Hi

I was wondering what happened to the 190rev site? any other active forums for 201 people in USA aside from this one?

 

I heard the 190Rev went out of business.

There is always Benzworld. If you decide to subscribe there you should. I used to be the moderator there for W201. You will get better advice here IMHO.

Cheers!

 

There is also the 190 Revolution Facebook group. Lots of good info and people there if you don't mind dealing with Facebook.

 

I agree with you that the advise is better here than at Benzworld. Benzworld treated you and your engineering expertise like dirt. That's when I got mad, left Benzworld as well and came here to MB World. The W201 section here at MB World is so much better and so much friendlier as well.

 

Stick with MB World. We're friendly and we'll try to help you all we can.

 

thank you everybody! I used to be a somewhat active member on that site years back. Then life got in the way and i lost interest. When I was using 190rev it seemed that the site was much more active than this w201 section of this site. Call me old school, but I prefer to keep it simple. No facebook, I hate ads, and pop up about cookies/ signing up. So trying to get back haphazardly into cars in recent times seems like a completely different world to me. Car scenes in general have never suited me, but the thing I admire are those who are truely passionate about a platform over fashion statements or financial investments.

From what i recall with the forum type stuff is that much of the mb crowd do not personally work on their own automobiles aside from general maintenance or asthetic modifications. I mostly used the site for researching through past posts for repair info and selling/buying parts. From what I have breifly gathered since 2013 parts have become harder to find and atleast in the los angeles area junkyards have gone mad with pricing if not gone to the wayside from big corporate mergers. Are cheap chinese parts and counterfeits the way of the future? Makes me wonder if this is the big push towards eliminating cars altogether...

All I was expecting for a response was whether if there was a community anymore or if everybody moved on. I lived down the road from one of the moderators from the 190rev, but he has since moved away and I've lost touch. As much as I lurked in the shadows of the site, I have to admit without a community knowledge is lost and parts resources are what kept my older junkers going.

 

Sorry to be downer. I suppose its the nature of the car life cycle. These were once plentiful, thus easily obtainable and more people enjoyed them. its ancient now and its only prized for pristine survivors.

 

Since you own a 2.3-16, that alone qualifies you as an enthusiast.
I buy my parts from the dealership I bought the car from if they have them (yes they are disappearing I know)
With Matrix pricing it is not super expensive and I know I am getting the right part and it will outlast the car at this point.

Junk yards in northern California have dried up of W201's. Have not seen one in over a year or two.

I have a 1989 original to me that is pretty much fully restored mechanically and cosmetically. I only drive that once every other week, and it s a pleasure to drive in manual.
The second one is also manual but still in the process of restoration. I am halfway there. This is my daily driver for now.

We have friends down in the LA area who were 190rev members and enthusiasts. You probably know them.

Hang around here for a while, the more the merrier!

- Cheers!

 

I should add that I am on Mercedes 190E Owners Club on FB. Not sure how I got on it but it is only good to get quick answers to very simple questions.
It is hilarious to see people posting emissions questions and all the random comments that pour in to this particular site. I assume all are like that.

 

I've been totally fascinated by the sale prices for pristine models of W124s and W126s which are the W201's MB lineup contemporaries recently on BAT. There's now a 2 owner W124 with only 16,000 miles on it, in a rare color combination with all of the service records that's currently listed. This one should be another record shaterer.

 

Thank you dolucasi and 190efan,

For the record I have never owned prestine low mileage cars.

