MIKESV8

how old are you? good decision on getting the evo. instead of the subby!

LILBENZ230

I mean no disrespect towards him personally but if your target is the car in Luke Geezy's signature you should sell the Benz immediately and buy an 89 Civic. Done a lot? Yep... a lot of damage. I cry a little each time he posts.

cpbeasley

(not that I don't agree with you Matt...eek cause I do) but anyway, I made my point earlier

FraKctured

Yea, TL is reasonably fast, but not that much--it's not AMG or E55 level by any stretch. On top of that, it just doesn't feel like a luxury car.
And what about the part of the car you live in most of the time? Interior of the TL is completely unattractive to me. Looks like a video game, odd colors/obnoxious lighting scheme, oversized displays, seems like they're trying to make it look like a fighter from Battle Star Galactica or Star Wars video game. I don't know who that demographic is, but it's not me.

LILBENZ230

Where did he compare the TL to an E55 AMG? I looked back over the thread and can't find it. A $35,000 entry-level sport sedan to a $80,000 super sedan?

Well no, the TL-S doesn't really favorably compare to a car with 2x the power and over 2x the cost. Big surprise. However, interior attractiveness is subjective - I think the TL has a great interior, easily better than the W203. The materials are great, everything is easy to use, it's an attractive design.

Also, the TL will not have anywhere NEAR the operating costs of an E55.

W203E35

The TL-S is too over rated. I took one out with my car from dig. I can only imagine how horrible the TL is.

mistachy

i will have to agree that i liked the interior and the steering wheel controls and the handbrake placenment of the TL better than that of the mercedes. i wish the TL had a more reasonable cost. they wanted 26 large for the type s and would not budge. i got the mercedes for under 20

LILBENZ230

The TL-S is a fine car, actually. It's a lot nicer vehicle than the everyday C230/350. A lot of stock features that are somewhat rare options on the W203. And granted, it has no status, lacks the feel of a German machine but it drives and rides very well. The 2004-2008 TL is one of my favorite vehicles.. I owned an 02 TL lemon and it spent a lot of time in the dealership (literally months) and I drove loaner 2005-2006 TL models and I've loved them ever since.

<Cher voice>If I could turn back time</Cher> I'd buy the 2005 TL that was at the dealer instead of the C230.

W203E35

To be honest with you I have never been inside one. I'm sure it's pure Win

LILBENZ230

That's pretty harsh. I don't actually regret the purchase of my C230 - I could not have asked for a better car. It was time for a German car. Had I purchased the TL instead it would have been my 7th Honda product.

e1000

TL = Fail wheel drive. That is all.

cpbeasley

^^^ what e said
and yes Karo, TL = GUTLESS

mistachy

when u say fail... does that mean it breaks down a lot? the one i drove was a pretty good drive, felt powerful and had a little bit of growl to it when you pressed the gas. (type s)

i didnt like the feel of the drive though, the MB was a smoother softer ride than the type s. i guess thats cause the type s had lower pro tires and i think an extra inch in the wheel, so the bumps were more noticable. it felt more powerful though.

LILBENZ230

The TL-S has factory 17s just like the Benz. I'm not sure where you guys come up with the conclusion that the TL is somehow not a good vehicle all around. It's not the sportiest, not the fastest (though a TL-S should be every bit as fast as a C350 and Honda's 6MT is worlds better than Mercedes), not the most luxurious car out there but it is an excellent blend of things in a gorgeous package. The only negative comment on the TL-S that makes sense to me is E's comment on the fact it is front wheel drive (he didn't mean it broke down). That's definitely a negative.

cpbeasley

Im sure the S is a nice car all around... never driven one

the regular TL though, as I said, gutless, feels like driving around a go-kart with a full chassis and body
HIDs are sexyness, it was easy to shift (if not too easy, didnt feel half as solid as shifting the Benz), and guages were cool, but interior was a bit like an arcade... interior was a squeeze
oh and understeer

wasnt a bad car (so dont hurt me Matt) but id like to drive the S to draw conclusions

LILBENZ230

I've spent probably 5-7k miles in those last gen TLs and always liked them. The S is obviously a different ball game with its 3.5L V6 and 286hp, but I never thought the 3.2L 258HP engine in the base TLs felt anything less than powerful. It's weird to hear it referred to as "gutless" by a former 2.5L C230 owner.

