BC928

Yep. Same as many forums. Conversation, pics, and then if someone figured it out, it's a mystery.

In this case, it's a "kit" from bip now to replace the pumps.

I'll get the pics you asked for in the other thread.

rockthemullet

Yes, BIP had to modify the plastics just as I did. When I was ready to do the conversion, Craig advised that his buckets also had to be cut

chawkins2001

I have been through 3 sets of pumps, aeromotive 340s, aem 320's and now stryker 340's.

They have all been e85 based pumps. The aeromotives malfunctioned very quickly for me. The aem units were nice for the price but I wanted more pump when I went to return style so I went with the proven heavy duty stryker pumps from the gt500 community.

95ONE

We had a similar problem with the Aeromotives, but we were running them at a constant 100% duty cycle. - On another vehicle.

95ONE

Awesome. Thanks.

kponti

All I want for Christmas is where to mount an external filter and what part numbers so I can trash my stock in-basket filter!

Hulk

Doesn't everyone want that lol

BC928

You can mount it where you can get to it. Whether the sender will work without a filter IN it, I cannot tell. I will not take apart these news ones, I will remove the old ones and dissect.

BC928

Pics











SENDER (Not a pump, but contains a filter and a pressure valve)

BC928

I tried searching for the number that is printed on the metal pressure (what I think is a regulator) - but nothing came back.

It also says "5.1 bar" which is 14.7 * 5.1 = 74.97psi

rockthemullet

You can run any 6AN external really... I like the Russells.

Cut stock tube > AN compression fitting > external filter > AN compression fitting > cut stock tube

rockthemullet

That's a PRV. This is to protect the rest of the system from an overpressure event

ajm55

My 2 cents worth - I tried the Aeromotives for a while but was experiencing a fuel pressure issue with them installed. I switched to the AEMs but this did not resolve the fuel pressure issue. I then re-installed the stock pumps and doing so proved to be the fix. I don't know why some guys are successfully running the Aeromotives/AEMs while they were problematic on my set up. It may or may not be relevant but my pumps are staged - one runs all the time while the second is triggered only when going into boost. I recall reading somewhere that the pumps on E55s manufactured from Sept 2005 are staged while those on E55s manufactured before then are not.

95ONE

Sadly what I suspected. No regulator.

Awesome Pics. Thank you for posting those.

I was hoping for more so that I can use E85 with around 600whp (750 crank) without drastically changing the way the stock system is controlled. It doesn't look that way.

I can now see why so many have had fueling issues on E-85.

(if the pumps are indeed 300lph each) With pump gas, I think the only problem with the stock system is the smallish lines. (Which can certainly be changed with relatively - minimal effort.

BC928

I don't see this as being definitive. I think a lot of the internet is based upon one guy or another guy saying something "is" and then no one questioning it.

The pressure level would need to be higher for it to be an effective pressure relief valve, and the nature of the return inside the tank leads me to believe its an actual FPR - unless this is some sort of one time use blow off valve.

What about the e85 would require more than what exists here unless you are speaking of total flow? Open piped, the fuel from each pump is high volume. I ran one at a time to empty the tank for preparing for this work. BOTH running would be very large flow.

If the computer control of the pump speed exists, and if it is controlling the speed at certain rpms or boost levels, this is just fact based research and time.

If one comes to the conclusion that a return system is really needed, then you take off one of the pumps and separate the plug to power an external pump under the car with a swirl pot (old speak for surge tank for fuel) (A. Graham Bell) and then put a big pump there. The return side seems a bit more complex - where to return. What pressure sensor needs to be tricked?

95ONE

It certainly can be done.

I think my statement was more of a personal one. The electronic control of the system seems very important for the tune. I worry about the can of worms that has to be opened with the higher fuel rate and constant fuel volume in a return system in regards to how the computer wants the fuel to be controlled. Is it just fooling a pressure sensor? Or does the way the computer adjust fuel need to be addressed? I don't know. I'll let you guys figure that out from this point. I guess I'll stick with the Happy 500whp I should be getting when finished rebuilding. I'll hang on to that until this fueling issue is worked out.

But about that stupid fuel filter though.....

