pros/cons johnson pump vs. bosch 010
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 607
Likes: 8
From: South Florida
W220 V12TT Land Yacht / W211 E55 Estate
pros/cons johnson pump vs. bosch 010
First "mod" bcuz southflorida... LOl
what are the pros/cons of these two pumps?
looking to place an order tonight. Thanks.
what are the pros/cons of these two pumps?
looking to place an order tonight. Thanks.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,319
Likes: 1
From: OC
AMG E55, Stage 1, Strait Pipe from Primary Cats
Joe, your kidding right? If not, you have a lot to learn. The newer Bosch pump is for sure adequate as the old design Bosch pump was pretty bad. The Johnson CM30 is a really good durable intercooler pump for the M113 motor. Serge from Benzworks turned me on to the CM30 many years ago and it is still on my car today. Weistec which is local to me also sells the CM30 for the M113 upgrades they have as well. Trust the tuners who actually test and engineer their own product.
http://weistec.com/all/e/e-55/2003-2006-w211-m113k.html
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,642
Likes: 13
From: Caribbean/Florida/Colorado
E-ZGO 53hp., 1999 E 430 sport, 2004 E 55, 2008 Tahoe LTZ on 24"s
The search will net a vast amount of knowledge.
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...g-results.html
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...g-results.html
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 607
Likes: 8
From: South Florida
W220 V12TT Land Yacht / W211 E55 Estate
The search will net a vast amount of knowledge.
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...g-results.html
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...g-results.html
so which one is better under a load (head) than the other? And which one has a lower electrical draw? (from your post #8 it sounds like you know, but didn't want to say)
Also, I would imagine that is for the early pump (I think 003 vs. the newest revision the 010 that I am asking about in this thread)
Trending Topics
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,642
Likes: 13
From: Caribbean/Florida/Colorado
E-ZGO 53hp., 1999 E 430 sport, 2004 E 55, 2008 Tahoe LTZ on 24"s
LOL. incredibly unhelpful....
so which one is better under a load (head) than the other? And which one has a lower electrical draw? (from your post #8 it sounds like you know, but didn't want to say)
Also, I would imagine that is for the early pump (I think 003 vs. the newest revision the 010 that I am asking about in this thread)
so which one is better under a load (head) than the other? And which one has a lower electrical draw? (from your post #8 it sounds like you know, but didn't want to say)
Also, I would imagine that is for the early pump (I think 003 vs. the newest revision the 010 that I am asking about in this thread)
At least 200 posts that comment your question.
This is nothing new, the 010 has been out for years.
Here is one you won't find in a search,
https://mbworld.org/forums/m275-v12-...ion-pumps.html
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
10 Most Reliable Mercedes-Benz Models You Can Buy Used
Verdad Gallardo
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,429
Likes: 61
From: Cypress, TX
'06 E55, '15 Jeep SRT8, '94 Mustang GT
Joe, your kidding right? If not, you have a lot to learn. The newer Bosch pump is for sure adequate as the old design Bosch pump was pretty bad. The Johnson CM30 is a really good durable intercooler pump for the M113 motor. Serge from Benzworks turned me on to the CM30 many years ago and it is still on my car today. Weistec which is local to me also sells the CM30 for the M113 upgrades they have as well. Trust the tuners who actually test and engineer their own product.
http://weistec.com/all/e/e-55/2003-2006-w211-m113k.html
http://weistec.com/all/e/e-55/2003-2006-w211-m113k.html
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 607
Likes: 8
From: South Florida
W220 V12TT Land Yacht / W211 E55 Estate
Ok you missed the part about doing a search, that would be the helpfull part.
At least 200 posts that comment your question.
This is nothing new, the 010 has been out for years.
Here is one you won't find in a search,
https://mbworld.org/forums/m275-v12-...ion-pumps.html
At least 200 posts that comment your question.
This is nothing new, the 010 has been out for years.
