Transmission Mayday: Stuck in D/N
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From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
Transmission Mayday: Stuck in D/N
So, Seacoupe is left with only two trans options. Neutral or Drive. So, if I don't need to reverse I'm fine J/K.
I'd like to get the car in park so that I can at least lock her up for the night. You can't take the key out unless the car is in Park.
Right now, the rear brake lights are out, and there is no warning indicator on the dash. In addition, I got a BAS, and ESP failure. I cleared this by shutting off the car.
I'm thinking the trans is stuck because she can't see that I have my foot on the brake. Silly, but my thoughts. Trans operates as wonky and driveable as before. So, I'm thinking this is a sensor.
Any help here? If I can't put the car in Park, she is going to have the key left in her all night....GULP!
Thanks brethern,
Ed
I'd like to get the car in park so that I can at least lock her up for the night. You can't take the key out unless the car is in Park.
Right now, the rear brake lights are out, and there is no warning indicator on the dash. In addition, I got a BAS, and ESP failure. I cleared this by shutting off the car.
I'm thinking the trans is stuck because she can't see that I have my foot on the brake. Silly, but my thoughts. Trans operates as wonky and driveable as before. So, I'm thinking this is a sensor.
Any help here? If I can't put the car in Park, she is going to have the key left in her all night....GULP!
Thanks brethern,
Ed
Last edited by SeaCoupe; May 27, 2010 at 12:27 AM.
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2019 G70 6MT & 2022 Ford Maverick XL
IIRC, the brake switch was still around up until the facelift. Anyone else that can verify this? If that's the case, it's mostly likely what you assumed - that the car can't tell you're pressing the brakes. All the symptoms point to that. There is a part on getmercedesparts.com for the 2002 that says "stoplamp switch" and is $12 - can't link it for some reason.
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From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
I made things worse. I was pulling fuses and activated the Restraint System failure, drive to workshop. So now, the car won't stop at all. If I just knew what wire the "stopswitch was, i could ground it, fool the car, and get my car towed to my warehouse. Grrrr.
I pulled the panel under the drivers side dash. The brake pedal is covered by another plastic panel. Held on my two nuts, likely 13 mm. Problem is, I have no wrenches with me. Double Grrrr.
Ed
I pulled the panel under the drivers side dash. The brake pedal is covered by another plastic panel. Held on my two nuts, likely 13 mm. Problem is, I have no wrenches with me. Double Grrrr.
Ed
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From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
Found the switch for the brake pedal. I was able to get the gnd to rear brake lights gnd jumped, but that didn't help get the gear moved.
There are two other wires in the harness for a total of four. A black, a red, and two other colors I don't remember. What do the other two do? When I get a multi meter to insure that they are not hot, I may just try to ground them all. Of course the proper thing to do is simply replace the bum switch. I'll huff it out to South Bay MBZ and have the part ordered in.
Now to figure out the Restraint system failure. Possibly, I didn't put a fuse back in correctly or something.
I so want to get to 225k. Personally it says I lived in harmony with the car. Ish like tonight makes me just want to get rid of her.....I'm so ashmed of myself right now.
BMW has 328 leases for some $375 a month.
Ed
There are two other wires in the harness for a total of four. A black, a red, and two other colors I don't remember. What do the other two do? When I get a multi meter to insure that they are not hot, I may just try to ground them all. Of course the proper thing to do is simply replace the bum switch. I'll huff it out to South Bay MBZ and have the part ordered in.
Now to figure out the Restraint system failure. Possibly, I didn't put a fuse back in correctly or something.
I so want to get to 225k. Personally it says I lived in harmony with the car. Ish like tonight makes me just want to get rid of her.....I'm so ashmed of myself right now.
BMW has 328 leases for some $375 a month.Ed
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From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Ed,
The brake light switch is on the pedal bracket up high above the brake pedal, there is a little offset to it but it strikes the pedal itself. 2 connectors on the US versions. You seem to have found this.
