New E63 5.5TT using electronic steering....
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New E63 5.5TT using electronic steering....
So part of the announcement of the W212 E63 (for sale in Sept) was that they are now going to be using electronic steering instead of hydraulic. They claim it's more economical since it'll only be working when you are actually steering.
The new F10 BMW went that route and everybody seems to complain that it feels vague and no where near as precise as the older E60.
I haven't heard if the F10 M5 will also be using it, but I'm not that happy to hear that it'll be in the W212 E63. Maybe MB will do a better job, but I dunno....
I think certain Audis have it now too.
Plus it'll have stop/go, too.
The new F10 BMW went that route and everybody seems to complain that it feels vague and no where near as precise as the older E60.
I haven't heard if the F10 M5 will also be using it, but I'm not that happy to hear that it'll be in the W212 E63. Maybe MB will do a better job, but I dunno....
I think certain Audis have it now too.
Plus it'll have stop/go, too.
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E63 P30, CL500 Sport
I wish they would do this stuff only to the regular Mercedes models.... NOT to AMGs 
Lets hope they get the formula right though this time, as there is always a chance.
Lets hope they get the formula right though this time, as there is always a chance.
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I'm guessing it'll be the same as with the new S63 which also has start/stop. In C mode it'll always be on. But in S mode it'll be off. But you do have to put it in S mode on every re-start since the car defaults always to C (or "efficiency") mode.
It's the electronic steering that concerns me. They seemed to have the steering dialed in okay with the current W212 E63 (at least relative to earlier E Class versions), and now they are going electronic which usually means less steering feedback. We'll have to see when the test reports start coming in from the press. Numb and vague steering has always been the drawback to a Mercedes, imho.
It's the electronic steering that concerns me. They seemed to have the steering dialed in okay with the current W212 E63 (at least relative to earlier E Class versions), and now they are going electronic which usually means less steering feedback. We'll have to see when the test reports start coming in from the press. Numb and vague steering has always been the drawback to a Mercedes, imho.
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I did find this from the UK MB corporate website. Maybe they did get it right compared to BMW and Audi.
Review hails electromechanical steering of new Mercedes-Benz CLS
The new Mercedes-Benz CLS is set apart from its predecessor and other Mercedes-Benz sports saloons by its electromechanical steering, it has been noted. Writing for the Daily Telegraph, Anthony French-Constant observed that unlike numerous rival manufacturers, Mercedes-Benz's efforts to replace hydraulic helms with electric power have proved to be successful. Added to this, the vehicle boasts five per cent savings on fuel consumption and emissions in comparison to its predecessor. Mercedes-Benz has therefore become the first manufacturer to get the electromechanical steering concept correct. "The CLS steering is beautifully weighted, precise and direct, suiting a car of this size absolutely," he said. "Allied to a more sophisticated chassis, it makes the new CLS far more of a delight to hustle along than expected." The Mercedes-Benz CLS sets "new standards in design, performance and efficiency", according to Ola Kallenius, Head of Mercedes-Benz AMG."
Of course in the end it's all about fuel savings. Electronic steering systems can achieve a fuel savings of around 0.1 - 0.2 l/100 km compared with conventional hydraulic power steering systems. But the down side can be a feeling of vagueness and less feedback which people have been complaining about. And with a Benz it's something else electronic that can fail, lol.
Review hails electromechanical steering of new Mercedes-Benz CLS
The new Mercedes-Benz CLS is set apart from its predecessor and other Mercedes-Benz sports saloons by its electromechanical steering, it has been noted. Writing for the Daily Telegraph, Anthony French-Constant observed that unlike numerous rival manufacturers, Mercedes-Benz's efforts to replace hydraulic helms with electric power have proved to be successful. Added to this, the vehicle boasts five per cent savings on fuel consumption and emissions in comparison to its predecessor. Mercedes-Benz has therefore become the first manufacturer to get the electromechanical steering concept correct. "The CLS steering is beautifully weighted, precise and direct, suiting a car of this size absolutely," he said. "Allied to a more sophisticated chassis, it makes the new CLS far more of a delight to hustle along than expected." The Mercedes-Benz CLS sets "new standards in design, performance and efficiency", according to Ola Kallenius, Head of Mercedes-Benz AMG."
Of course in the end it's all about fuel savings. Electronic steering systems can achieve a fuel savings of around 0.1 - 0.2 l/100 km compared with conventional hydraulic power steering systems. But the down side can be a feeling of vagueness and less feedback which people have been complaining about. And with a Benz it's something else electronic that can fail, lol.