Here is one you won't find in a search,
https://mbworld.org/forums/m275-v12-...ion-pumps.html
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,187
Likes: 239
From: Santa Clara, Ca
2003 SL55 / 2002 SLK32
I replaced my new 010 pump with the CWA-50 (Pierburg pump used in BMW applications) ... and it was an improvement.
The chart below shows how the various pumps compare (in typical IC circuit environments) ... The Bosch 010 (an obvious upgrade from the 002) has pretty good flow relative torestriction ... the johnson appears to be suited for pumping bilges and little more. Where they intersect the "Charge Cooler Resistance" line, is the point at which they should be compared (go straight down from the intersection to the "flow" shown at bottom of graph).
This is a VERY long discussion on Heat exchangers and pumps that is interesting.
https://mbworld.org/forums/m275-v12-...ion-pumps.html
below is a pic of the 010 next to the CWA-50
Cheers,
Chris
The chart below shows how the various pumps compare (in typical IC circuit environments) ... The Bosch 010 (an obvious upgrade from the 002) has pretty good flow relative torestriction ... the johnson appears to be suited for pumping bilges and little more. Where they intersect the "Charge Cooler Resistance" line, is the point at which they should be compared (go straight down from the intersection to the "flow" shown at bottom of graph).
This is a VERY long discussion on Heat exchangers and pumps that is interesting.
https://mbworld.org/forums/m275-v12-...ion-pumps.html
below is a pic of the 010 next to the CWA-50
Cheers,
Chris
Last edited by latemodel21; Mar 18, 2015 at 12:02 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,187
Likes: 239
From: Santa Clara, Ca
2003 SL55 / 2002 SLK32
1) a cm30 flows better than a failed 002 .
2) a cm30 is likely installed at the same time as a new heat exchanger (making a valid end-user comparison impossible).
3) most people don't log their IATs before and after an "upgrade"
4) most consumers want to believe their car is better after every "upgrade"....
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 607
Likes: 8
From: South Florida
W220 V12TT Land Yacht / W211 E55 Estate
I replaced my new 010 pump with the CWA-50 (Pierburg pump used in BMW applications) ... and it was an improvement.
The chart below shows how the various pumps compare (in typical IC circuit environments) ... The Bosch 010 (an obvious upgrade from the 002) has pretty good flow relative torestriction ... the johnson appears to be suited for pumping bilges and little more. Where they intersect the "Charge Cooler Resistance" line, is the point at which they should be compared (go straight down from the intersection to the "flow" shown at bottom of graph).
This is a VERY long discussion on Heat exchangers and pumps that is interesting.
https://mbworld.org/forums/m275-v12-...ion-pumps.html
below is a pic of the 010 next to the CWA-50
Cheers,
Chris
The chart below shows how the various pumps compare (in typical IC circuit environments) ... The Bosch 010 (an obvious upgrade from the 002) has pretty good flow relative torestriction ... the johnson appears to be suited for pumping bilges and little more. Where they intersect the "Charge Cooler Resistance" line, is the point at which they should be compared (go straight down from the intersection to the "flow" shown at bottom of graph).
This is a VERY long discussion on Heat exchangers and pumps that is interesting.
https://mbworld.org/forums/m275-v12-...ion-pumps.html
below is a pic of the 010 next to the CWA-50
Cheers,
Chris
Chris, thanks for that info!!! Where is the best place to pick up a CWA-50? Do I have to replace system with larger lines to get it to fit? Also, I assume you did a HE as well. Got a recommendation on that? You seem to know your stuff and are willing to share the info. lol
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,187
Likes: 239
From: Santa Clara, Ca
2003 SL55 / 2002 SLK32
Chris, thanks for that info!!! Where is the best place to pick up a CWA-50? Do I have to replace system with larger lines to get it to fit? Also, I assume you did a HE as well. Got a recommendation on that? You seem to know your stuff and are willing to share the info. lol
I did do an H.E. as well (here is some pics of that) https://mbworld.org/forums/sl55-amg-...ml#post6307087
The CWA-50 requires adapter harness that is easy to make (pics below) and it's size makes it easy to mount (I made the bracket in the photo). it draws a tick more than the 010 (4.8 amps vs 4 or so for the 010) ... and it is quieter than the 010.