Pedal switch talks via CAN Bus via rear SAM to ESP & lockout actuator on our older models.
All this is predicated on an EIS being fully operational. It seems that you are able to achieve a reboot of the system by turning off & restarting the car - Yes? If so try this multiple times.
Experience tells me that the problem is usually just a duff switch or a bad connection somewhere (corroded etc. Worse case buggered ESP module or EIS pray not.)
I hope John can find necessay diags & methods on WIS for you. Some of my files have been corrupted recently & I need to do a complete reload of the WIS & reload XP on my split drive. My old WIS is only XP compatible.
Good luck
Don't buy a BMW - then you will know what trouble is like.
I have deleted wrong diag posted - labelling problem - wait for John
The brake light switch is on the pedal bracket up high above the brake pedal, there is a little offset to it but it strikes the pedal itself. 2 connectors on the US versions. You seem to have found this.
Pedal switch talks via CAN Bus via rear SAM to ESP & lockout actuator on our older models.
All this is predicated on an EIS being fully operational. It seems that you are able to achieve a reboot of the system by turning off & restarting the car - Yes? If so try this multiple times.
Experience tells me that the problem is usually just a duff switch or a bad connection somewhere (corroded etc. Worse case buggered ESP module or EIS pray not.)
I hope John can find necessay diags & methods on WIS for you. Some of my files have been corrupted recently & I need to do a complete reload of the WIS & reload XP on my split drive. My old WIS is only XP compatible.
Good luck
Don't buy a BMW - then you will know what trouble is like.I have deleted wrong diag posted - labelling problem - wait for John
Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; May 27, 2010 at 10:31 AM.
Thread Starter
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From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
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Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,212
Likes: 8
From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
Ed,
The brake light switch is on the pedal bracket up high above the brake pedal, there is a little offset to it but it strikes the pedal itself. 2 connectors on the US versions. You seem to have found this.
Pedal switch talks via CAN Bus via rear SAM to ESP & lockout actuator on our older models.
All this is predicated on an EIS being fully operational. It seems that you are able to achieve a reboot of the system by turning off & restarting the car - Yes? If so try this multiple times.
Experience tells me that the problem is usually just a duff switch or a bad connection somewhere (corroded etc. Worse case buggered ESP module or EIS pray not.)
I hope John can find necessay diags & methods on WIS for you. Some of my files have been corrupted recently & I need to do a complete reload of the WIS & reload XP on my split drive. My old WIS is only XP compatible.
Good luck Don't buy a BMW - then you will know what trouble is like.
I have deleted wrong diag posted - labelling problem - wait for John
The brake light switch is on the pedal bracket up high above the brake pedal, there is a little offset to it but it strikes the pedal itself. 2 connectors on the US versions. You seem to have found this.
Pedal switch talks via CAN Bus via rear SAM to ESP & lockout actuator on our older models.
All this is predicated on an EIS being fully operational. It seems that you are able to achieve a reboot of the system by turning off & restarting the car - Yes? If so try this multiple times.
Experience tells me that the problem is usually just a duff switch or a bad connection somewhere (corroded etc. Worse case buggered ESP module or EIS pray not.)
I hope John can find necessay diags & methods on WIS for you. Some of my files have been corrupted recently & I need to do a complete reload of the WIS & reload XP on my split drive. My old WIS is only XP compatible.
Good luck
Don't buy a BMW - then you will know what trouble is like.I have deleted wrong diag posted - labelling problem - wait for John
Thanks,
Ed
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From: Camas, WA
2007 C230SS; 2014 ML350 BT
Ed, bear with me, as I am just starting to use WIS, and IMO, it is positively non-user friendly in searching for stuff.
Attached is the wiring diagram of the stop lamp.
I work on getting some more info on that as I find it, as well as the restraint system errors.
Attached is the wiring diagram of the stop lamp.
I work on getting some more info on that as I find it, as well as the restraint system errors.
