Check Engine Problem
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 267
Likes: 0
05 c230 kompressor
Super Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 573
Likes: 1
W203
Ok, so check this out:
Not only did they charge me $98 for the diagnostic (at least I got to drive the new C class loaner), but they also gave me a nice size estimate:
Fix Vacuum Hose Leak - $802
Fix oil leak at Vacuum Pump - $509
and I was having problems with my A/C blower
Blower Motor Regulator - $436
the independent told me this could just be fixed by replacing the dirty A/C filter, something that SHOULD have been covered in Service B.
All I can say to this:
There is no way I am getting my car serviced at MB Sarasota again. Luckily I found a reliable independent MB tech who will take care of the problem Tuesday. He's gonna run a diagnostic and let me know the exact problem since I can't trust MB Sarasota apparently.
Oh, and my buddy broke my passenger door pull ($44 part), got quoted $368 for that. I replaced it myself in 20 minutes...
Not only did they charge me $98 for the diagnostic (at least I got to drive the new C class loaner), but they also gave me a nice size estimate:
Fix Vacuum Hose Leak - $802
Fix oil leak at Vacuum Pump - $509
and I was having problems with my A/C blower
Blower Motor Regulator - $436
the independent told me this could just be fixed by replacing the dirty A/C filter, something that SHOULD have been covered in Service B.
All I can say to this:
There is no way I am getting my car serviced at MB Sarasota again. Luckily I found a reliable independent MB tech who will take care of the problem Tuesday. He's gonna run a diagnostic and let me know the exact problem since I can't trust MB Sarasota apparently. Oh, and my buddy broke my passenger door pull ($44 part), got quoted $368 for that. I replaced it myself in 20 minutes...
Dealers just replace parts based on standard workorder times. Independents will investigate more, fix parts/find used parts and bill actual time.
The vacuum hose replacement ($12 hose) is a quoted 6 hour job @ $100/hr typically since part of the process is to remove the intake manifold, plus they replace upper and lower hoses when in reality most of us have only had problems with the upper hose.
An independent can perform this job in ~1hr.
I bet the same is true of the vacuum pump, yet I'm not familiar with where it is, I'd have to open WIS when I get home.
I found a reliable independent that charges $60/hr, if he can replace an entire engine in my car in ~10 hrs, it shouldn't take 6 to install 2 hoses.
A/C filter? you mean cabin filter?
Super Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 556
Likes: 4
From: Berlin
2018 C63s
Unfortunately you're getting the dealer treatment, its not just MB Sarasota.
Dealers just replace parts based on standard workorder times. Independents will investigate more, fix parts/find used parts and bill actual time.
The vacuum hose replacement ($12 hose) is a quoted 6 hour job @ $100/hr typically since part of the process is to remove the intake manifold, plus they replace upper and lower hoses when in reality most of us have only had problems with the upper hose.
An independent can perform this job in ~1hr.
I bet the same is true of the vacuum pump, yet I'm not familiar with where it is, I'd have to open WIS when I get home.
I found a reliable independent that charges $60/hr, if he can replace an entire engine in my car in ~10 hrs, it shouldn't take 6 to install 2 hoses.
A/C filter? you mean cabin filter?
Dealers just replace parts based on standard workorder times. Independents will investigate more, fix parts/find used parts and bill actual time.
The vacuum hose replacement ($12 hose) is a quoted 6 hour job @ $100/hr typically since part of the process is to remove the intake manifold, plus they replace upper and lower hoses when in reality most of us have only had problems with the upper hose.
An independent can perform this job in ~1hr.
I bet the same is true of the vacuum pump, yet I'm not familiar with where it is, I'd have to open WIS when I get home.
I found a reliable independent that charges $60/hr, if he can replace an entire engine in my car in ~10 hrs, it shouldn't take 6 to install 2 hoses.
A/C filter? you mean cabin filter?
No warranty, no fixie. The A/C filter he said was the charcoal one. He prob meant the cabin filter, which IMO was changed. He hasn't looked at the car yet so he was just throwing out possible reasons for the blower problem. Either way, he has been in business for 20+ years with lots of recommendations, so I'm just gonna leave this in his hands. 
Super Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 556
Likes: 4
From: Berlin
2018 C63s
Update once again:
So my problems have been diagnosed as such:
Broken lower vent hose (the one under the supercharger, turns out they used the wrong clamp at initial assembly in Germany)
Leaking Cam solenoid (replacing both)
Intermittent Cam sensor (replacing both)
Leaking valve gasket (replacing and changing spark plugs at the same time)
Oh and I'm replacing my front rotors and rear pads.
Grand Total: about $1700
Oh and for the record, I was with the mechanic while he was checking out my engine with a video borescope so I know its legit.
So my problems have been diagnosed as such:
Broken lower vent hose (the one under the supercharger, turns out they used the wrong clamp at initial assembly in Germany
)Leaking Cam solenoid (replacing both)
Intermittent Cam sensor (replacing both)
Leaking valve gasket (replacing and changing spark plugs at the same time)
Oh and I'm replacing my front rotors and rear pads.
