is it possible for a 2012 E63 to take a RS7 with tune only, or will we need to get down pipes and 1 step lower plugs and possibly upgrade cooling?

it better......

.?

Nope, Not even w/Dwn Pipes & ecu.. I haven't seen 1 E63 biturbo run faster than or even = RS7 Tune only record of 10.7x or the latest it just ran 10.15 but I find this hard to fathom as the 10.7x was done w/stg 1 tune @ 738 bhp the 10.15 is supposedly done w/just few more hp stg 2 @ 750 bhp impossibly hard to believe it shaves nearly 1/2 second more off 1/4
I believe the runs are valid but think the 10.15 run must have more mods or ran in incredibly neg DA etc.. The DCT tranns is obviously a wicked combo here, w/out it impossible to get a 4000lb curb weight auto, add driver = at least 4150-4200 lbs w/only 750 hp to run 10.15

http://www.dragtimes.ru/en/video/464

Mind boggling indeed I thought AMS upgraded turbo pkg @ 850 bhp was faster, umm nope 10.7x @ 135mph so nearly equal in curbweight RS7 ECU only runs same 10.7x w/100 LESS HP & even less TQ AMS pkg has 900 BTQ Guess the DCT is the defining factor here?
Mercedes E63 AMG Alpha 9 [900 HP]: Insane SOUND -…:
Ignore the 900 hp description on video face, when you read description in more detail in the comments, it clearly says 850 hp 900 tq

Though the CLS63 w/same Biturbo & upgraded turbs/exhaust/etc etc just ran 10.35 @ 139 mph.. The E63 biturbo should be able to run the same w/equal mods as curb weights similar etc http://www.dragtimes.com/Mercedes-Be...lip-27147.html

sorry my dyslexia....thought u asked about a e63 with tune against a rs7

and rs7 vs a e63 no tune is no good for mercedes either due to the 4wd of the audi

This video is of the pre facelift rear wheel drive E63. It is not one of the AWD 2014+ models. Accordingly it is not an apples to apples comparison. Once we see a run of a turbo upgrade AWD 2014+ model we will have an apples to apples (AWD E63 vs AWD RS7) comparison.

Simply put the jury is out. We won't know the answer until we see a quarter mile run of a turbo upgrade 2014+ AWD E63.

Sounds like op is asking that if he tunes his 2012 biturbo rwd e63 if this will beat a stock audi rs7...

From a dig I think the stock audi still gets the tuned rwd biturbo e63, however from a roll the Audi may suffer from the same parasitic loss of power due to awd as the 2014 e63 does from a roll

There's no point as the RS7 ran 10.7x w/ECU only & supposedly w/just 15 more whp @ 750bhp on stg2 tune ran 10.15.. ALL these RS7 runs again are w/OUT turbo upgrades.. I just included the upgraded turbo runs from Mercedes to show what it took to get closer to the minimally modded Audi RS7

This happens all the time, why don't you guys try reading just a tad slower you'd of seen this yourself

Ha I think you are correct, the way he wrote it it appears OP was asking if BOTH were just ECU only..

I still have yet to understand what magic makes the rs7 as brilliant as it is in a straight line... Is it the dct?

Your 1st guess was proly right, OP wrote it a bit confusing I thought ECU to ECU but if he meant MB E63 w/tune vs STOCK RS7? then yes E63 should win..

Bro I've been scratching my head ever since it ran 10.7x esp w/AWD it tends to have less top end & slower traps but not Audi even @ 4150-4200lbs w/driver it's an animal! Only variable left is DCT amazing if it really hit 10.15 w/out turbo upgrades as they claim it's ONLY Stage 2 ECU, high octane drag tires etc..

+1. Better launch control and better traction perhaps plus better tranny.

