To split intercooler system or not to split?
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From: BC
Haters crazy
To split intercooler system or not to split?
I know this has been discussed to death! But after reading the 10 threads about this, I am confused whether its worthwhile doing this setup with the engine mounted bmw reservoir. I'm sure with the summer here others will be wanting to keep their system cooler as well. Big thanks to 320 dreamer for answering my millions of questions, but I am just wanting to get a feel for rest of your guys opinions because at this point I see two sides:
1 people are for it as it dropped their iats.
2 people are convinced it will work initially but as temps increase the effectiveness of this system will decrease as with the split system... less water volume, low pressure system appose to the high pressure. Why didn't AMG techs split the system?
Has anybody actually data logged with the 2 systems?
Thanks!
1 people are for it as it dropped their iats.
2 people are convinced it will work initially but as temps increase the effectiveness of this system will decrease as with the split system... less water volume, low pressure system appose to the high pressure. Why didn't AMG techs split the system?
Has anybody actually data logged with the 2 systems?
Thanks!
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,575
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From: BC
Haters crazy
I can understand running a rear reservoir how it can be useful. But with the small bmw ps reservoir is it worth it? Especially all the hassle lol.
(I already have all the parts)
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 937
Likes: 15
From: Alpharetta Georgia
2006 E55, 2006 saab 93 aero, 2010 glk 4m
Before:
Ambient 60 - 70F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 30-40 above ambient
AT WOT burst from 65 - 130MPH = Up to 167F
Recovery at highway = 30 seconds to reach about 120F
after about 2-3 minutes, back at initial temps (40 above)
After Split cooling, constant on pump and proper bleed
Ambient = ~85F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 92F to 99F
AT WOT Burst from 65- 130mph = Up to 127
(repetitive blasts only raise temps to ~135F)
Recovery at highway = 20-30 seconds to initial temps
One added benefit from the constant on pump is that IATs do not climb when car is Idling.
Hope this info gives you and others some perspective (on a black car).
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2008
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From: BC
Haters crazy
Thanks! Intresting...
With a bigger HE and better pump I assume would make a difference as well...
Whats your opinion as far as if its worth doing/dealing with the hassle of putting the biatch in lol
With a bigger HE and better pump I assume would make a difference as well...
Whats your opinion as far as if its worth doing/dealing with the hassle of putting the biatch in lol
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 4,173
Likes: 7
From: Puerto Rico
2005 E55 AMG
I logged my car for a whole week before I did it and these were my findings. My car is black and stock. Keep in mind I also wired the pump for always on at the same time.
Before:
Ambient 60 - 70F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 30-40 above ambient
AT WOT burst from 65 - 130MPH = Up to 167F
Recovery at highway = 30 seconds to reach about 120F
after about 2-3 minutes, back at initial temps (40 above)
After Split cooling, constant on pump and proper bleed
Ambient = ~85F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 92F to 99F
AT WOT Burst from 65- 130mph = Up to 127
(repetitive blasts only raise temps to ~135F)
Recovery at highway = 20-30 seconds to initial temps
One added benefit from the constant on pump is that IATs do not climb when car is Idling.
Hope this info gives you and others some perspective (on a black car).
Before:
Ambient 60 - 70F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 30-40 above ambient
AT WOT burst from 65 - 130MPH = Up to 167F
Recovery at highway = 30 seconds to reach about 120F
after about 2-3 minutes, back at initial temps (40 above)
After Split cooling, constant on pump and proper bleed
Ambient = ~85F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 92F to 99F
AT WOT Burst from 65- 130mph = Up to 127
(repetitive blasts only raise temps to ~135F)
Recovery at highway = 20-30 seconds to initial temps
One added benefit from the constant on pump is that IATs do not climb when car is Idling.
Hope this info gives you and others some perspective (on a black car).
When stock I would barely crack 140* ( usually mid 130's ) also in 80* weather.
Kinda makes me wonder why your temps were so high to begin with. While the stock setup uses the coolant reservoir to fill up, it doesn't use the reservoir anymore once it's full. It doesn't circulate with the reservoir so any heat the reservoir builds will only be transfered by water stuck in the fill tube. The fill tube is pretty long so the transferring should be minimal.
Last edited by GT-ER; Jun 2, 2011 at 05:52 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 7,092
Likes: 13
From: Salt Lake City (but not Morm)
2003 E55 & 2014 GL550
I logged my car for a whole week before I did it and these were my findings. My car is black and stock. Keep in mind I also wired the pump for always on at the same time.
Before:
Ambient 60 - 70F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 30-40 above ambient
AT WOT burst from 65 - 130MPH = Up to 167F
Recovery at highway = 30 seconds to reach about 120F
after about 2-3 minutes, back at initial temps (40 above)
After Split cooling, constant on pump and proper bleed
Ambient = ~85F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 92F to 99F
AT WOT Burst from 65- 130mph = Up to 127
(repetitive blasts only raise temps to ~135F)
Recovery at highway = 20-30 seconds to initial temps
One added benefit from the constant on pump is that IATs do not climb when car is Idling.
