E55 Eurocharged mids vs Maximizer long tube headers
#26
Super Member
Yeah that elevation will kill boost that's for sure. I lose around 3 psi at my elevation. I see 10psi of boost with my 185mm crank pulley. My number 10 nozzle is post intercooler to cool down the charge. That's mostly speculation about giving the sensor a false reading. The spray is evaporated fairly quick and in result giving the cooler charge. It's worked great for me so far. Look into a race gas tune to get the max out of your mods.
#27
MBWorld Fanatic!
Not just a length difference - the MBH have true merge collectors and are 1.75" primaries. The OBX have "fake" merge collectors - still better than the Klee/EC that neck down to a 1.5" ID, though.
#30
Super Member
About this timing pull in 3 stages at the different IAT... I am yet to see a graph showing the timing pull... I have gone back To my very first datalogs before I started with the cooling mods so on a stock cooling system with a 77mm upper and my intake Temps got well hot above the last stage of timing pull, and I did not see timing being pulled by the ecu, in fact even now with much cooler intake Temps my timing is the same... Can someone show me the timing pull? I think it's a fallacy personally. The ecu dumping fuel yes that I have seen, not timing pull.
#31
Member
Thread Starter
About this timing pull in 3 stages at the different IAT... I am yet to see a graph showing the timing pull... I have gone back To my very first datalogs before I started with the cooling mods so on a stock cooling system with a 77mm upper and my intake Temps got well hot above the last stage of timing pull, and I did not see timing being pulled by the ecu, in fact even now with much cooler intake Temps my timing is the same... Can someone show me the timing pull? I think it's a fallacy personally. The ecu dumping fuel yes that I have seen, not timing pull.
Bottom left corner lists the timing pull for our ECU.
#32
Super Member
Yeah for sure I have seen it in writing, but have not seen or experienced it at all. Was hoping someone had a dyno proving and showing the timing pull. I mean I have easily hit over 70C IAT in the past yet my timing was still 19 degrees, you should easily see then only 9 degrees timing at those Temps as it is supposed to pull back 9.5 degrees according to Mercedes written material. I am yet to witness this scenario however. Anyone else?
Last edited by C32owner; 10-29-2017 at 08:55 AM.
#33
Yeah for sure I have seen it in writing, but have not seen or experienced it at all. Was hoping someone had a dyno proving and showing the timing pull. I mean I have easily hit over 70C IAT in the past yet my timing was still 19 degrees, you should easily see then only 9 degrees timing at those Temps as it is supposed to pull back 9.5 degrees according to Mercedes written material. I am yet to witness this scenario however. Anyone else?
You checking timing ?
#34
Super Member
Here is my experience with strapping the mount. I had two issues with my exhaust.
One is the header rubbing on the RHD steering rack. The other is my 3 inch pipe on the left hand side from the down pipe to the x-pipe where the secondaries used to be rubbing on the heat shield under HEAVY HEAVY load.
After strapping the engine the steering rack still rubs, but the dealership will take them off for free, get an exhaust shop to modify them and reinstall, all I have to do is pay the exhaust shop for the adjustments.
The engine no longer twists enough to rub the 3 inch pipe on the left hand side under heavy heavy load that I have noticed. I'm down to the canvas on my rear tires so once I get those replaced I'll report back more after some more vigorous testing.
I will check the health of the strap sometime this week. I am was concerned about heat damage being so close to the exhaust but I suspect it will be fine. It should melt before it catches fire as its polyester.Melt Range: 220°-268° Ignite Range:432°-488° (temps in Celsius)
P Rat.
One is the header rubbing on the RHD steering rack. The other is my 3 inch pipe on the left hand side from the down pipe to the x-pipe where the secondaries used to be rubbing on the heat shield under HEAVY HEAVY load.
After strapping the engine the steering rack still rubs, but the dealership will take them off for free, get an exhaust shop to modify them and reinstall, all I have to do is pay the exhaust shop for the adjustments.
The engine no longer twists enough to rub the 3 inch pipe on the left hand side under heavy heavy load that I have noticed. I'm down to the canvas on my rear tires so once I get those replaced I'll report back more after some more vigorous testing.
I will check the health of the strap sometime this week. I am was concerned about heat damage being so close to the exhaust but I suspect it will be fine. It should melt before it catches fire as its polyester.Melt Range: 220°-268° Ignite Range:432°-488° (temps in Celsius)
P Rat.
#35
Here is my experience with strapping the mount. I had two issues with my exhaust.
One is the header rubbing on the RHD steering rack. The other is my 3 inch pipe on the left hand side from the down pipe to the x-pipe where the secondaries used to be rubbing on the heat shield under HEAVY HEAVY load.
After strapping the engine the steering rack still rubs, but the dealership will take them off for free, get an exhaust shop to modify them and reinstall, all I have to do is pay the exhaust shop for the adjustments.
The engine no longer twists enough to rub the 3 inch pipe on the left hand side under heavy heavy load that I have noticed. I'm down to the canvas on my rear tires so once I get those replaced I'll report back more after some more vigorous testing.
I will check the health of the strap sometime this week. I am was concerned about heat damage being so close to the exhaust but I suspect it will be fine. It should melt before it catches fire as its polyester.Melt Range: 220°-268° Ignite Range:432°-488° (temps in Celsius)
P Rat.