Didn't think RS7 had DCT, Audi website says - Eight-speed Tiptronic® automatic transmission with quattro® all-wheel drive and sport differential

Sounds like a torque converter automatic, which is actually really good for a turbo drag car

Good catch

As I watch vids of the e63 4 matic launch and compare it to the rs7, it seems the rs7 just gets out of the hole faster and is able to better put the power to the ground ... The rs7 has some serious squat on launch

RS7 is faster due to better AWD system, versus Mercedes fixed AWD with mechanical LSD on rear. RS7 transmission is only small part of it.

Not a chance. The AWD advantage will more than make up for any hp/tq differences. There are multiple videos of the RS7 going up against RWD monsters like the M6 and E63 and the RS7 blows them all away. You would need an E63 S AWD with a tune to take the RS7 imo.

The RS7 has the ZF8 tranny--- its quite formidable for a traditional tq converting system. I had two ZF's at the same time with the RS7 (still have) and the F Type R (sold) and the shifts in sport mode were fast, crisp and competitive in rollers. Its closer geared 8 speed and there are times where I cant discern it from my GT3 or 458 shifts but clearly it out shifts the C63 Black's MCT.

So with that being said and my past experience with 3 M157 engines (which I all had stock then tuned: CLS63, E63 Wagon, and SL63). A stock vs stock dig battle would be simple destruction of the non AWD E63. A stock vs stock roller would be closer but I would still take my RS7 with its gearing and arguably better tranny (even though awd sucks up power). Now a tuned battle stock vs stock: The RS7 wins again against the non AWD M157 by buses and still imho beats the E63S AWD tuned as well but it would be close.... the rollers would possibly be even or even towards the E63 non S tuned since it doesnt have the AWD system and the tune gains are immense with the M157. The rollers with the E63S AWD would be a toss up IMHO.

The RS7 is an incredible car and I am about to celebrate its bday (this is huge since I dump cars after 6 months) and since I did the tune I have enjoyed this car even more.


Edit, forgot about tuned 2012 vs non tuned RS7. The RS7 would still win easily from a dig but would lose in the quarter against a properly driven tuned M157 (they trap 127+). Rollers would be the same- the E63 tuned would pull out ahead with much more hp and tq and no AWD power robbers.

Funny you mentioned this Vic.

I have 2 buddies, one with an E63 Tuned by Renntech (1 of the tunes that yields the most gains) and another friend with an APR tuned RS7.

Both are good drivers.

From a dig the RS7 wins to 100 more times then it loses (probably because of the lighting fast shifts. From a roll they are pretty much even. Both cars trap 130 with tunes in slightly negative DA.

One thing is for certain. These are 2 of the nicest sedans (by that I mean 4 doors), that you can buy. When you tune these bad boys they are supercar exotic fast.

Excellent real world testing.. Was the E63 AWD? Curious just how many lengths did the RS7 put on E63 from a DIG?

I would love a zed eff 8 in my Benz... Really wish Benz outsourced their trannies like many others ...

Maybe a half a car... but consistently was always ahead. Funny on the head to head comparison with pan turbo, cls63 and rs7 the 0-100 times are identical for the cls63s and rs7 (8.0 seconds).


The car is a 2014 E63S. So its easier to get the rs7 out of the hole with that trans (consistently)

There's a very quick tuned/bolt-on RS7 that's been showing up to recent airstrip events with me. While we haven't raced each other directly, we've matched up against the same cars. The outcomes give me every reason to believe we would be almost a dead heat from a roll. From a dig, no contest of course.

Hmm AMS upgraded their 2014 E63 S AWD shop car w/ECU/Down Pipes/Cat Back exhaust & still can't match the Audi RS7.. All these mods = 10.85 @ 129 mph
Alpha Performance 2014 E63 AMG 4Matic Runs Back t…:
That tranny & gearing AWD system in the Audi is light years ahead, Audi recently ran 10.15 w/Stage 2 ECU = high octane tune @ 750 hp this is crazy if it's legit!

That extra audi accelerating gear has to be a huge part of this