What's the verdict on the smaller SC pulley?
Out Of Control!!
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haters crazy
Crank pulleys have failed, especially from a certain manufacturer that was sold by some of the same people. These supercharger pulleys have failed as well. Hopefully the new version works better
Last edited by blackbenzz; Jul 8, 2013 at 08:02 PM.
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'06 E55, '15 Jeep SRT8, '94 Mustang GT
Out Of Control!!
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haters crazy
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From: Folsom, CA
2005 E55 AMG
I thought we went through this last time. I guess you haven't learned. These cars are not turbocharged. You cannot get "quicker spool-up"
Crank pulleys have failed, especially from a certain manufacturer that was sold by some of the same people. These supercharger pulleys have failed as well. Hopefully the new version works better
Crank pulleys have failed, especially from a certain manufacturer that was sold by some of the same people. These supercharger pulleys have failed as well. Hopefully the new version works better
Thread Starter
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From: LA
W213 E63
Thanks for the conversation guys. Please complete the equation using =,<, or >
ASSUMING TUNE AND COOLING TO ACCOMPANY THE PULLEY:
Smaller SC ___ 168MM Pulley
Smaller SC ___ 172MM Pulley
Smaller SC ___ 175MM Pulley
Smaller SC ___ 180MM Pulley
Smaller SC ___ Flux Capacitor
ASSUMING TUNE AND COOLING TO ACCOMPANY THE PULLEY:
Smaller SC ___ 168MM Pulley
Smaller SC ___ 172MM Pulley
Smaller SC ___ 175MM Pulley
Smaller SC ___ 180MM Pulley
Smaller SC ___ Flux Capacitor
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From: The Granite State
.
Ask and you shall receive.....
Yellow = Stock size pulley
Green = Smaller S/C pulley
Blue = Larger Aftermarket Crank Pulley
Ultimately, it all boils down to the pulley ratio that you achieve by combining the upper and lower pulley. A smaller ratio produces less boost....a larger ratio produces MORE boost. This is shown by the supercharger RPMs in the last column of the table. It doesn't matter how you get there (larger crank pulley & stock SC pulley, or stock crank pulley & smaller SC pulley)... if the ratios are the same, the power increase will be the same.
In this table, you can see that the smaller SC pulley gives almost identical performance as a typical 168mm crank pulley swap (1.86 vs 1.87 ratio) and if you already had a 168mm crank pulley, swapping in the smaller SC pulley would be virtually identical to running a 180mm lower pulley with a stock SC pulley. (2.00 vs 2.02 ratio)
(NOTE: This analysis ignores any additional benefits from reducing rotational mass on either the crank or SC pulley)
Extra Credit Question:
As everyone knows, the flux capacitor is a 1.21 Gigawatt device. Converting from watts to HP (746 watts/HP) yields a horsepower increase of roughly 1.62 million additional horsepower.... that's crank HP, not wheel HP.
-G
Yellow = Stock size pulley
Green = Smaller S/C pulley
Blue = Larger Aftermarket Crank Pulley
Ultimately, it all boils down to the pulley ratio that you achieve by combining the upper and lower pulley. A smaller ratio produces less boost....a larger ratio produces MORE boost. This is shown by the supercharger RPMs in the last column of the table. It doesn't matter how you get there (larger crank pulley & stock SC pulley, or stock crank pulley & smaller SC pulley)... if the ratios are the same, the power increase will be the same.
In this table, you can see that the smaller SC pulley gives almost identical performance as a typical 168mm crank pulley swap (1.86 vs 1.87 ratio) and if you already had a 168mm crank pulley, swapping in the smaller SC pulley would be virtually identical to running a 180mm lower pulley with a stock SC pulley. (2.00 vs 2.02 ratio)
(NOTE: This analysis ignores any additional benefits from reducing rotational mass on either the crank or SC pulley)
Extra Credit Question:
As everyone knows, the flux capacitor is a 1.21 Gigawatt device. Converting from watts to HP (746 watts/HP) yields a horsepower increase of roughly 1.62 million additional horsepower.... that's crank HP, not wheel HP.
-G
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From: SE MI
2005 Mercedes E55 AMG
Ask and you shall receive.....
Yellow = Stock size pulley
Green = Smaller S/C pulley
Blue = Larger Aftermarket Crank Pulley
Ultimately, it all boils down to the pulley ratio that you achieve by combining the upper and lower pulley. A smaller ratio produces less boost....a larger ratio produces MORE boost. This is shown by the supercharger RPMs in the last column of the table. It doesn't matter how you get there (larger crank pulley & stock SC pulley, or stock crank pulley & smaller SC pulley)... if the ratios are the same, the power increase will be the same.