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335i
Autocar reviewed and non-AMG cls and they praised its laser like steering and it uses electronic steering.. I believe GT500s before 2011 used hydraulic steering before the now praised electronically assisted steering system.
If MB screws it up ill be ashamed, cause the current E63 has a amazing rack as it is.
If MB screws it up ill be ashamed, cause the current E63 has a amazing rack as it is.
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Guys, big difference between electric steering and electromechanical steering.
Only the power assist is electric. The rack is still mechanical.
This is all about getting the power robbing hydraulic power steering pump, that is always on, off the motor, and on to the new all electric parts bin.
Only the power assist is electric. The rack is still mechanical.
This is all about getting the power robbing hydraulic power steering pump, that is always on, off the motor, and on to the new all electric parts bin.
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2001 E 55 AMG, 08 E63, 06 CLS 55 IWC, 2012 E63 Designo Mystic Red
Guys, big difference between electric steering and electromechanical steering.
Only the power assist is electric. The rack is still mechanical.
This is all about getting the power robbing hydraulic power steering pump, that is always on, off the motor, and on to the new all electric parts bin.
Only the power assist is electric. The rack is still mechanical.
This is all about getting the power robbing hydraulic power steering pump, that is always on, off the motor, and on to the new all electric parts bin.
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Porsche 991S, Cayenne S, 1972 BMW 3.0CS E9 Coupe
Guys, big difference between electric steering and electromechanical steering.
Only the power assist is electric. The rack is still mechanical.
This is all about getting the power robbing hydraulic power steering pump, that is always on, off the motor, and on to the new all electric parts bin.
Only the power assist is electric. The rack is still mechanical.
This is all about getting the power robbing hydraulic power steering pump, that is always on, off the motor, and on to the new all electric parts bin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iobrw...eature=related
I think it all depends on how the manufacturer uses the nomenclature. And it's not clear to me exactly the details of the system MB is using. And I assume that's why the review said that unlike other manufacturers that MB "got it right this time." Audi uses what they call "electromechanical" too (and there are complaints of vague steering.) BMW's system is noticeably different for sure. Same with VW.
So which system are they using?
In electro-hydraulic steering, one electrically powered steering concept uses a high efficiency pump driven by an electric motor. Pump speed is regulated by an electric controller to vary pump pressure and flow, providing steering efforts tailored for different driving situations. The pump can be run at low speed or shut off to provide energy savings during straight ahead driving (which is most of the time in most world markets).
Direct electric steering uses an electric motor attached to the steering rack via a gear mechanism (no pump or fluid). A variety of motor types and gear drives is possible. A microprocessor controls steering dynamics and driver effort. Inputs include vehicle speed and steering, wheel torque, angular position and turning rate.
Last edited by 220S; Apr 29, 2011 at 05:20 PM.
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But aren't the terms used equally by manufacturers? None are actual "drive-by-wire" as the rack is always mechanical. It's steering assist which is why it's variable, etc.. Either an electric motor to run the pump or an all electric system but it's still a mechanical rack.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iobrw...eature=related
I think it all depends on how the manufacturer uses the nomenclature. And it's not clear to me exactly the details of the system MB is using. And I assume that's why the review said that unlike other manufacturers that MB "got it right this time." Audi uses what they call "electromechanical" too (and there are complaints of vague steering.) BMW's system is noticeably different for sure. Same with VW.
So which system are they using?
In electro-hydraulic steering, one electrically powered steering concept uses a high efficiency pump driven by an electric motor. Pump speed is regulated by an electric controller to vary pump pressure and flow, providing steering efforts tailored for different driving situations. The pump can be run at low speed or shut off to provide energy savings during straight ahead driving (which is most of the time in most world markets).
Direct electric steering uses an electric motor attached to the steering rack via a gear mechanism (no pump or fluid). A variety of motor types and gear drives is possible. A microprocessor controls steering dynamics and driver effort. Inputs include vehicle speed and steering, wheel torque, angular position and turning rate.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iobrw...eature=related
I think it all depends on how the manufacturer uses the nomenclature. And it's not clear to me exactly the details of the system MB is using. And I assume that's why the review said that unlike other manufacturers that MB "got it right this time." Audi uses what they call "electromechanical" too (and there are complaints of vague steering.) BMW's system is noticeably different for sure. Same with VW.
So which system are they using?
In electro-hydraulic steering, one electrically powered steering concept uses a high efficiency pump driven by an electric motor. Pump speed is regulated by an electric controller to vary pump pressure and flow, providing steering efforts tailored for different driving situations. The pump can be run at low speed or shut off to provide energy savings during straight ahead driving (which is most of the time in most world markets).