Hope this info gives you and others some perspective (on a black car).
Before:
Ambient 60 - 70F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 30-40 above ambient
AT WOT burst from 65 - 130MPH = Up to 167F
Recovery at highway = 30 seconds to reach about 120F
after about 2-3 minutes, back at initial temps (40 above)
After Split cooling, constant on pump and proper bleed
Ambient = ~85F
Cruising Temp B4 WOT = 92F to 99F
AT WOT Burst from 65- 130mph = Up to 127
(repetitive blasts only raise temps to ~135F)
Recovery at highway = 20-30 seconds to initial temps
One added benefit from the constant on pump is that IATs do not climb when car is Idling.
Hope this info gives you and others some perspective (on a black car).
+1 on clamps that Satan himself designed and carefully watches over.
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,582
Likes: 1
From: Lafayette, IN
2008 ML63 2009 SL63 2010 Alpha 7 GTR
Tbal, I ordered the BMW res too, but I am going to hold off and just do a trunk res at some point. I think the BMW will help, but not a large enough difference compared to a trunk mount that I can add ice to at the track.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Sep 2008
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From: BC
Haters crazy
Thats what Im thinking but its tad extreme for me as its my DD. Have a datalogger on the way, going to log some numbers and see if I should bother. As of right now (knock on wood) with the pump wired always on, bigger HE and pump the car feels beast even after numerious wot pulls...
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From: murfreesboro,tn
2003 porsche 996 turbo
tbal most modding is a pain in the a**. if it was easy everyone would do it! the benfits of isolating the i/c system aree well worth it. whether the bloody knuckles are worth it to you is another question. for me its my way to decompress after work and i do it for the joy of wrenching. its not for everyone
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,575
Likes: 8
From: BC
Haters crazy
the pump comes on at 2000 rpm and stays on until the car is shut off so unless you wire it for running while the key is off it always runs after intial start.
tbal most modding is a pain in the a**. if it was easy everyone would do it! the benfits of isolating the i/c system aree well worth it. whether the bloody knuckles are worth it to you is another question. for me its my way to decompress after work and i do it for the joy of wrenching. its not for everyone
tbal most modding is a pain in the a**. if it was easy everyone would do it! the benfits of isolating the i/c system aree well worth it. whether the bloody knuckles are worth it to you is another question. for me its my way to decompress after work and i do it for the joy of wrenching. its not for everyone
What is so hard about taking the T off anyway?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 4,173
Likes: 7
From: Puerto Rico
2005 E55 AMG
the pump comes on at 2000 rpm and stays on until the car is shut off so unless you wire it for running while the key is off it always runs after intial start.
tbal most modding is a pain in the a**. if it was easy everyone would do it! the benfits of isolating the i/c system aree well worth it. whether the bloody knuckles are worth it to you is another question. for me its my way to decompress after work and i do it for the joy of wrenching. its not for everyone
tbal most modding is a pain in the a**. if it was easy everyone would do it! the benfits of isolating the i/c system aree well worth it. whether the bloody knuckles are worth it to you is another question. for me its my way to decompress after work and i do it for the joy of wrenching. its not for everyone
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,582
Likes: 1
From: Lafayette, IN
2008 ML63 2009 SL63 2010 Alpha 7 GTR
Thats what Im thinking but its tad extreme for me as its my DD. Have a datalogger on the way, going to log some numbers and see if I should bother. As of right now (knock on wood) with the pump wired always on, bigger HE and pump the car feels beast even after numerious wot pulls...
I agree, but why not? If your going to mod, might as well work your way up! my car recovers quickly with the HE and such, but being able to keep her cool while doing a quick burst would be sweet. Also its "better" for the engine to run cooler, thus it will last longer, haha thats how i justified headers! lol
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,540
Likes: 5
From: Arizona
2004 E55, 1997 E320 "Sold"
I cannot really remember what my IAT's were when I did mine, I am sure you can look them up, but in this hot AZ weather I remember it made a massive difference! I am not sure if the BMW reservoir and split cooling made a huge difference, but my supercharger has not shut down once since doing it and I would have to say that speaks for itself especially in this weather.
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,174
Likes: 19
From: London, UK
No longer stock '06 E55, A3 3.2 Quattro, GLE 400d, R107 280SL, Golf Polo
The main problem with a non split system is your baseline engine coolant starting point - even if its from the "cold" side of the radiator plus some H/E cooling its not going to be anything close to "cold". Also under heavy prolonged stress the whole system tilts over pretty quickly. Engine temps plus intercooler heating, despite the water volume, cannot be sufficiently cooled by the whole cooling matrix, so -> shutdown.