Bought my first w201 in '04 it was a '84 euro 8v that came with a cam, amg header, some kind of aftermarket exhaust, full lorinsor kit, bbs rg wheels, and factory tow bar. It was a gem in my opinion as it came poverty spec with no powersteering, no aircon, no abs, no cruise control, manual windows+sunroof, and 5spd. only luxury option was an electric pass mirror. I was the second owner that car was sitting for years before i bought it for 1300$. had trouble with the cis in beginning then took it to a mb independent and it ran almost flawless with excellent fuel economy with mega tall gearing. approx 70mph it was 2200rpm. had bad rings and sometimes would burn as much as a quart in a single night drive. after the 4th crack in the oil pan which i could fit a flip phone through. i parted most of it out since i already owned a 16v.

in '06 bought a 16v after looking for a few years for one i could afford. found a manual NAM one running with registration for 1250$. needed shifter rebuild (told seller tranny could be toast so he cut me a deal). at the time i had 3 project cars all running and registered, but it was hard to keep up with repairs mostly due to previous neglect. back in '12 i moved to monterey bay and would commute back to socal with the 16v for several months as my only car. spine issues while driving an old junker car for 3.5-4hrs one way was nerve racking. always carried extra bulbs, fuses, ovp, fuel pump relays, idle control valves, 2 spare tires, fluids, tools, and jack. luckily never had a major breakdown. in '13 it blew a headgasket and i parked it. hoping one day to get back to it; with better health and bigger budget. idealy wanted to swap to a 190d shell for smog reasons.

so that a bit of my story and why i wondered what happened to the 190rev

 

given both those cars i am sure had well over 300k (both speedos were broken when i purchased them) and the constant love hate relationships ive had with them overall i found the platform to suit my needs. after owning that 8v i thought i earned my way into a 16v. most my problems with the 16v related to the cis. the early 8v cis was so much more simplier and reliable. my 8v did not even have any auto barometric adjustment. so i would need to carry a slotted screwdriver to adjust for altitude to prevent stalls at idle.

probably back in '09 or 10 i remember i was approached by some photo guy from motormavens what wanted to do story about my 16v. im not the type to be in the spotlight so i expained to him that i would be embarrassed as its probably the most ratrod 16v on the road. besides my car was not that hella flush or whatever thing the kids were into. flaking clearcoat, dents, couple rust pimples, loose/broken trim, and lots of unfinished little jobs (enough to keep it functional was the way i rolled) didn't make it worthy in my mind. i didn't care for car meets or whatever internet hype. all i wanted was to enjoy the car through the drive mostly alone.

 

There are a significant number of 2.3-16 & Evo I & II (international) owners over at the 500Eboard. Though that is a 124-focused forum, there is some spill-over/relevancy as well as collective knowledge from 201/16-valve owners.

Completely agree that Banzworld has had a way of alienating the most knowledgeable folks who post in various forums there and driving them off with nastiness. This is a moderation problem more than anything — moderators help set and enforce forum culture.

DISCLAIMER: I have owned and run 500Eboard for more than 16 years.

 

gerryvz thank you i will look into it. which reminds me there was a former rev moderator who lived near me with a wald 24v m104 swapped 201 that also had a 500e i think his name was ramil cant remember his handle.

 

Good to hear your story with the 201's Theonlyone. It is always good to have a story with the posts. Back in '89 I was not even aware of the 2.3-16V evo's, I just wanted a 6 cylinder manual Transmission Mercedes. It being my very first new car purchase I could not afford a new Cosworth anyway, I could barely afford the W201-2.6. I had no idea though 36 years later I would still be driving and enjoying the car.

Driving a couple of beat up W201's you must be an expert on these cars by now.

Cheers!

 

thats incredible thing to keep a car that long not mention a factory manual 201. from what i recall i seeing there were 4 different gearboxes for 201s. ive seen a 4spd, getrag dogleg, my 8v had a conventional 5spd (reverse under 5th, and a sportline that had a 5spd pattern like a bmw with reverse to the left of 1st. which is yours?

