oyster

I could not find much more details on the 4matic.

I currently drive a 5speed 325xi. Every said up to now is true.

Even with 4wd, my car feels rwd, it is subtle with 32/68 power split.

Now I got to find more info on the 4matic and find a saleperson who knows the system.

Why is it that in canadian brochure, I see no where that the C-class comes with alloy wheels. Is alloy wheel standard or optional?

Oyster

Mike T.

Drew, in other words, you're a 4MATIC fan. If you had extensive experience with various 4WD systems and lived in an area (as I did, in the snowy BC Interior) for a decade where there is snow on the roads for 3 months a year and drove very hard all the time, you might come to appreciate the subtle differences between 4MATIC and some of the other - yes - more sophisticated - systems that are avaialble.

Don't ignore what I wrote in the first post: 4MATIC is good enough for 95% of people. It's just not the best 4WD system out there. Period. Pretending it is does not change that

Drew_ML

Hi Mike,

Oh no, it's not the best 4WD system out there, but I would say that it's one of the best AWD systems out there and no, I don't think this is pretending! :p I'm curious though, have you driven it in the snow? Until you do, looking at the specs isn't really an accurate way judging it. The tuning of the 4-matic systems on the various cars, be it S-class, C-class, or E-class can be quite different.

Which 4WD/AWD vehicles have you driven with? The setup that you mentioned, a viscous coupling with Torsen rear LSD can be found on a variety of vehicles such as a RAV4 or a Lexus RX300. I've had quite a lot of experience with both of those vehicles and I can't say that they're as good. Until recently, we also had a Chrysler T&C AWD minivan with a viscous coupling and like the two Toyotas, that setup has serious limitations both mechnically and practically.

In other advanced driver training and various test drives, I've also had experiences with the Acura MDX, Infiniti QX4's multi-plate clutch system borrowed from the JDM Nissan Skyline, as well as the Nissan Pathfinder's part-time 4WD system and the Ford Explorer's Control-Trac system (which was quite horrible actually). So you see, I'm no stranger to AWD/4WD!

BTW, don't you think that the person who started this thread falls into the 95% category? I would think so.

Additionally, there are a variety of M-classes running in the 2003 Dakar Rally right now in the T1 stock production class and they are leading the pack. In the last 3 years, an ML has always placed in the top 5 spots in that class, not bad for the system that you think negatively of (yes, it still has 4ETS and ESP).

As an aside, did you ever write about what happened to your C230K? I don't recall seeing a thread about it but then again, I only check this board once every couple of days usually.

CRB

This is USA Today reviewer James Healey's opinion of 4-Matic:

"(4Matic) setup uses the anti-lock brake sensors to tell when a wheel's spinning faster than another, as when one wheel is on ice. The brakes are applied on that wheel, which diverts power to the opposite wheel. So far, so good. But when all the wheels are spinning -- trying to make way on an icy freeway, say -- Stage 2 of the system cuts back engine power. The vehicle will slow and come close to stopping. You become a traffic hazard, not a trailblazer. ...

Uh, guys, the point of four-wheel drive is to keep going, regardless, not to nanny us to the side of the road when the (vehicle) decides it's slick.

It seems to work well in mud and rain, however. If you live where ice and slush are rare, (4Matic) probably is sufficient ."

This guy tests an awful lot of cars and he doesn't particularly care for Mercedes' AWD "solution".

Mike T.

CRB:
Thanks for that quote; I think it drives my point home quite nicely.

Drew:
You're on! If you can find me a C 240 2WD with 4 Nokia Hakkapelliita snowies on it, I'd take on your all-season tire equipped C 240 4MATIC and win everything but the track acceleration test (in most snow conditions, but I'd win some). The location of the practical test will be the West Kootenays after a snowstorm with -10 degree weather; Nelson via Ainsworth and Kaslo to Trout Lake, then Halcyon, Nakusp, New Denver, Slocan and back to Nelson. First to complete wins! See you there

About my 4WD credentials, suffice it to say that I used to drive innumerable 4WD vehicles with my job while I lived in the Kootenays. I won't bore you with a list, although I will say that none of them were M-B 4Matics. So yes, I do have extensive real world, year in, year out, experience with various low, medium and high tech 4WD systems in extreme winter conditions - on a daily basis for a decade. The marketing distinction between 4WD and AWD is just that - full time, part time, automatic, viscous, open diff, electronic aids - whatever, I just refer to it all as 4WD, which it assurredly is, even though it makes the marketing men twitch

Don't dismiss viscous couplings just because of lame vehicles like the Ford Explorer with "4WD Auto", Honda CRV, VW 4Motion or the Dodge Caravan AWD. Surely you are aware of the primary technical difference that characterises them, compared to a proper 4WD car such as an Audi Quattro that also has a viscous coupling?

The breakdown of the C 230 K in Vancouver was temporary and so far a one-time event and although it's now been diagnosed as a duff fuel pump (which my Dad is skeptical of), the part has still not been replaced due to the slow parts supply chain at M-B Canada. I can get practically any part for my Peugeot 405 out of New Jersey via Kelowna BC faster than he gets his M-B's stuff, and no new Peugeot has been sold in Canada for 12 years now. Pretty sad stuff when you think about it.

