used to help achieve that magic 350kW.
And then there’s the smaller Mercedes SLK32 and C32 AMG.
but 23,000rpms!!
And that is a stocker. Imagine me with a 185 and smaller supercharger pulley.
I know I am well over the law of dimishing returns but it feels so good to swing a big stick sometimes.
http://autospeed.com/cms/title_Supercharger-Steal-Part-Two/A_110295/article.html
The most potent supercharged Mercedes is the SL55 AMG. With a 5.4-litre V8 thumping out 350kW and 700Nm (from just 2650 rpm) that should come as no surprise!
The SL55 AMG’s highly efficient Lysholm-type supercharger (manufactured by IHI) features Teflon coated compressor screws and is driven at more than 23,000 rpm at an engine speed of 6500 rpm. At this speed, the blower displaces 1850kg of induction air per hour and generates up to 12 psi of boost pressure. The supercharger is also equipped with an electro-magnetic clutch that is used to switch it on/off depending on rpm and load. A water-to-air intercooler is also used to help achieve that magic 350kW.
And then there’s the smaller Mercedes SLK32 and C32 AMG.
Last edited by blackbenzz; 05-19-2010 at 05:22 PM.
#9
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2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
From what I remember the 55K and the SLR share the same blower.
55K - 11.6 psi (0.8 bar)
SLR - 13 psi (0.9 bar)
SLR 722 GT - 25 psi (1.75 bar)
55K - 11.6 psi (0.8 bar)
SLR - 13 psi (0.9 bar)
SLR 722 GT - 25 psi (1.75 bar)
#11
#12
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
I'm going to have my S/C taken apart to see if changing those gears is possible or not. I'm interested in knowing how the SLR 722 GT gets 25 psi.
#13
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From: Valley of the Sun, Arizona
C63, SL55, E55, CLS55, ML63, C55
Hey bro, do you know if it was ever confirmed that the SLR's S/C has more boost through different gearing on the rotors and not a larger pulley?
I'm going to have my S/C taken apart to see if changing those gears is possible or not. I'm interested in knowing how the SLR 722 GT gets 25 psi.
I'm going to have my S/C taken apart to see if changing those gears is possible or not. I'm interested in knowing how the SLR 722 GT gets 25 psi.
Every now and again we see one. So if an SLR passed my way for a dyno run, I'll make a mental note to log the boost.
#14
Ahmad why are you messing with blowers still... we have them because we have to... you need to throw it in the garbage and find a way to get a couple of turbos on your car. It really wouldn't be as bad as you think.
-m
-m
#15
Hey bro, do you know if it was ever confirmed that the SLR's S/C has more boost through different gearing on the rotors and not a larger pulley?
I'm going to have my S/C taken apart to see if changing those gears is possible or not. I'm interested in knowing how the SLR 722 GT gets 25 psi.
I'm going to have my S/C taken apart to see if changing those gears is possible or not. I'm interested in knowing how the SLR 722 GT gets 25 psi.
Remember, it's not about BOOST... it's about FLOW. Boost is a measure of pressure, not power. Give me a car that makes 800hp with 10psi over one that makes it with 30psi any day of the week.
-m
#16
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
I might be able to find out this info... I think the first place to state would be cross refinancing the SC's part numbers. IF they are the same, then we know what it is.
Every now and again we see one. So if an SLR passed my way for a dyno run, I'll make a mental note to log the boost.
Every now and again we see one. So if an SLR passed my way for a dyno run, I'll make a mental note to log the boost.
Now if only you could log the boost of an SLR 722 GT!
From this pic the crank pulley "looks" stock, but the base model SLR has just 1.4 psi (0.1 bar) more boost than our 55K.
The gearing of the SLR and the 55K "looks" to be the same size when you compare these two pics. Be advised that the S/C is upside down in the lower pic of the 55K.
SLR S/C Gears
55K S/C Gears
#17
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2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
Havoc you are asking the wrong question. I can make you get 25psi, too. Just reduce the volume of air that can flow through your motor and you can make a lot of boost!
Remember, it's not about BOOST... it's about FLOW. Boost is a measure of pressure, not power. Give me a car that makes 800hp with 10psi over one that makes it with 30psi any day of the week.