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From: Camas, WA
2007 C230SS; 2014 ML350 BT
Oh, also not sure how far you are away from Karo, but if you guys are close, I would try to talk him into running his STAR system over to you and help reset the errors.
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From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
I see that the switch gets input from the ESP & BAS control module. This is N/47/5 on the chart. There is a finger that points to the following: PE 42.45-P-2101FA. I am mentioning this because prior to lock up, I had twice gotten an on screen error for BAS and and ESP failures. It was while driving. I simply pulled over, and restarted the car, and they were gone. Can you get that chart? This is the module located in the back of the car right? Anyone know where it is?
Hey John, any help is a step ahead. This system has a design that is geared for the safety of the occupants. I get that. But this switch failure causes some big implications. No taillights, trans won't shift, because trans can't be put into park, the key is stuck, because the key is stuck, the car can't be locked. HA! Love German engineering!
Any chance on a P/N for the switch? As well, getting this darn safety cover off the brake pedal assembly is proving difficult. I have the bottom most part unsnappd from the base, but it seems stuck at the top.
Ed
Last edited by SeaCoupe; May 27, 2010 at 02:56 PM.
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From: Camas, WA
2007 C230SS; 2014 ML350 BT
Cool, so the S/91 at the bottom of page 2 is the switch and molex diagram. I see how I correctly got that the black (4) and red/yellow(1) were the proper leads necessary for the taillights. There are two other leads in the molex though. They are Red/Mauve (2) and pink/green (3) I need to be doing something with these, but I'm not sure. Probably in poor judgement...I connected 2 and 3 for nothing.
Hey John, any help is a step ahead. This system has a design that is geared for the safety of the occupants. I get that. But this switch failure causes some big implications. No taillights, trans won't shift, because trans can't be put into park, the key is stuck, because the key is stuck, the car can't be locked. HA! Love German engineering!
Any chance on a P/N for the switch? As well, getting this darn safety cover off the brake pedal assembly is proving difficult. I have the bottom most part unsnappd from the base, but it seems stuck at the top.
Ed
Hey John, any help is a step ahead. This system has a design that is geared for the safety of the occupants. I get that. But this switch failure causes some big implications. No taillights, trans won't shift, because trans can't be put into park, the key is stuck, because the key is stuck, the car can't be locked. HA! Love German engineering!
Any chance on a P/N for the switch? As well, getting this darn safety cover off the brake pedal assembly is proving difficult. I have the bottom most part unsnappd from the base, but it seems stuck at the top.
Ed
It does seem pretty crazy that a bad stop lamp switch can cause all those problems, but they do make sense.
I'll see if I can find the document on the removal of the cover.
I am attaching 2 more files. They are legends and how to read the schematics.
Part Number for the switch is A0015453809. Looks like that bad boy retails for $25.
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From: Camas, WA
2007 C230SS; 2014 ML350 BT
Cool, so the S/91 at the bottom of page 2 is the switch and molex diagram. I see how I correctly got that the black (4) and red/yellow(1) were the proper leads necessary for the taillights. There are two other leads in the molex/connector though. They are Red/Mauve (2) and pink/green (3) I need to be doing something with these, but I'm not sure. Probably in poor judgement...I connected 2 and 3 for nothing. I did this with the connector unplugged from the switch. I wonder if I have the connector plugged in, will it make a differance.
I see that the switch gets input from the ESP & BAS control module. This is N/47/5 on the chart. There is a finger that points to the following: PE 42.45-P-2101FA. I am mentioning this because prior to lock up, I had twice gotten an on screen error for BAS and and ESP failures. It was while driving. I simply pulled over, and restarted the car, and they were gone. Can you get that chart? This is the module located in the back of the car right? Anyone know where it is?
Hey John, any help is a step ahead. This system has a design that is geared for the safety of the occupants. I get that. But this switch failure causes some big implications. No taillights, trans won't shift, because trans can't be put into park, the key is stuck, because the key is stuck, the car can't be locked. HA! Love German engineering!