Grand Total: about $1700
Oh and for the record, I was with the mechanic while he was checking out my engine with a video borescope so I know its legit.
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 447
Likes: 0
From: orlando
2005 C230
So I took a look at the Cam sensors today and they def had oil. I called the stealership and ordered 2 pigtails and 2 sensors. Cost is 35 each for the pigtails and 45 each for the sensors, does that sound right? Does anyone have the part number of the sensors?
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Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 192
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Looks like my bomb is done ticking... also got a MIL / CEL about 2 days ago and went away soon after but back again... wonder if it is the CAM SENSORS or PCV problem cause I did notice a slight surge in the revs while at idle...
Wish me luck... gonna have to check it and spend some money... well at least the car is still under warranty/motorplan but I will still have to pay 50% of the cost
Good luck - at least you have Motorplan - try & make them pay 100% if it's cam sensors - They have a bulletin on this. I'm afraid your car is very much still in the trouble window with it's production date. I'm watching W204s like a hawk to see if MB is talking BS
Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; Nov 21, 2008 at 04:13 AM.
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 192
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Oh dear - a bundle of money - This is something I insist on & my dealer is quite happy about it as long as I don't get in the way. I witness & watch all work & servicing done to my car. They are not even allowed to wash or vacuum it without me being present or you get scratched paintwork from zips, buttons, watches, rings, sand, grit etc. My previous Merc was vacuumed by the dealer once and I made them replace all the woodwork in the car - scratched with a vacuum nozzle. 1500 Kms on the clock!!! Dealers are generally *******.
Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; Nov 21, 2008 at 06:54 AM.
Super Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 556
Likes: 4
From: Berlin
2018 C63s
Oh dear - a bundle of money - This is something I insist on & my dealer is quite happy about it as long as I don't get in the way. I witness & watch all work & servicing done to my car. They are not even allowed to wash or vacuum it without me being present or you get scratched paintwork from zips, buttons, watches, rings, sand, grit etc. My previous Merc was vacuumed by the dealer once and I made them replace all the woodwork in the car - scratched with a vacuum nozzle. 1500 Kms on the clock!!! Dealers are generally *******.
PS One more thing: When they removed the spark plugs to fix the valve gasket, they found out MB never put anti-seize solution on the plug threads!
Also, apparently water () had accumulated around one of them causing it to corrode the plug. Little things it seems like, but they could have become a huge problem down the road. Got lucky I guess...
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 192
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
I learned my lesson too. I have a nice scratch in my door that I know they caused, unfortunately I didn't catch until it was too late. Oh well, at least I have touch up paint! Yeah, its a nice chunk of change, but at least this way I know its been done right and I should be good for a while! Preventative maintenance.
PS One more thing: When they removed the spark plugs to fix the valve gasket, they found out MB never put anti-seize solution on the plug threads! Also, apparently water () had accumulated around one of them causing it to corrode the plug. Little things it seems like, but they could have become a huge problem down the road. Got lucky I guess...
PS One more thing: When they removed the spark plugs to fix the valve gasket, they found out MB never put anti-seize solution on the plug threads!
Also, apparently water () had accumulated around one of them causing it to corrode the plug. Little things it seems like, but they could have become a huge problem down the road. Got lucky I guess...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,544
Likes: 87
From: San Jose, CA
2010 c300
Update once again:
So my problems have been diagnosed as such:
Broken lower vent hose (the one under the supercharger, turns out they used the wrong clamp at initial assembly in Germany)
Leaking Cam solenoid (replacing both)
Intermittent Cam sensor (replacing both)
Leaking valve gasket (replacing and changing spark plugs at the same time)
Oh and I'm replacing my front rotors and rear pads.
Grand Total: about $1700
Oh and for the record, I was with the mechanic while he was checking out my engine with a video borescope so I know its legit.
So my problems have been diagnosed as such:
Broken lower vent hose (the one under the supercharger, turns out they used the wrong clamp at initial assembly in Germany
)Leaking Cam solenoid (replacing both)
Intermittent Cam sensor (replacing both)
Leaking valve gasket (replacing and changing spark plugs at the same time)
Oh and I'm replacing my front rotors and rear pads.
Grand Total: about $1700
Oh and for the record, I was with the mechanic while he was checking out my engine with a video borescope so I know its legit.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,078
Likes: 4
From: NYC
2012 C300 4Matic
I read (somewhere I cant remember) that new spark plugs usually have some kind of coating on them that does the job of the anti seize compound. Not a coating you can feel, but something done to the metal.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 5,851
Likes: 196
From: Huntington Beach, Ca.
'17 Jaguar XF
Correct, same with several other plugs on the engine. They are designed to be one time installation. I still used anti seize on the plugs when I replaced them. It's too easy to do. I have to admit though that the plugs were surprisingly easy to remove after 100K miles of use.