-m
Remember, it's not about BOOST... it's about FLOW. Boost is a measure of pressure, not power. Give me a car that makes 800hp with 10psi over one that makes it with 30psi any day of the week.
-m
My build is all about more FLOW.. larger displacement, bigger cams and valves, ported heads and S/C, and larger top mounted coolers all of which will lower my boost because of added airflow. I get that. But I want to bring my BOOST back up in addition to having more FLOW.
I'm trying to understand how the SLR 722 GT makes 25 psi. Is the S/C the same as ours and is it spining that fast? I know the SLR has reduced compression compared to our 55Ks, but wouldn't that increase airflow? Have any ideas??
Last edited by Havoc; 05-25-2010 at 07:28 AM.
#18
Havoc you are asking the wrong question. I can make you get 25psi, too. Just reduce the volume of air that can flow through your motor and you can make a lot of boost!
Remember, it's not about BOOST... it's about FLOW. Boost is a measure of pressure, not power. Give me a car that makes 800hp with 10psi over one that makes it with 30psi any day of the week.
-m
Remember, it's not about BOOST... it's about FLOW. Boost is a measure of pressure, not power. Give me a car that makes 800hp with 10psi over one that makes it with 30psi any day of the week.
-m
Now that I have a CTS-V, I have had to do some research on supercharged V8s. Over on the Cadillac forum I found it extremely useful when members put together a sort of table showing the affects of changing upper and lower pulleys here is an example (Post #7):
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...ml#post2229556
Tom
#19
Looks like they have different superchargers
M155-090-06-80-88 COMPRESSO $13550.00 M155-090-06-80-70 CORE $7390.00
M113-090-05-80-88 COMPRESSO $3690.00 M113-090-05-80-70 CORE $1350.00
M155-090-06-80-88 COMPRESSO $13550.00 M155-090-06-80-70 CORE $7390.00
M113-090-05-80-88 COMPRESSO $3690.00 M113-090-05-80-70 CORE $1350.00
#20
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
Hmmm, now I just need to find out the difference between the SLR and the SLR 722 GT Superchargers??
#21
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
Excellent point! Just as you will probably lose boost when installing headers, but who cares so long as the overall flow (i.e. HP) increases.
Now that I have a CTS-V, I have had to do some research on supercharged V8s. Over on the Cadillac forum I found it extremely useful when members put together a sort of table showing the affects of changing upper and lower pulleys here is an example (Post #7):
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...ml#post2229556
Tom
Now that I have a CTS-V, I have had to do some research on supercharged V8s. Over on the Cadillac forum I found it extremely useful when members put together a sort of table showing the affects of changing upper and lower pulleys here is an example (Post #7):
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...ml#post2229556
Tom
Man I know you're enjoying your CTS-V. I was very close on pulling the trigger on one and I still to this day think about getting one. Enjoy!
#22
Because I don't want to be the guinea pig for such a large endeavor (not to mention price and unknown results). Yes I can probably do turbo/s but it will involve alot of time and money. Remember I have a CLK body and there really isn't much room.
#23
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'03 E55, Range Rover Sport Supercharged, Ducati 748R
as an example, when we first did the slr cam swap we all thought we had to change out the cam gears with the cams because they had different part numbers compared to the e. once i received the slr cam gears it was obvious they were the exact same part...just a different part number and a higher price tag.
#24
Tom
#25
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
part numbers are probably not going to yield any insight. i'm not saying they're the same blowers but mb is over zealous about changing part numbers not only between different models that share the exact same parts, but even different years that share the same parts.
as an example, when we first did the slr cam swap we all thought we had to change out the cam gears with the cams because they had different part numbers compared to the e. once i received the slr cam gears it was obvious they were the exact same part...just a different part number and a higher price tag.
as an example, when we first did the slr cam swap we all thought we had to change out the cam gears with the cams because they had different part numbers compared to the e. once i received the slr cam gears it was obvious they were the exact same part...just a different part number and a higher price tag.
The blowers could very well be the same.
All I want is that damn SLR 722 GT S/C set-up on my modded 55K. Is that too much to ask? I could scrap the S/C and put turbos with a stand alone but I might as well have bought a chevy nova. I want to keep my block, heads, and S/C Mercedes AMG even though it will make less power and cost more bank..
What do you guys think?