Any chance on a P/N for the switch? As well, getting this darn safety cover off the brake pedal assembly is proving difficult. I have the bottom most part unsnappd from the base, but it seems stuck at the top.
Ed
I see that the switch gets input from the ESP & BAS control module. This is N/47/5 on the chart. There is a finger that points to the following: PE 42.45-P-2101FA. I am mentioning this because prior to lock up, I had twice gotten an on screen error for BAS and and ESP failures. It was while driving. I simply pulled over, and restarted the car, and they were gone. Can you get that chart? This is the module located in the back of the car right? Anyone know where it is?
Hey John, any help is a step ahead. This system has a design that is geared for the safety of the occupants. I get that. But this switch failure causes some big implications. No taillights, trans won't shift, because trans can't be put into park, the key is stuck, because the key is stuck, the car can't be locked. HA! Love German engineering!
Any chance on a P/N for the switch? As well, getting this darn safety cover off the brake pedal assembly is proving difficult. I have the bottom most part unsnappd from the base, but it seems stuck at the top.
Ed
This WIS.net is really frustrating. I look for more on the BAS ESP module. I think the other problem is, that I haven't had my car long enough to have issues that require me to know where things are, so I am clueless in that regard.
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From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
If I undo the battery and let it sit, will this reset any errors? I was able to turn off and turn on the car prior to my midnight switch pulling session. Now that I pulled switches, the car won't start and the error is some restraint inoperable, drive to workshop error.
Thanks,
Ed
Thanks,
Ed
If so turn the ignition to ON. With the key in the ON position carefully disconnect the battery for 10 minutes & then reconnect. If this does not work then disconnect battery for 24 hours to run all caps flat & then reconnect. This will achieve a limited reboot.
You are an old Benz campaigner so I don't need to tell you to be careful not to short anything & blow a SAM
On the sedan the ESP & Yaw modules are under the trunk mat spare wheel cover ahead of the spare wheel. Not sure on the Coupe but probably similar.
To John,
Good luck with the WIS !!!! It's not user friendly - it will give you more grey hair than I have. The brake switch talks to the ESP & interlock via the CANBus
Ed see here for sedan pics of ESP location
https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ol-module.html
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From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
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From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
I put the new switch into the plug, but not mounted. This fixed my lack of brake lights. So now that works, bad news, Trans won't shift.
What are the precautions to take to prevent frying the SAM and other modules? I'm going to search, but if anyone has specifics, I'm all ears.
Right now, I have limited tools, most everything is in the warehouse, so HR girl is coming over tonight to help me get my stuff over here.
So my play book is to check the rear Sams for corrosion or loose plugs. No love, Undo the battery, and take out the center console to investigate the shift linkage for obstruction or a broken part. I saw how 2002 S class models had quite a few linkage failures due to a plastic part. Let me tell you, I have lots of plastic in that linkage from what I can see.
Ed
What are the precautions to take to prevent frying the SAM and other modules? I'm going to search, but if anyone has specifics, I'm all ears.
Right now, I have limited tools, most everything is in the warehouse, so HR girl is coming over tonight to help me get my stuff over here.
So my play book is to check the rear Sams for corrosion or loose plugs. No love, Undo the battery, and take out the center console to investigate the shift linkage for obstruction or a broken part. I saw how 2002 S class models had quite a few linkage failures due to a plastic part. Let me tell you, I have lots of plastic in that linkage from what I can see.
Ed
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From: Camas, WA
2007 C230SS; 2014 ML350 BT
Ed,
I ran DAS in simulation mode with you model and ran to the ESM (Electronic Selector Module), and the repair complaints it has and the way I read it is the brake switch will keep it from coming out of park, but not going in. It says if it won't go into park, there is an obstruction in the shifter plate
Work has been kicking my *** today, so I haven't had more time to dig into this for you, but will take my laptop home. When I have some free time, I'll dig back in. I'll PM you my cell number so maybe we can talk it out over the phone, but would also like to keep this thread going, so if anyone else has the problem, there is something in writing.