In this table, you can see that the smaller SC pulley gives almost identical performance as a typical 168mm crank pulley swap (1.86 vs 1.87 ratio) and if you already had a 168mm crank pulley, swapping in the smaller SC pulley would be virtually identical to running a 180mm lower pulley with a stock SC pulley. (2.00 vs 2.02 ratio)
(NOTE: This analysis ignores any additional benefits from reducing rotational mass on either the crank or SC pulley)
Extra Credit Question:
As everyone knows, the flux capacitor is a 1.21 Gigawatt device. Converting from watts to HP (746 watts/HP) yields a horsepower increase of roughly 1.62 million additional horsepower.... that's crank HP, not wheel HP.
-G
Yellow = Stock size pulley
Green = Smaller S/C pulley
Blue = Larger Aftermarket Crank Pulley
Ultimately, it all boils down to the pulley ratio that you achieve by combining the upper and lower pulley. A smaller ratio produces less boost....a larger ratio produces MORE boost. This is shown by the supercharger RPMs in the last column of the table. It doesn't matter how you get there (larger crank pulley & stock SC pulley, or stock crank pulley & smaller SC pulley)... if the ratios are the same, the power increase will be the same.
In this table, you can see that the smaller SC pulley gives almost identical performance as a typical 168mm crank pulley swap (1.86 vs 1.87 ratio) and if you already had a 168mm crank pulley, swapping in the smaller SC pulley would be virtually identical to running a 180mm lower pulley with a stock SC pulley. (2.00 vs 2.02 ratio)
(NOTE: This analysis ignores any additional benefits from reducing rotational mass on either the crank or SC pulley)
Extra Credit Question:
As everyone knows, the flux capacitor is a 1.21 Gigawatt device. Converting from watts to HP (746 watts/HP) yields a horsepower increase of roughly 1.62 million additional horsepower.... that's crank HP, not wheel HP.
-G
Keep in mind that theoretical boost is linear but real boost is not, showing a rate of diminishing returns due to pumping losses. Not only are you battling the heat with higher boost but system restriction as well.
Last edited by rockthemullet; Jul 9, 2013 at 11:01 AM.
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From: Folsom, CA
2005 E55 AMG
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E55 amg
Ok doing the math says upper pulley is about the same as a 168 crank pulley then why has no one ever posted gains of 30-40WHP with just a upper pulley added by itself ?
U can go and Search ppl with 168 pulley and headers also trap 122-123mph
Never seen that with the sc pulley and headers.
I just would like some real world facts. If there the same I should Technically be able to go to the same dyno under the same weather conditions and make 30 wheel horsepower at Minimum by adding it to my current mods ? Right ?
U can go and Search ppl with 168 pulley and headers also trap 122-123mph
Never seen that with the sc pulley and headers.
I just would like some real world facts. If there the same I should Technically be able to go to the same dyno under the same weather conditions and make 30 wheel horsepower at Minimum by adding it to my current mods ? Right ?
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From: The Granite State
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The question of whether you actually WILL hit +30HP or not is going to depend on whether you re-tune the ECU for a pulley swap, and if your IATs are under control with the additional boost.
Adding a smaller SC pulley is one of the most dirt-cheap ways to add power there is..... so it may appeal more to guys who don't want to spend money on cooling mods or dyno-tuning. Obviously, if the rest of the car isn't being set up properly to take advantage of the extra boost you are going to come up short on power gains.
-G
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E55 amg
Well as u can see in my sig I have plenty of cooling and my tune has boost maps in place already so if what ur saying is correct then I should gain that much power. Still Skeptical being the only dyno proof I've seen only got five wheel horsepower. Guess I will just have to get it and dyno myself.
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From: Folsom, CA
2005 E55 AMG
You are just as likely to gain 30HP by adding a 168 pulley or a smaller SC pulley.... Numerically, the solutions are IDENTICAL. It truly doesn't matter which side you modify to get to a ~1.86:1 pulley ratio.
The question of whether you actually WILL hit +30HP or not is going to depend on whether you re-tune the ECU for a pulley swap, and if your IATs are under control with the additional boost.
Adding a smaller SC pulley is one of the most dirt-cheap ways to add power there is..... so it may appeal more to guys who don't want to spend money on cooling mods or dyno-tuning. Obviously, if the rest of the car isn't being set up properly to take advantage of the extra boost you are going to come up short on power gains.