i grew up next to a german from germany (his wife a swede from germany) who loved air cooled vws and pre 90s MBs. I am japanese with parents from japan naturally I had an affinity for japanese cars. I liked european cars, but always thought they were out of my league. My neighbor bought and sold many things as a hustle including cars. My childhood with him was much like the american pickers show as i would have a side gig with him cleaning out hoarder houses that he made deals with the party's family members in exchange for everything there. he knew antiques and was a jack of all trades. he used to tell stories of post ww2 germany when he was a boy looking for things to scavenge off the streets to use or resell. when he came to the US he imported his 78 merc sprinter van. in short the man had pretty much anything you could imagine if not knew where to get it. from gold teeth to vintage surf boards to tiffany lamps and so on. at one point he had a split window bug, mercedes rv, unimog, limos, firetruck, rolls silver shadow, mustang mach1, chrysler imperials, all kinds of random cars. for his personal use mainly was the sprinter, 300td's, 300sdls. my euro 8v belonged to his acquaintance who imported it to socal from germany in '85.

i wanted a 4 door manual car of course rwd, but was limited by budget. mostly because i thought it wouldn't stick out as much to people or the heat so long as it was not a bmw. in those days out here kids were into drag racing hondas and muscle cars.;non of which i was into. i recalled watching safari rally/ wrc, dakar, camel trophy, previous groupb, stuff as a kid in late 80s through japanese tv coverage. then later in the early-mid 90s le mans with 787b, f1 with senna, japanese highway racing and drifting/mountain driving.

after driving the 201 i fell in love with the handling in that it was almost the opposite of the suspen philosophy of the japanese. japanese traditional sports cars were short stroke, heavy spring rate, small swaybars. german were long stroke, soft spring rate, heavy swaybars which were better suited for the crap roads here. my last iteration of setup on my 16v is significantly stiffer than stock i thought the ride quality was comprable to an audi a4 that my grandma bought in '08. in '01 i bought my first car which was the last rwd toyota corolla which my intent was learn wrenching and car control. as time went on drifting/ japanese car culture became more mainstream here it was becoming harder to just enjoy without poser crowds. sort ruined it for me in general as its just another fad for general population.

my gripe with it all is this mentality to unnecessary need to babastarrdize, turn everything into drag racing, and fashion shows instead of enjoying things for what they are. blame the operator first instead of the machine. modify according to growing driver skill. but i guess thats the car culture here...

 

I often wonder if it was just me with back pain in 2012 or if society truely started to accelerate downhill with the rise of smartphones and spacebook. call me old, but i was never into it. i still use a flip phone, turned off tv and radio in 2000 (glad i did since all the bs from 9/11 and covid), and do not subscribe to much of the internet stuff. i only adopt new tech if i find it useful. i feel like since '12 much of the info online has disappeared. if i am not looking for social media, amazon, gossip, or nuddees the internet seems like its getting useless along with computers. why does everything need to be share photos or add personal info to the hivemind?

 

Mercedes used the H pattern with the reverse next to 2nd gear for '88 and '89 2.6's. The H pattern with reverse next to 4th also makes sense to me since the 5 and reverse use the same rod.
So it would simplify the shifter design.

What does not make sense for around town driving is the dog leg. I know there are enthusiasts out there who love the car for the history and limited addition production but dog leg only makes sense on a track as one would just use 2-3 shifting and revving up the engine 4-6K rpms. When one is driving around town revving the engine 2-3K rpms at 25-40mPH the most important gear is 3-4.
Also forward gear one and backwards reverse gearing makes most sense intuitively. Having it backwards is just not intuitive but works fine for track as reverse is never used.

I am biased towards my 2.6 gearings of course because I am accustomed to it since the basic H pattern was on the family W115 4 speed manual.

 

I do not personally care for dogleg pattern on my 16v, but its what I got for now. Possibly in future swap to a 6spd from a m111 slk . After using the 16v as daily driver for some time you get used to it. Just makes me much more reluctant to let anyone else drive the car for that reason. only quirky thing i remember about my 8v was the reverse lockout which involved pulling up on shift knob to engage. euro 8v gearing was horendous to drive outside of cruising. on lots of my favorite roads it was either hold rev out 2nd or let it bog out 3rd. pitching into hairpins in 2nd sometimes would fall out of torque band so rollling toe to 1st would be required. not to mention after a good stint of cranking the 6 turns lock to lock non powersteering box would give your arms a work out. Mentally it was rewarding to always drive the 8v since every apex had to be earned while keeping pace would require high amounts of thinking ahead/planning as not to lose momentum as there is no torque to fall back on. Car would probably been a different animal with a getrag swap, 3.27 lsd, and 16v powersteer box.