I ran DAS in simulation mode with you model and ran to the ESM (Electronic Selector Module), and the repair complaints it has and the way I read it is the brake switch will keep it from coming out of park, but not going in. It says if it won't go into park, there is an obstruction in the shifter plate
Work has been kicking my *** today, so I haven't had more time to dig into this for you, but will take my laptop home. When I have some free time, I'll dig back in. I'll PM you my cell number so maybe we can talk it out over the phone, but would also like to keep this thread going, so if anyone else has the problem, there is something in writing.
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From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
Ed,
I ran DAS in simulation mode with you model and ran to the ESM (Electronic Selector Module), and the repair complaints it has and the way I read it is the brake switch will keep it from coming out of park, but not going in. It says if it won't go into park, there is an obstruction in the shifter plate
Work has been kicking my *** today, so I haven't had more time to dig into this for you, but will take my laptop home. When I have some free time, I'll dig back in. I'll PM you my cell number so maybe we can talk it out over the phone, but would also like to keep this thread going, so if anyone else has the problem, there is something in writing.
I ran DAS in simulation mode with you model and ran to the ESM (Electronic Selector Module), and the repair complaints it has and the way I read it is the brake switch will keep it from coming out of park, but not going in. It says if it won't go into park, there is an obstruction in the shifter plate
Work has been kicking my *** today, so I haven't had more time to dig into this for you, but will take my laptop home. When I have some free time, I'll dig back in. I'll PM you my cell number so maybe we can talk it out over the phone, but would also like to keep this thread going, so if anyone else has the problem, there is something in writing.
John, I appreciate the help, don't put yourself out.
Once I get this fixed, I'll post up the DIY.
Anyone that has suggestions, I'm all ears.
Now for a DIY on removing the center console. Off to the search button.
Ed
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From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Ed - I feel a bit useless at the moment because I don't have my usual resources available & I'm having trouble just posting to the forum - suspect router I think. We are going to have to depend on John. It might be a mechanical block caused by something but I have known the interlock F--- around due to switch & wiring problems. I can't remember whether it would go into Park on the friends car we had this hassle with or whether it was stuck in Park.
Regarding SAM protection. Just disconnect the battery cleanly with no sparking & replace similarly. Old SAMs were fragile. Don't short anything.
The ideal way to change a battery on a Benz is with a quiescent current device so that everything remains powered up. That will not achieve what we are trying to do here.
Regarding SAM protection. Just disconnect the battery cleanly with no sparking & replace similarly. Old SAMs were fragile. Don't short anything.
The ideal way to change a battery on a Benz is with a quiescent current device so that everything remains powered up. That will not achieve what we are trying to do here.
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From: Seattle
w203 m112
I dunno, but I would imagine that the car thinks your foot is on the gas or that its still moving. That would be the case where you cant shift to reverse or park. I cant see any other reason why it wouldn't let you change to P/R.
Good luck.
Good luck.
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From: Huntington Beach, Ca.
'17 Jaguar XF
You can pull out the coin tray to get to the interlock link....just a piece of plastic....that locks out the shifter movement from park when there is no key in the ignition. I know that's not your symptom but it may be buggered up or blocked by something that's fallen in there.
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From: BC, Canada
2003 C230K Coupe Orion Blue
My advice might come too late, but I thought there's a "transmission stick override". IIRC it works for forcing the stick out of P, but I'd imagine it'd also for getting back INTO P. Check your manual. Good luck.
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From: Pasadena, CA
2002 C230K, 2013 BMW 328, 2015 BMW X5
You can pull out the coin tray to get to the interlock link....just a piece of plastic....that locks out the shifter movement from park when there is no key in the ignition. I know that's not your symptom but it may be buggered up or blocked by something that's fallen in there.
Heck, with everything I have off under the dash, I may just do the flap/stepper units for the A/C.
Ed
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From: Huntington Beach, Ca.
'17 Jaguar XF