Cheers,
Chris
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 607
Likes: 8
From: South Florida
W220 V12TT Land Yacht / W211 E55 Estate
Standard size lines fit on the CWA-50 . They retail for 200 or more, but seem to be easy to find new on ebay for close to $100 (they are popular for electric vehicle cooling duties and seem to have filled some shelves at failed electric car start-ups).
I did do an H.E. as well (here is some pics of that) https://mbworld.org/forums/sl55-amg-...ml#post6307087
The CWA-50 requires adapter harness that is easy to make (pics below) and it's size makes it easy to mount (I made the bracket in the photo). it draws a tick more than the 010 (4.8 amps vs 4 or so for the 010) ... and it is quieter than the 010.
Cheers,
Chris
I did do an H.E. as well (here is some pics of that) https://mbworld.org/forums/sl55-amg-...ml#post6307087
The CWA-50 requires adapter harness that is easy to make (pics below) and it's size makes it easy to mount (I made the bracket in the photo). it draws a tick more than the 010 (4.8 amps vs 4 or so for the 010) ... and it is quieter than the 010.
Cheers,
Chris
do you have a p/n for the pierburg unit? If its a bmw application, does it have a bmw p/n? I cant seem to find any on ebay.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,187
Likes: 239
From: Santa Clara, Ca
2003 SL55 / 2002 SLK32
http://www.ebay.com/itm/261703701088?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
it describes it as, "
Pierburg Hydraulic Pump/Coolant 50W pn. 7.01360.48.0."
on a related note, I was curious if my car would benefit from hard-wiring (to position 2, etc) the power for the IC pump. So I logged the power for a week or so and found for my car (2003 SL55 US version), the factory set-up is Ideal. Within the first 100 yards of driving from a cold start (my driveway, in the morning), the pump comes on and then stays on until a few seconds AFTER you shut the car off (with the only exception being that the pump will turn off if you come to a full stop when the IAT is below 70 F or so). If you start the car when it is warm, it comes on near-instantly.
Cheers,
Chris
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,319
Likes: 1
From: OC
AMG E55, Stage 1, Strait Pipe from Primary Cats
The answers that come to minds are
1) a cm30 flows better than a failed 002 .
2) a cm30 is likely installed at the same time as a new heat exchanger (making a valid end-user comparison impossible).
3) most people don't log their IATs before and after an "upgrade"
4) most consumers want to believe their car is better after every "upgrade"....
1) a cm30 flows better than a failed 002 .
2) a cm30 is likely installed at the same time as a new heat exchanger (making a valid end-user comparison impossible).
3) most people don't log their IATs before and after an "upgrade"
4) most consumers want to believe their car is better after every "upgrade"....
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,187
Likes: 239
From: Santa Clara, Ca
2003 SL55 / 2002 SLK32
Looking forward to reading your before and after IAT data
Cheers,
Chris
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,187
Likes: 239
From: Santa Clara, Ca
2003 SL55 / 2002 SLK32
"Monitoring operation and manual control of the pump can be accomplished using the service tool EMPower Connect which is part of the EMP Service Suite available at no cost on our website at:
http://www.emp-corp.com/support/downloads/"
in any case, You got a great pump at a great price !
Cheers,
Chris
Super Member
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 701
Likes: 6
From: San Diego
05 E55, 07 ML500
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,187
Likes: 239
From: Santa Clara, Ca
2003 SL55 / 2002 SLK32
In the end, it might be the best pump you can put on your car (though perhaps more pump than most need). I've been reasonably happy with the bosch 010 and feel I have enough pump with the CWA-50 ... but this EMP WP29 is likely as much pump as could be needed (and therefore, a good choice for "no-limit" modding).
Cheers,
Chris