-G
The question of whether you actually WILL hit +30HP or not is going to depend on whether you re-tune the ECU for a pulley swap, and if your IATs are under control with the additional boost.
Adding a smaller SC pulley is one of the most dirt-cheap ways to add power there is..... so it may appeal more to guys who don't want to spend money on cooling mods or dyno-tuning. Obviously, if the rest of the car isn't being set up properly to take advantage of the extra boost you are going to come up short on power gains.
-G
the S/C pulley is lighter and smaller rotating mass, so it puts less wear/tear on the motor overall...
not sure the parasitic losses compared to each pulley method but I'd guess that the S/C pulley is less
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From: Northern VA
W211
What are the rwhp #s a bone stock E55 on a dynojet ?
168mm pulley= 42whp
MBH LTH = 45whp
Smaller s/c = ?? whp
Bone stock E55 = 400 ??
Total = 496rwhp is what i got on a dynojet
168mm pulley= 42whp
MBH LTH = 45whp
Smaller s/c = ?? whp
Bone stock E55 = 400 ??
Total = 496rwhp is what i got on a dynojet
Last edited by novae500; Jul 9, 2013 at 02:51 PM.
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From: FL
CLS55
411whp and 454wtq
ECU Tune
444whp and 481wtq
SC Pulley - Box Tune
451whp and 502wtq
Kleeman headers - Box Tune
478whp and 515wtq
Custom dyno tune (These were peak. We chose 487whp and 521wtq as the safest tune)
491whp and 525wtq
Last edited by FinanceMike; Jul 9, 2013 at 02:54 PM.
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From: Folsom, CA
2005 E55 AMG
as well as dynoing with TTM scoops
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2006 E55
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2004 E55 AMG
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Well as u can see in my sig I have plenty of cooling and my tune has boost maps in place already so if what ur saying is correct then I should gain that much power. Still Skeptical being the only dyno proof I've seen only got five wheel horsepower. Guess I will just have to get it and dyno myself.
The bigger difference was the torque where with the 180 pulley it made around 550tq and the supercharger pulley setup made 497tq.
With the big pulley it was less consistent though and would lose a lot of power on consecutive runs where it was much closer with the smaller supercharger pulley setup. On my first run on the dyno with the 180 pulley the car had ran for 2 or 3 minutes on the dyno before they did a pull because they didn't shut it off while they were adjusting a strap. The first run it did 470whp then they did a run shortly after and it went down to 450whp. After letting the car sit for about 30 minutes to cool off is when it did 499whp uncorrected 509 STD correction.
So a supercharger pulley is certainly going to give you power as long as the tune isn't running to rich.
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From: NH
2012 C63 BS & 2014 E63 Estate & 2008 CLK63 BS
Ok doing the math says upper pulley is about the same as a 168 crank pulley then why has no one ever posted gains of 30-40WHP with just a upper pulley added by itself ?
U can go and Search ppl with 168 pulley and headers also trap 122-123mph
Never seen that with the sc pulley and headers.
I just would like some real world facts. If there the same I should Technically be able to go to the same dyno under the same weather conditions and make 30 wheel horsepower at Minimum by adding it to my current mods ? Right ?
U can go and Search ppl with 168 pulley and headers also trap 122-123mph
Never seen that with the sc pulley and headers.
I just would like some real world facts. If there the same I should Technically be able to go to the same dyno under the same weather conditions and make 30 wheel horsepower at Minimum by adding it to my current mods ? Right ?
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From: Cypress, TX
'06 E55, '15 Jeep SRT8, '94 Mustang GT
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From: The Granite State
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I question the "identical" statement here - one is a crank pulley which implies more weight and more rotational mass to spin throughout the S/C belt path
the S/C pulley is lighter and smaller rotating mass, so it puts less wear/tear on the motor overall...
not sure the parasitic losses compared to each pulley method but I'd guess that the S/C pulley is less
the S/C pulley is lighter and smaller rotating mass, so it puts less wear/tear on the motor overall...
not sure the parasitic losses compared to each pulley method but I'd guess that the S/C pulley is less
You're arguing the "mice nuts" portion of this equation... maybe 2 or 3HP would be my guess.
That would be like dyno'ing a car that just got 4 new lightweight brake rotors to see what the HP difference was.....you might be able to show a difference on the dyno, but most people don't care that much.
The real benefit (IMHO) is never having to risk touching that lower crank pulley and bolt... the SC pulley swap is a lot simpler and less risky. From what I've seen the only failures were attributed to excessive clutch gaps. If you get that right during the installation, you're probably golden forever.
-G