The C 230 K is still great fun to drive, but the teething troubles and early breakdown and crap roadside "assistance" were hugely disappointing. And the parts/service situation is becoming quite annoying too. Good thing the car has the 7 year, 160,000 km warranty, which was on sale a couple of months back for $600 off... Actually, I'm quite confident that the car will ultimately prove to be reliable; if not, we have protection

Drew_ML

Ah yes, I knew someone would bring that up sooner or later. What happened was that he tried to accelerate over the piles of snow that had built up on the highway, the system wouldn't let him floor it since the vehicle would've spun, and then he slams it for not performing well, ha! All of the M-class owners that have read it (and some of them live in Alaska) have disagreed with it strongly. :o

One negative review out of hundreds of positive ones.

Mo'cedes Mo'problems

Now i know its my moms car, but i'm sure i can talk her into a few mods. I love mercedes, but im more of a bmw enthusist. What do you guys recomend for some good non-performance mods?
Thanks!

Benzer

Can you post a few pictures please ? As large and hi-res as you can. I have been looking to see one all over the tarnation.

If possible one in the sun and one in the shade. My interest is seeing the colour not in the car itself

Thanks

MarkL

Just curious, did she like Midnight blue over Capri? Capri is metallic (~$650 charge) versus non-metallic Midnight w/ $1200 "special order" charge...

noredtoday

Hi

I am new to this board and plan to purchase a c240 or 230 seden.

I live in New York city and was wondering which one suits these potholes better (4 cycl or 6 cycl ) and is 4 matic worth the extra money.

what are some prices did you guys get?

I know is a lot of question, but just thought might as well try.
heh..heh

Thanks a lot... looking forward to my first my mercedez.
^_^

LorinserCClass

That's a first time I've heard that question-4 cy or 6 cy for potholes.... Don't be to concerned about engine size for potholes. So Cal has hella pot holes and people do it out here w/6,8, 10 cy w/19,20-26 inch rims! Get the C230 though as the C240 is for granmas and granpas. Mercedes is having a 2.9 APR on all new C Classes.

c230 sport

He's right about the grandmas & grandpas part, 'cause that's all I saw on the road.

moomeh

hey, c240 isn't for grandma and gradpas. it is for people who love luxury and quietness and a nice smooth gentle pimpin ride.

CRB

Of course, you are right. My grandpappy loves the luxury, quietness and smoothness of his C240.

When he wakes up from his afternoon nap I'll ask him about that pimpin part too.

CRB

I was over checking out Forbes' website and they had a new and mostly positive review of a C320 4Matic. Here is the link for those interested:
Forbes' C320 4Matic review

Kar don

YOU THINK SO CAL HAS POT HOLES? come to boston lol! He might mean because the C230 comes with 17 inch wheels and sport suspension and the C240 has 16s and standard suspension...

John408

I drove both and chose the 240. The 6 cylinder has a lot more torque. I also love the wood trim a lot better then the trim in teh 230.

But hey whatever you like better then choose it. I would drive both before you decide

JAM

Being a lover of more power, I really wanted a C320-4Matic, but I could not find one with all of the options that I got on my C240. Plus, I was a the end of my ML lease, so I had to do something now instead of waiting for the 04s. So, the difference between the 2 V6 engines, was not great enough for me to give up some of my beloved options. Check out my options in my signature....

noredtoday

Hi guys

Thanks for all the replys and comments.

Yesterday test drive the C240 seden, I was really impress, but I wasn't in Manhattan so couldn't put it through some nasty potholes at 35 mph but the sedan certainly had enuff power and I was cruising comfortably looking at hot chicks, by the way I did take a nap before I went. ^_^

Gee but the dealer wanted 1200 off Msrp, I guess the dealer knew I was totally impress by my first experience with benz anyway I wasn't ready for a deal yet. So didn't bother bargaining.

Going to try the mighty hype BMW 325i tomorrow also the c230.

Better stop yapping..
^_^

JAM

I drove the 325xi and 330xi and no comparrison to a Benz, BMWs are okay, but they just don't have as solid as a feel. Yes, my opinion is biased, but oh well..

Put it this way, there are a lot of people who go from a BMW to a Benz, but no one who goes from a Benz to a BMW. If they do, they inevitebly come back to the Benz.

Once you have a Benz there is no turning back.

viper

Too bad MB dropped the C320 4-matic. I guess sales were not very strong but I don't think they gave it a chance to find its market.

tifosiv122

I still see it on their site, when did they drop it?

Erik

FrankW

could be just MB Canada dropped them. MBUSA still sell'em...

nukblazi

The C240 won't be able to get out of it's own way in NYC.

Get the C230, get the manual.

FrankW

drove the c240 as the loaner, test drove the c230k from the dealership and drove my bro's friend's c230k. I would recommand people to get the C230k sedan because it's cheaper and more powerful. The C240 just doesn't have the oomph, you still have to really rev it to get some good and useful power from that 2.6 v6 plant just like the 1.8 s/c 4cyc, yet you don't get as much power.