One is the header rubbing on the RHD steering rack. The other is my 3 inch pipe on the left hand side from the down pipe to the x-pipe where the secondaries used to be rubbing on the heat shield under HEAVY HEAVY load.
After strapping the engine the steering rack still rubs, but the dealership will take them off for free, get an exhaust shop to modify them and reinstall, all I have to do is pay the exhaust shop for the adjustments.
The engine no longer twists enough to rub the 3 inch pipe on the left hand side under heavy heavy load that I have noticed. I'm down to the canvas on my rear tires so once I get those replaced I'll report back more after some more vigorous testing.
I will check the health of the strap sometime this week. I am was concerned about heat damage being so close to the exhaust but I suspect it will be fine. It should melt before it catches fire as its polyester.Melt Range: 220°-268° Ignite Range:432°-488° (temps in Celsius)
P Rat.
#36
Senior Member
In my experience with NA vehicles, long tubes were really effective over a small rpm range and only if the primaries were equal length and length chosen to actually pulse extract, as in tuned for that rpm. Otherwise without extraction an engine will only see the restriction to flow. Long tubes will have slightly less restriction as the primaries are longer before the collector than shorties or mids and hence there is a bigger cross section in that distance. Interesting that there is no mention of primary pipe diameter which also is a factor in flow velocity as it relates to the pulse tuning. There is also the matter of cross banked primaries which is the only real way to maximize pulse tuning.
#37
Attachment 414651
There is definitely a difference. I only have the one log with meth in a pull to 110, IAT below 95 the whole time. You can see ALL of my track logs generally have less timing, double digit diferences in a couple spots but it seems pretty random as to wether it's a 3° difference or a 9° difference regardless of IATs. Might be due to the slow logging of torque.
I attached my excel sheet comparison between some track runs without meth and my pull with meth. Kind of slow logging point but it's a good indicator that IATs definitely effect timing. I showed this excel sheet before but this time I labeled and color coded everything, and did a column with timing comparisons referring to the low IAT with meth pull.
EDIT: Uploaded CSV insdead of excel, got rid of all my formatting Fixed it and the right one is uploaded.
Yeah for sure I have seen it in writing, but have not seen or experienced it at all. Was hoping someone had a dyno proving and showing the timing pull. I mean I have easily hit over 70C IAT in the past yet my timing was still 19 degrees, you should easily see then only 9 degrees timing at those Temps as it is supposed to pull back 9.5 degrees according to Mercedes written material. I am yet to witness this scenario however. Anyone else?
I attached my excel sheet comparison between some track runs without meth and my pull with meth. Kind of slow logging point but it's a good indicator that IATs definitely effect timing. I showed this excel sheet before but this time I labeled and color coded everything, and did a column with timing comparisons referring to the low IAT with meth pull.
EDIT: Uploaded CSV insdead of excel, got rid of all my formatting Fixed it and the right one is uploaded.
Last edited by drothgeb; 10-31-2017 at 11:01 PM.
#38
Super Member
Attachment 414651There is definitely a difference. I only have the one log with meth in a pull to 110, IAT below 95 the whole time. You can see ALL of my track logs generally have less timing, double digit diferences in a couple spots but it seems pretty random as to wether it's a 3° difference or a 9° difference regardless of IATs. Might be due to the slow logging of torque.
I attached my excel sheet comparison between some track runs without meth and my pull with meth. Kind of slow logging point but it's a good indicator that IATs definitely effect timing. I showed this excel sheet before but this time I labeled and color coded everything, and did a column with timing comparisons referring to the low IAT with meth pull.
EDIT: Uploaded CSV insdead of excel, got rid of all my formatting Fixed it and the right one is uploaded.
I attached my excel sheet comparison between some track runs without meth and my pull with meth. Kind of slow logging point but it's a good indicator that IATs definitely effect timing. I showed this excel sheet before but this time I labeled and color coded everything, and did a column with timing comparisons referring to the low IAT with meth pull.
EDIT: Uploaded CSV insdead of excel, got rid of all my formatting Fixed it and the right one is uploaded.
#39
Super Member
I went for some skids yesterday. Noticed my exhaust was rubbing again so went under to investigate. The strap I had put in snapped (looked almost clean enough to have been cut with scissors). Guess you need one rated for much more than 410kg like mine was. No sign of wear from heat or burning. Strap was held in place by the under tray so didn't cause any trouble.
#40
Super Member
VRP or any vendor that sells the headers should offer plug extensions for the secondary 02 sensors. Wonder why they don't...
#41
Member
Thread Starter
Option 1:
Code them out via Star.
Option 2:
Get two O2 bungs and have an exhaust shop weld them closer so the rear O2 sensors can reach. Cap the rear ones in the mid pipe with O2 bung caps. Get mini cat extenders. Install them, clear codes and rear O2 CEL should be not reappear anymore. You have a variety of options that work regarding the mini cat extenders:
1. http://www.bigdaddiesgarage.com/mini-cat-cel-fix.html
2. https://www.americanmuscle.com/prosp...gree-7917.html
3. https://www.fabspeed.com/universal-o...verter-single/
Option 3:
Don't mod.
#42
Super Member
Thanks for taking the time for the extended reply, good info.
Last edited by Fountain35; 11-14-2018 at 02:26 AM.