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 192
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Micro-encapsulation techniques on threads is fine with me but plugs have a hard life. A number of posters here have had corrosion on plugs - we are talking dissimilar metals here in the presence of current flow (pulse) - a badly seized plug means goodbye head or helicoil. I prefer the belt & bracers approach of an anti seize compound.
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
From: Houston
2004 C230K Sport
Same issue (cam solenoid/sensor) on the wife's '04 C230 Coupe only after I took it to my mechanic and had it diagnosed. As a testament to him and his integrity, he told me about MB's TSB on this issue. I don't think too many mechanics would have done that. 99% of them would have taken my $400 and been done with it. He sent me on my way armed with the TSB in hand to fight the good fight with MB. As expected, MB initially balked at paying for it saying that my VIN was not included in the TSB. So I took it back to my mechanic and he verified that it was not VIN specific on the TSB; however, it did state that the stealership should check that the "VMI" was listed. Called the stealership back and talked to another SA with much better reception in regards to the TSB. I took it in today and he said he would look into it. He just called and said that MB will pick up the tab on the cam sensor. Only drawback is that the wire harness is on back order for 2+ weeks. I guess they're doing a lot of cam sensors.
I suggest anyone with this issue to do their research and approach it as a battle against the stealership and MB with this ongoing problem.
I suggest anyone with this issue to do their research and approach it as a battle against the stealership and MB with this ongoing problem
.
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
From: Massachusetts
05 c230 kompressor SS 6MT & 07 BMW 335i
i too have had a CEL for the last couple months. Code is system too lean bank 1 and occasionally cat inefficiency below threshold. I have a kleeman cat on since march so it shouldn't be going bad. i have asked my dealer about this several times and after diagnostic was told it may be a ghost code as a result of my ECU tune. they performed a leak-down test and evap tests for leaks which came up negative. They also investigated a PVC issue which also appeared no problem. I mentioned the cam sensor tsb and was told my VIN was not in the bulletin. So i just checked the sensors and it seems a few drops of oil are noticeable in the sensor harness. However, i did notice quite a lot of grease and grime on top of the sensors and everywhere from the top of the block down to almost the pulley belt. I do have a lot of miles and drive in some ****ty weather, but it doesn't look good to me. What should I do? Car seems to be driving fine and I have not had to top off oil much at all....but I am thinking of replacing sensors anyway if dealer wont pick up the tab.
should i go back to dealer and show them a picture of whats going on? maybe time for a new headgasket? I have been driving with this CEL for a little while now and of course don't want to damage my engine. But i have been trusting my dealer's advice up until now, and they have taken very good care of my car up to this point. damn this car is becoming an epic battle.........
should i go back to dealer and show them a picture of whats going on? maybe time for a new headgasket? I have been driving with this CEL for a little while now and of course don't want to damage my engine. But i have been trusting my dealer's advice up until now, and they have taken very good care of my car up to this point. damn this car is becoming an epic battle.........
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 8,384
Likes: 800
2019 G70 6MT & 2022 Ford Maverick XL
That's very strange. Can you post a picture? My 2005's engine is clean @ 72500 miles. You should most definitely fit the adapter wires (pigtails) to the cam sensors if nothing else.
How is the MAF sensor? I'd say the cat code is probably due to the AEM cat.
How is the MAF sensor? I'd say the cat code is probably due to the AEM cat.
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
From: Houston
2004 C230K Sport
You might wanna ask for a different SA or ask to talk to his supervisor or try a different stealership althogether. If you don't get any love then I would definitely suggest a diy. That was going to be my next move if MB didn't cover it. From what I've read in the threads here, it's anywhere from 10-30 min. and not all that expensive for parts. MB is replacing the bad parts with new, bad parts and not an actual fix of the problem. It only buys you another 3-5 years. My sensors were noticeably oily and had leaked down to the O2 sensors, but not the ECU. At any rate, MB advised not to drive the car the wire harness gets inand since they're covering it, I'm going to abide graciously.
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
From: Massachusetts
05 c230 kompressor SS 6MT & 07 BMW 335i
ya ill post a pic. i havent checked the MAF sensor or cleaned it yet, so that could be something to look into. the cat code on the other hand doesn't make sense because i drove with the CAT for 6 months without a code. could my exhaust o2 sensors need replacement?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 8,384
Likes: 800
2019 G70 6MT & 2022 Ford Maverick XL
According to Glyn, O2 sensors have a good life of about 80,000 before they start cycling too slowly, even though this won't throw a code unless it is severe. From talking with you before I think you said you were way past 80,000 so that could very well be a concern.
I'd check the MAF on the too lean code.
I'd check the MAF on the too lean code.
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 192
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Kleeman Cats seem to throw "cat efficiency below threshold" codes. We've seen a few now. Kleeman denies this
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 192
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