Now split the system and immediately you have a lower baseline as you not starting with engine coolant, but you now have a smaller water volume. So you fixed one problem but created another. Unless you add an additional radiator like the evosport mod, or significantly increase the water volume (rear tank), I actually think a split system with a small "bmw" reservoir will give little benefit over a long wot blast. Initially you will benefit from the lower baseline but temps will rise pretty quickly given the water volume is less than you were at before when combined with the engine coolant. You also "only" using the H/E changer to cool the water and not sharing the capacity of the radiator to assist - at least with the very top end of the heat range.
A split system with rear tank and additional / larger H/E is the best solution, and really if you are going to go to the trouble of splitting you need to add capacity to both the fluid and cooling matrix.
Now split the system and immediately you have a lower baseline as you not starting with engine coolant, but you now have a smaller water volume. So you fixed one problem but created another. Unless you add an additional radiator like the evosport mod, or significantly increase the water volume (rear tank), I actually think a split system with a small "bmw" reservoir will give little benefit over a long wot blast. Initially you will benefit from the lower baseline but temps will rise pretty quickly given the water volume is less than you were at before when combined with the engine coolant. You also "only" using the H/E changer to cool the water and not sharing the capacity of the radiator to assist - at least with the very top end of the heat range.
A split system with rear tank and additional / larger H/E is the best solution, and really if you are going to go to the trouble of splitting you need to add capacity to both the fluid and cooling matrix.
Last edited by stevebez; Jun 3, 2011 at 04:14 AM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 4,173
Likes: 7
From: Puerto Rico
2005 E55 AMG
The main problem with a non split system is your baseline engine coolant starting point - even if its from the "cold" side of the radiator plus some H/E cooling its not going to be anything close to "cold". Also under heavy prolonged stress the whole system tilts over pretty quickly. Engine temps plus intercooler heating, despite the water volume, cannot be sufficiently cooled by the whole cooling matrix, so -> shutdown.
Now split the system and immediately you have a lower baseline as you not starting with engine coolant, but you now have a smaller water volume. So you fixed one problem but created another. Unless you add an additional radiator like the evosport mod, or significantly increase the water volume (rear tank), I actually think a split system with a small "bmw" reservoir will give little benefit over a long wot blast. Initially you will benefit from the lower baseline but temps will rise pretty quickly given the water volume is less than you were at before when combined with the engine coolant. You also "only" using the H/E changer to cool the water and not sharing the capacity of the radiator to assist - at least with the very top end of the heat range.
A split system with rear tank and additional / larger H/E is the best solution, and really if you are going to go to the trouble of splitting you need to add capacity to both the fluid and cooling matrix.
Now split the system and immediately you have a lower baseline as you not starting with engine coolant, but you now have a smaller water volume. So you fixed one problem but created another. Unless you add an additional radiator like the evosport mod, or significantly increase the water volume (rear tank), I actually think a split system with a small "bmw" reservoir will give little benefit over a long wot blast. Initially you will benefit from the lower baseline but temps will rise pretty quickly given the water volume is less than you were at before when combined with the engine coolant. You also "only" using the H/E changer to cool the water and not sharing the capacity of the radiator to assist - at least with the very top end of the heat range.
A split system with rear tank and additional / larger H/E is the best solution, and really if you are going to go to the trouble of splitting you need to add capacity to both the fluid and cooling matrix.
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From: Houston/ Austin /Toronto / UAE / Minneapolis / Orlando /Cincinnati
Eurocharged Performance ML63 and TT lambo
just as an fyi, I did mine this weekend. I have the rear mount tank, and was on the fence about splitting the system as to if it was worth it.
Well, with it not split, and the system fed like follows:
heat exchanger to rear tank to front meziere to s/c
As soon as you start the system, it would drain the normal reservoir and throw a low coolant message. Open the top of that reservoir and it shoot crap out everywhere lolololol
So split it was, and all was fine. My recovery is extremely fast!
Now, with the T that everyone is complaining about. First, it's hard to get at, and second they are not regular clamps. I had to literally cut the pipe/clamp section itself and then get the right connectors to make it work in little space to work with. Do yourself a favor and get a cap for the one side, and then just a regular barb to barb splice for the other.
Well, with it not split, and the system fed like follows:
heat exchanger to rear tank to front meziere to s/c
As soon as you start the system, it would drain the normal reservoir and throw a low coolant message. Open the top of that reservoir and it shoot crap out everywhere lolololol
So split it was, and all was fine. My recovery is extremely fast!
Now, with the T that everyone is complaining about. First, it's hard to get at, and second they are not regular clamps. I had to literally cut the pipe/clamp section itself and then get the right connectors to make it work in little space to work with. Do yourself a favor and get a cap for the one side, and then just a regular barb to barb splice for the other.
