Those BMW idiots really have their heads up their ***!
http://www.germantechnik.com/showthr...5&pagenumber=1

 

I'd love to see it but the link isn't working.

 

wow I suck at the intarweb ....its fixed

 

Hey now, no one is putting down the e55 there. It is a very level headed debate. More people are taking shots at the new 5's styling than bagging on the e55.

 

I love my E55, but can't find anything in Sticky's post there to disagree with. Popeye had a great line that kind of applies. I yam what I yam.

 

I don't see anything there that I don't basically agree with...MB does target a different audience, if not my E55 would have a diffrerent gearbox and handle much better. We all know the new (and maybe old) M5 will eat the E55 for lunch on a road course. I still like the styling of the E55 much better, but the 5 series is growing on me. I saw a black 545i with some nice wheels and for the first time I was wowed by the looks. The E55 looks much better to me than a E320 or E500, so its possible the M5 wil look different enough from the other 5 series to win me over. The interior remains to be seen. I hope BMW does it right.

We know ther M5 won't have the supercharger chirp that has finally appeared on mine 2 days ago. What a f'in joke!

 

Jkrutch - There are pictures of the new m5's tach and interior available.

 

Where???

 

http://www.germantechnik.com/showthr...&threadid=2592

 

I always wonder when people make statements like these. I think people oftentimes make assumptions about the handling of a car, but from what I can gather, most street-legal vehicles don't seem to have a huge difference in terms of handling. Case-in-point is an article that I read (my buddy with an M3 forwarded this to me) wherein they published laptimes around the Nurburgring North Loop (Nordschleife!) for the Porsche Cayenne vis a vis the E46 M3. Surprisingly enough, the big hulk of a Cayenne (I can't remember if it was a turbo or not -- huge difference, I guess) was quicker than the M3 by a tick around the circuit! I would've guessed that the Cayenne might be faster than the M3

In watching the McLaren-Mercedes comparison video, where they take an A160, an E50 AMG and an F1 vehicle, you see that there's only a 15 second difference around Silverstone between the two road cars. I can imagine Mika Hakkinen in the A160 giving most of us on this board a hard time even if we were driving the E50. But all hypotheticals aside, I'd like to see some real numbers when this soon-to-be released M5 and the W211 E55 actually go head to head on the same circuit. I highly doubt that the M5 will "eat the E55 for lunch."

 

Believe it or not, but the cayenne is an amazing handler. I have a cayenne and an sl500 and I would rather take the cayenne through a canyon than the SL.

 

I'm the old man as mentioned in the discussion. I rather have the E55 with all the luxury.

Let's face it I didn't buy the car for the track or to take corners twice the speed limit. I will never bring it to the drag strip or race it in a road course either. It's my daily workhorse I enjoy my music, I communicate with my offices, and get stuck in traffic in it. And I can pass cars in an effortless manner when I'm in a rush.

A manual will be ill suited for my purpose and the SMG may even be too rough for my enjoyment. The E55 handles perfectly well as far as I'm concerned. I do not want to sacrifice the ride for any additional 'sportiness'.

Let's not forget what's perfect for you may not be perfect for others. I for one will 'strangely' prefer a quieter interior without the intrusive engine and exhaust noise. I will definitely not prefer a convertible in my daily work horse for example. I want comfort, I want safety.

Most kids interested in racing each other will long for a manual and complaint over the lack of sportiness in the E55; I understand most of these kids do not have the financial means to buy a E55. I suspect once they have the means, they would choose to buy a slightly used Porche Turbo over an M5 or E55 anyway, for the handling, if not the image.

For what I pay for the E55, it's an great car with excellent value. I seriously doubt the M5 will be a better solution for my needs. Even if BMW can fix up the very cheap interior and the strange looking front, the iDrive is still a mess complicating simple tasks slowing me down. I mean does it even have a numerica keypad for one to quickly dial a phone number?

Different cars for different users.

 

The 7 series I-drive does....not sure about the 5...I stopped by a bmw dealer one day to see what the if the i-drive is as bad as they say...there was a small button of the dash....I pressed it and what looked like the keypad on a cellphone popped out...I was like WTF....so I pressed 911....and then it started ringing....so I jumped out of the car and ran like a little girl....
Has anyone tried the new version of i-drive??? They supposedly made it less complicated...but im guessing that I probably still won't be able to understand it? gotta be one of those german engineers to figure that out...

 

The 5 does not have the pop up numeric keypad like the 7. Bangle chooses to put useless wood and plastic trims to replace the functional buttons. What a joke.

 

A three (let alone 15) second differential on a road course is an eternity just as a half a second in the quarter mile is a HUGE difference as well. Here's why...Picture a 30 lap race and car "A" is 3 seconds per lap quicker than car "B"....at the end of the race car "A" is 90 seconds ahead of car "B". For many road courses that 90 seconds can easily be a lap or better.

In the 1/4 mile, a few tenths for cars of the E55/M5 caliber translates to a few car lengths at the end of the trap. I don't think Krispy has a lot of racing experience based on the comments.

I stand by my statement regarding the E55's handling. It is mediocre at best. I have driven the older m5 and the handling is much closer to that of my 911TT then the E55 is.

 

Your rather theoretical analysis assumes that you've got a driver consistent enough to maximize a car's potential each and everytime around the track, or at a minimum be consistent -- and most amateur "racers" I know are not capable of setting such consistent laptimes. (Though I do appreciate your guess as to my "racing background," I do have some experience with autocross and karting.) Yes, 15 seconds is HUGE if you're talking about two professional racers in equal cars, but the A160/E50 example discusses cars of disparate horsepower and acceleration -- my point is simply that given such a disparity, you'd think that the E50 would beat the A160 by a much higher margin around Silverstone.