BC928

Yeah, you have an engine to rebuild. Sleeved block was fs recently for 3500 or so. That and custom pistons for higher compression, stock supercharger, meth, and ethanol, and that's where I would stop. You want more? Buy a V. And at that point, buy a normal sedan and get a vette.

rockthemullet

Interesting theory to consider

I'm over that power level and have not changed how the stock system is controlled. I have replaced the pumps/injectors, and will be upgrading the wiring... that's it.

Umm.. what return line? You may be mistaking the venturi system for a return line... are you talking about the one that snaps into the pump bucket coming from the driver side? It is not a one time use blow off valve, but it is not used in normal operation.

E85 requires 30% more fuel than standard gasoline, so everything about an E85 system must be larger to support the same power level. When you ran the pump to drain the tank, there was no pressure on the system. When you introduce 65psi base pressure to a fuel system, that flow is drastically reduced. The flow you saw is not representative of the flow the system sees during operation.

To create a return system on a returnless vehicle, one only needs to add ignition power through a relay and to the pumps. Run the pumps to the rails, then to an FPR, and back. Typically, a new larger line is ran for the feed and the original feed can be used as the return.

BC928

The pics show several lines. Clearly some are supply. Others are between tank balance.


I have run three separate cars on e85 for over 25k miles. I understand the decrease in BTUs and the resultant increase in total volume of fuel required. I also do understand that (as I mentioned, to make the point) the UNpressurized output when I was draining is not the full flow against the rail. I am saying that with both of them running, it is still quite a bit. If you are concerned over the increase in flow making the pumps wither a bit, I can understand that.

Its not 30% all the time, btw. Sometimes its only a bit more, and at very rich high rpms, it can be 40%.


The original lines could maybe be used for return. But the tank for emissions reasons is essentially supposed to remain sealed. One of the saddle sides would need a return piped into the externally facing piece of the baskets (read: messy) or you could actually drill in the tank itself (read: very messy).

95ONE

I'm just going with a used motor for now and will think about building the broken one. I will certainly get the heads ported and use some SLR type cams, but also, very in the future.

This IS my normal sedan and my "Vette" is the Porsche with an LS6 in my avatar.


Do you have that power level with E-85? Apologies for the lack of search.

So, running a return line is easy.. yes. enough. But how does the computer like it? Can you turn off the sensors to the ECU? Does the tune require a Static fuel pressure like 65psi? or 80 psi? or whatever the heck it wants to see.
I would want a rising rate Fuel Regulator. Could that be worked in? Or will that make tuning the ecu too difficult?

The physical aspect is fairly easy, yes. But what are the Software / tuning consequences in the ecu?

rockthemullet

Unfortunately, the way our heads are designed it's quite difficult to run any cams that would make considerable difference. I wouldn't spend the money, unless you're just doing it for the sound.

Yes, I'm at that power level on E85. There's really nothing to search, I don't post about it very often anymore.

I haven't modified my system to operate returnless so I wouldn't be the expert in what's required on the software side. It's certainly been done, and a retune would be required. Rising rate is probably the safest method on a boosted car, and I believe Craig's FPR is set up for rising rate. Someone else is running 1000cc injectors in a return format, can't think of who off the top of my head

Sir-Boost-a-Lot

iTrader: (1)

There's not really any problem with running big cams in the 55k heads.(within reason) The problem is that most people don't want choppy race cams in a luxury sedan so the cost per unit is really high unlike a Mustang/Camaro where you'll sell thousands of them.

With my beehive setup (do a search) you could run up to .500 lift, but the lift doesn't mean too much it's the duration and other timing events that will really affect the powerband. The duration is where you'll run into problems with PTV clearance unless you notch the pistons or have a custom set made with valve reliefs.

cnterline

I have Kleemann cams in my car and I believe they made a difference
03SL55 10.77@130.38

rockthemullet

I know of the Comp/Ferrea thread, I have it bookmarked

Kleemanns and SLRs have been documented at 15-20rwhp and a tenth in the quarter... I wouldn't really consider those big cams, or worth the investment. I guess if someone is going all out, then they may be worthwhile with the compounding effect but I would still shift my funds elsewhere.

To each their own

Sir-Boost-a-Lot

iTrader: (1)

Yeah those are super mild grinds, barely bigger than stock 55k cams and smaller than the stock cams in many newer engines. I'm with ya though, to each their own.