Direct electric steering uses an electric motor attached to the steering rack via a gear mechanism (no pump or fluid). A variety of motor types and gear drives is possible. A microprocessor controls steering dynamics and driver effort. Inputs include vehicle speed and steering, wheel torque, angular position and turning rate.
I think the A class has this now.
http://www.atzonline.com/index.php;d...loc=1/id=10506
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They, to the best of my knowledge are using a electro-hydraulic.
I think the A class has this now.
http://www.atzonline.com/index.php;d...loc=1/id=10506
I think the A class has this now.
http://www.atzonline.com/index.php;d...loc=1/id=10506
All of them have mechanical racks. And this is only about assist when needed (and the fuel savings to be run electronically.) In the end it all depends on the road feel based on the programming of that assist, etc., and the difference one gets from a mechanical pump versus an electric pump.
Hopefully they did it right and we won't hear complaints like with other designs. Although this is where all manufacturers are going, so it will be perfected over time. And drivers will eventually get used to it....
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All kidding aside, I was really hoping for a Mercedes that Car and Driver would FINALLY praise. Nope. I can see it coming. Just like the brake issue.
"We LOVED the new E63, but the steering unfortunately took away what we would have called the best AMG to date"
Ahhh, screw C&D, they hate everything Benz.
"We LOVED the new E63, but the steering unfortunately took away what we would have called the best AMG to date"
Ahhh, screw C&D, they hate everything Benz.
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All kidding aside, I was really hoping for a Mercedes that Car and Driver would FINALLY praise. Nope. I can see it coming. Just like the brake issue.
"We LOVED the new E63, but the steering unfortunately took away what we would have called the best AMG to date"
Ahhh, screw C&D, they hate everything Benz.
"We LOVED the new E63, but the steering unfortunately took away what we would have called the best AMG to date"
Ahhh, screw C&D, they hate everything Benz.
Jerks
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Haters crazy
If electronic steering is similar to the bmw "active steering" thats awesome! Loved the active steering on my 6 series few years back... Its like a sprint booster for the steering wheel lol.
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So part of the announcement of the W212 E63 (for sale in Sept) was that they are now going to be using electronic steering instead of hydraulic. They claim it's more economical since it'll only be working when you are actually steering.
The new F10 BMW went that route and everybody seems to complain that it feels vague and no where near as precise as the older E60.
I haven't heard if the F10 M5 will also be using it, but I'm not that happy to hear that it'll be in the W212 E63. Maybe MB will do a better job, but I dunno....
I think certain Audis have it now too.
Plus it'll have stop/go, too.
The new F10 BMW went that route and everybody seems to complain that it feels vague and no where near as precise as the older E60.
I haven't heard if the F10 M5 will also be using it, but I'm not that happy to hear that it'll be in the W212 E63. Maybe MB will do a better job, but I dunno....
I think certain Audis have it now too.
Plus it'll have stop/go, too.
It's a electro-hydraulic power pack, VERY efficient and can be mounted anywhere. BMW Did it on the Mini 5 years ago and it works great. Nothing to be frightened of
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Why did they go EPS on the F10? Audi has the EPHS set up but even then some people have complained. Apparently you can change settings thru VAG-COM and 'tighten' it up. No manufacturer is identical in their set up, so it's still an unknown until I drive it. But it sounds like it's been done well by MB according to at least that one report.....
Thread Starter
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Porsche 991S, Cayenne S, 1972 BMW 3.0CS E9 Coupe
All kidding aside, I was really hoping for a Mercedes that Car and Driver would FINALLY praise. Nope. I can see it coming. Just like the brake issue.
"We LOVED the new E63, but the steering unfortunately took away what we would have called the best AMG to date"
Ahhh, screw C&D, they hate everything Benz.
"We LOVED the new E63, but the steering unfortunately took away what we would have called the best AMG to date"
Ahhh, screw C&D, they hate everything Benz.
"But ABC-equipped cars (all S600s include it as standard) have hydraulically boosted steering, whereas those without ABC have—gulp!—electric-assisted steering. It might not sound like much, but the difference is like having a drink made with well liquor or with the stuff pulled from the top shelf. It’ll do the job, but it’s nowhere near as smooth and satisfying. The electrically boosted rack, which is also found in the new-for-2010 S400 hybrid, is a characterless affair."
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...t_drive_review
I'm still not 100% sold on it in the new W212 E63..... but again, we'll have to see.