In any case, your original assertion was that "[w]e all know the new (and maybe old) M5 will eat the E55 for lunch on a road course." I don't know that, nor do you or anyone else here. In my mind, that implies that the M5 is more than a mere "half-second" faster around a given road course than the E55. It also seems to imply that two average enthusiasts driving the two cars would have the M5 driver winning each and every time. I simply don't think that's necessarily true. And having taken the liberty of assuming that you're no Michael Schumacher yourself, please don't be terribly offended if I don't take your impression of the E39 M5's handling as being canon.

In the end, this is a hypothetical exercise between an available car and (what is now) merely a hypothetical vehicle. Let's settle this when the E60 M5 is available and we can get some laptimes vis a vis the E55. And until then, enjoy the following link: http://bmwdeler.no/nordschleife.html

 

Interestingly cntrary to popular belief, the W210 E55, in both lap times at various circuits as well as tests in the hands of expert drivers was rated above the E39 M5, which was roundly criticised for its lack of front grip and abundance of oversteer.
While the M5 certainly is a more "direct" car than the W211, do not read that to mean that it is better handling, because, good as it was, it not up to the legend that it has been made out to be objectively.
An even handed analysis of the W210/E39 debate was that the E55 was a better balanced car. The M5 was sportier with the advantage of a manual, which is a key selling point for many. Performance was a wash, with the M5 slighly quicker off the mark, but the E55 faster in roll ons and split times. Basically very equal cars with strengths and weaknesses that made each better suited for different users.
Now if the W210 E55 and the E39 M5 were equals and the W211 is a vast improvement on the W210, the new M5 will need to be a vast improvment toequal the new AMG.
Having said all of that, I think that the W211 E55 has had a fundamental change of direction and is now positioned as a luxury GT sedan. As long as the M5 sticks to its core values as a sports sedan, I don't even see them competing with one another, both targeting very different owners albeit with similar budgets.
The problem is for customers such as myself who want a car that is brilliant at being a grand tourer as well as a sports car. maybe I am just asking for too much?
Also having seen the new 5 on the road, particulalrly in silver, I have formed the view that it is not just ugly, it is sickening. This is not beemer bashing, I have an E46 330 convertible in the drive too.

 

Having driven the E39 M5 on numerous occasions and having owned both the W210 & W211 E55, I totally agree with you.

 

hey guys,

i think i read this in Autoweek....."there is no perfect car...just the perfect car for you". seems to make sense.

 

Reading through these posts I'm chuckling to myself, thinking about the traffic I have to contend with where I live. Left lane bandits and creeping slow Moes galore. I'd have to hit the road at 3 a.m. to have a chance of truly putting my car through its paces, and then we're upping the odds of smashing into a deer. So that's one factor for me. Then when you start looking at various cars capabilities, driver talent has to come into the equation. I'm no Jeff Gordon. I'm not even a Richard Petty. Todays Richard Petty...on a bad day...with a hangover. LOL Maybe if I could truly push my car right to the edge I'd say I have to get something that handles better. So for me it comes down to things like the cars looks, comfort, smooth ride, enjoyment of the cabin features(Stereo, Nav, Keyless Go) and acceleration. However, aside from a cars handling ability there is its feel. BMW's have a sportier "feel' to them, even if you're just loafing through the twisties. Right now I wouldn't give up what I have to have that feel again, but I do miss it.

 

There's no doubt that the new M5 will be quite the driver's car, but despite looking good from the side, the rear is hideous and the front is unattractive. Pictures of the M5 on the web look nicer than the non-M cars, but marginally so. The new M5 wheels are unattractive as are the tailpipes. The M's front fascia is a significant improvement but it dosn't change the fact that the car has been Bungholed. I was very impressed by the way the 545i handled, and when driving it hard I was even able to suppress it's exterior appearance to the point where I was actually giving it some serious thoughts (for my wife if you remember my previous thread on this topic). Then the cheap looking interior and I-drive started kicking in and reminded me why I prefer MB over BMW.

A few weeks ago a colleague of mine at work took delivery of a 545i with sport package that stickered at over $62,000 and happened to be the same color as my car. I frequently park next to her car and then the difference in appearance is even more dramatic. The E has smooth flowing lines and a very solid look while the 545 albeit has a more aggressive stance, appears oddly matched with its smooth side lines and ackward high trunkline and taillights. Several people have told me they prefer the MB to the BMW when they are parked together. The owner of the 545 has told me she's gotten a lot of compliments too (probably from the visually impaired ).


To summarize. Would I prefer the handling of the M5 over the E55-DEFINITELY. Would I prefer the manual tranny over the automatic-DEFINITELY. Would I prefer the high-revving V10 over the high torque supercharged V8-Maybe. Would I prefer the E60 M5 over the W211 E55-ABSOLUTELY NOT! Maybe a 911 TT though.

 

Sorry ot differ with you Dr., I prefer automatic, because I could never shift as precisely as expert drivers (I use all manual cameras, though); I drove an M3 with SMG and did not like the way it shifted; but I like the look of the M5 and even more the 7 series.

I have a deposit on the E55. I wont consider the M5. The RS 6 was appealing but it was too low on features.

 

Wow, someone who actually likes the look of both the 5 and 7 series. You're the first person I've come across who feels that way. Does that make you a Bunghole afficionado?

J.K.

 

No Dr., I don't think it does. I like the front end of both cars and the inside of the 7. But I'll get the E55.

 

Has anyone seen the photoshopped version of the AC5 with quad exhaust? Looks damned nice. The only reason I haven't ordered an E55 is because of what the M5 could be. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.