Longtube/near longtube/shorty headers - Pros/Cons
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Super Member
Joined: Feb 2010
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06 E55 / 13 C63
Longtube/near longtube/shorty headers - Pros/Cons
Hi all,
I am looking into purchasing headers. After doing quite a bit of research on this forum, the debate seems to be between whether to choose longtubes(Eurocharged, MBH, RENNtech) vs "almost" longtubes(Kleemann) vs shorty (Evosport).
From what I've read, it seems the longtubes are where the most of the power comes(50+rwhp/50+rwtq). What exactly are the cons? I guess the long tubes delete the primary and secondary cats, but this I heard can be solved by the tuner shutting off the O2 through the tune OBDII.
What exactly are the cons of longtubes then besides possibly the price as they seem to make mostpower?
Why not go with Kleemann that seem to make just as much, altough a bit less (let's say 40rwhp/40rwtq) and cost substantially less ... I think I read $1,600.
Evosports - the shortys - from what I read and real testimonials make it seem like a complete waste.
Feedback? Thoughts? Suggestions? Recommendations? I'm on the fence between Kleemann headers or Eurocharged longtubes? Anybody with proven gaines with either/both of these headers?
My decision is down to a K3 setup or Eurocharged Stage III setup. I am looking for over 600-650rwtq or more if possible with these setups?
Thank you!!
I am looking into purchasing headers. After doing quite a bit of research on this forum, the debate seems to be between whether to choose longtubes(Eurocharged, MBH, RENNtech) vs "almost" longtubes(Kleemann) vs shorty (Evosport).
From what I've read, it seems the longtubes are where the most of the power comes(50+rwhp/50+rwtq). What exactly are the cons? I guess the long tubes delete the primary and secondary cats, but this I heard can be solved by the tuner shutting off the O2 through the tune OBDII.
What exactly are the cons of longtubes then besides possibly the price as they seem to make mostpower?
Why not go with Kleemann that seem to make just as much, altough a bit less (let's say 40rwhp/40rwtq) and cost substantially less ... I think I read $1,600.
Evosports - the shortys - from what I read and real testimonials make it seem like a complete waste.
Feedback? Thoughts? Suggestions? Recommendations? I'm on the fence between Kleemann headers or Eurocharged longtubes? Anybody with proven gaines with either/both of these headers?
My decision is down to a K3 setup or Eurocharged Stage III setup. I am looking for over 600-650rwtq or more if possible with these setups?
Thank you!!
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2007
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From: Treasure Island, FL
GLE 63S
I'm sure others will chime in but I have Evosport shorties that have worked for me so far. Is there more power I could get with LT's? Sure but they do produce about 30 extra HP so before you call them a waste of time you should go read Evosports website for proven dyno gains made with the shorty's. I'm sure Brad may chime in at some point too..
EC LT's come highly recommend not only on price but proven performance by other E55 owners here in Houston.
EC LT's come highly recommend not only on price but proven performance by other E55 owners here in Houston.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,697
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2005 E55
here is my dyno and this was the 3rd pull in 4th gear,the first 2 pulls were done in 3rd gear so if we did a cold pull in 4th gear I would of made about 600rwt and 505whp.
Im not a tuner and this is a real world dyno from a customer.If you want low end torque go kleemann with the primaires deleted and the rest of the setup stock.
Im not a tuner and this is a real world dyno from a customer.If you want low end torque go kleemann with the primaires deleted and the rest of the setup stock.
Last edited by skratch77; Aug 17, 2011 at 03:53 PM.
PREMIER SPONSOR
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Huntington Beach, CA
None fast enough!
As grantwoodtx stated, our headers are far from a waste. In fact, they make as much as nearly any other header if you eliminate the cats after the header. The beauty of our header is that it is cat friendly. If you dont care about being emissions compliant, then remove the cats and our header will make within 5HP of any of the long tubes.
I am very curious what evidence you have ever seen or heard that differs. These have been dyno tested by MANY users with VERY consistent results.
Thanks
Brad
I am very curious what evidence you have ever seen or heard that differs. These have been dyno tested by MANY users with VERY consistent results.
Thanks
Brad
MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: merryland
cornfed gtr and m3
Ran VRP shorties, Kleemanns, and Floored Fab on my last e55 and honestly feel that the Kleemanns with primaries removed were the ticket. The Floored Fabs and custom Bruce exhaust sounded ****ing incredible,
but honestly don't know if the premium for the LTs is worth it. So, yes, I agree with Scratch and would roll with the Kleemanns.
but honestly don't know if the premium for the LTs is worth it. So, yes, I agree with Scratch and would roll with the Kleemanns.
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Joined: May 2009
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From: Valley of the Sun, Arizona
C63, SL55, E55, CLS55, ML63, C55
We are not the cheapest, here's why. We use 16g 304 stainless steel in our primary tubes 321 plate steel in our flanges. We hand make the collectors and collector merge spike.. There is literal over $1000 in material alone in each header system we make for the 55's. We purge weld every primary tube. all of our exhaust components are 100% TIG welded. We do not mass produce headers. We build everything to order the way the customer wants it.
We also offer a mid-section that allows our header systems to be 100% bolt-on. If that's a road a customer chooses. We also custom make the mid-section so you have the ability to integrate hiflow cats, X-pipes, H-Pipes. or any combination of 2. We can do all of this and still have it bolt up to your factory resonator.
Our Header require NO cutting and extending of the o2 sensor wires. And of course all of our parts are made in-house here in the USA (Arizona)
We also guarantee you to make at least 40whp with our headers over stock. However typical gains on a 100% stock 55k make 46-50whp.
Again we are not the cheapest on the market, but we can offer some good deals on our products.
We also offer a mid-section that allows our header systems to be 100% bolt-on. If that's a road a customer chooses. We also custom make the mid-section so you have the ability to integrate hiflow cats, X-pipes, H-Pipes. or any combination of 2. We can do all of this and still have it bolt up to your factory resonator.
Our Header require NO cutting and extending of the o2 sensor wires. And of course all of our parts are made in-house here in the USA (Arizona)
We also guarantee you to make at least 40whp with our headers over stock. However typical gains on a 100% stock 55k make 46-50whp.
Again we are not the cheapest on the market, but we can offer some good deals on our products.
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MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Lafayette, IN
2008 ML63 2009 SL63 2010 Alpha 7 GTR
kleemans, no cats here. honestly best bang for the buck. is 10hp max really going to make the difference in the long run? are you chasing the 10 sec mark? or just dyno numbers?
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Thread Starter
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Joined: Feb 2010
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06 E55 / 13 C63
I am most likely going with the eurocharged LT since I am fairly certain I will be buying one of their kits.
Even if decide to piece mods together, EC longtubes seem best.
Thanks for replies...
Even if decide to piece mods together, EC longtubes seem best.
Thanks for replies...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,027
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05 E55 AMG, E320 CDI, Turbo E46 M3,IS300 2JZGTE,VQ35 Turbo Maxima, Mercedes 300D
I bought the Eurocharged LT. I wasn't impressed at first since my fabricator does top notch welding, but I showed him the headers and he was pretty impressed with the workmanship and the price. I didn't even realize they were Stainless. I thought they were coated steel but they are polished stainless ... just bought them on someone's recommendation!!! LOL
I don't have numbers yet ... but will soon
I don't have numbers yet ... but will soon