I do remember I had a guy once come by to buy parts with a 5zyl 2.5 turbo 190d with a getrag and lsd. Thought it was an interesting combo to drive.

 

Please tell the W201 16v and EVO owners at the 500 E board that they're more than welcome to join our W201 thread here at MB World. We would love to have more members. A number of us here have migrated from Benzworld due to disrespectful treatment by the moderator of the W201 thread at Benzworld. I agree that the problem at Benzworld is a moderator problem. Everyone in this thread is knowledgeable, helpful and friendly.

 

Great story. I'm glad you found our forum. You have a home here. We'll try to help you all we can. I think people buy and do different things to their cars for different reasons. I don't have a problem with modifying per say. Safety needs to be at the forefront. Some of the crazy mods that've been done to W201s can really put people's safety at risk. There are those who think they know more than the engineers who designed their car. Having been raised by such an engineer, I can say that they don't. Some times that reality can be hard to break through with. My other issue is modifying a low mileage rare example. To me, modifying any EVO would be sacrilege. Just ny 2 cents..

 

I think we've had similar W201 ownership journeys. It took every penny I could come up with when I bought my 1991 2.3. Any more cylinders or horsepower were out of my budget. When I bought my car I never dreamed that I would still own it 34 years later and that my car would lead such a charmed life. It was never my original intention. It's been a great journey that I wouldn't change for the world. I love my car dearly and I love driving it. My car is the lowest member of the W201 totem poll but that suits me just fine. I love it for what it is.

 

Out of curiosity why have both of you guys decided to keep your cars for so long? I hardly hear of such stories outside of something rare or exotic. I've always thought of cars as something like dog years maybe worse than that for the modern stuff. Down here is socal the hot summers and stop/go traffic congestion can put some wear. I swear people out here drive as if no one else matters like they are operating a shopping trolley at a grocers. Impulsive, exaggerated, and distracted are the best ways to describe it.

Tint the windows so you can't see the moron behind the wheel. Not to mention todays cars are unbelievably easy to drive yet there is a need to lay down in the seat with 1 hand on the wheel as if it is a low rider with 1/4 turn of steering play. As cut throat are people are out here and willing to pull out in front just to drive slower its a nightmare. Everybody thinks money fixes anything, so the more to you pretend to have the more you demand respect. Its not the america i remember. Driving something you care about on the road for that long does not seem fathomable to me. its quite an achievement.

190fan i thought the lowest on the totem pole was the 1.8petrol or the 2.2 diesel w201. the 16v is really not that special it was considered slow new and even slower by todays standard. My first car was a corolla gt-s rear wheel drive that had a 1.6 yamaha developed twincam 16v head that revs to 7800rpm, close ratio 5spd, clutch type lsd 4.3final drive, live axle with 4link, 4 disc brakes, sport seats with adjustable lumbar/rib support, and engine oil cooler all from factory. Lightweight short wheel base it was loads of fun to drive the w201 16v kind of feels like a bigger more mature version of it both from 1986.

 

Also out of curiosity what accounts for the spill over in information from the w124 aside from later model brakes/hubs, differentials, m103, and maybe a few suspen components?

 

I've wound up keeping my car for so long because I realized pretty quickly after W201 designer Bruno Sacco retired, that MB would never make another car like what I have again. That's turned out to be the case. Secondly, as I watched the prices of the newer MBs climb ever higher I realized that I would never be able to afford another MB. Additionally, I absolutely love my car. It's a pivotal car in MB history and it's become an icon in its own right. As for the location of my car on the W201 totem pole, I was referring to the gas powered cars sold in the U.S. market. The U.S. market never got the 1.8. I think your additional lament isn't only the case in SoCal, it's pretty much everywhere.