tommy

In MB owner terms, any fwd car is automatically worse than even a 240 with no options, and somehow a Benz with under 200 hp overpowers a Japanese car that's got over 200. Must be that new math.

mistachy

LOL at LILBEN... this is an intersting conversation. Might it be just an optical illusion but those spider wheels on the type S look bigger than my premium wheels on my c230

LILBENZ230

It's strange math, and I agree with you. There is a little fanboism in a lot of stuff. And not saying it about E, Cale, or Karo but C350 owners have been known to be downright delusional on MBWorld at times. They really don't like it when I point out that a 3.5L 268hp V6 is what run of the mill Camry and Accords have these days. Now, a C350 6MT W203 is a special, special car, IMO. I envy Cale, and I phantom envy Nick with his phantom C350 6MT.

But RWD and a Benz badge do not a superior car make in every situation.

To the OP - that's a beautiful car.. if you're gonna mod, do so carefully as it won't take much to ruin the classy look.

zerocover

Whatever you guys are on please pass it.

My girlfriend has a TL type S. For the money it comes very nicely equipped and hers is fully loaded w/ navi etc. That being said it's a cheap car. It looks nice on the outside and has a nice interior but the designers are pinching pennies everywhere. Has anyone here had to replace a turn signal light? Its hell on earth, plastic everywhere with clips that break instantly. Try replacing the cabin air filter. To get it out you have to pull out the glove box take apart part of the dash then cut out the door holding it in, understand the cabin air filter door was cast as one part with the fire wall cover so to replace it you need to use drywall screws (as per the manual) to hold the door back on. Let that sink in to save $0.10 the honda guys made sure to make the most basic maintenance hell. You wont find that in a European car. To recap the TL looks nice on the surface but just underneath is the surface cheapest econo-box you can find.

That being said the performance is a joke, its a nice car to drive as long as you drive it slow and gentle. Any more then 1/4 gas and your spinning up the tires, not in a good way either (remember FWD). Seems powerful right, to be fair its pretty quick in a perfectly strait line if your planting your foot on the gas from 0. The car is heavy and the suspension is garbage. Turns I take without a second thought leave the TL going sideways. You cannot forget that its a boat of a car with all the weight on the front end, and it is not fun to drive. FWD works well on smaller lighter cars but once the car gets to a certain weight its a major liability.

After I let my girlfriend drive the benz, she's started shopping for a new car. She's begging for me to sell her my C280 (so I can get a new car) or she's going with an A5.

e1000

Lets clear some things up.

1. A TL is absolutely NOT gutless. Short of a C350, C32 or a C55, it will handily embarass other w203's by a good margin. The vanilla Gen3 TL is a bit slower than a C350, but definitely not by much. I've never personally raced a Gen 3 TL Type-S or Gen 4 but I'd imagine it would be a very good race (with the C350 )

2. It's front wheel drive layout is it's largest downfall. Like almost all hondas, it's front heavy, front wheel drive and will just plow with understeer when pushed hard. Of course, that's not what a TL is made for...... and no SH-AWD isn't a real solution.

3. TL's, and Japanese luxury cars in general, often have much better options and creature comforts than thier German counterparts.

W203E35

It should be a close match. I had an encounter with one and I can easily say I had a car on him. So I'm assuming stock vs stock would be a good fight.

cpbeasley

LoL

Im not dellusional!
My 230 was gutless-er

How much torque does that TL have? This was my feeling of gutless-ness when I drove that car. Im not a friggin car and driver editor! Was just an opinion for jeezie chreezie sake!

And yes that opinion may have been coming from a former 2.5L owner, but it's also coming from a former 5.7L LS1 owner :-p

Thanks for being gentle Matt I know why your boyfriend likes you

W203E35

Throwing this out there for the new C350 owners. 2 weeks ago I was at Irwindale and had a chance to run against a G37 Coupe. I was trying to leave off when he left off to compare and he had me easily 1 car he did 8.9 and I did 9.4. I raced him the second time this time my reaction is what helped me (i took him). I left right when the 2nd light turned off and it was the other way around and now I had a car on him. But I honestly feel if it was a 1/4 mile he would at minimum catch up. 2nd time he did a 9.1 and I did a 9.5.

The 350 engine has good potential and it'll surprise a lot of cars.

To my surprise the G37 Coupe was very similar to the numbers the G35 Sedan was putting down.

e1000

An engine's rated torque number doesn't necessarily matter, that's what a gearbox is for.

The J32A3's weakness is it's somewhat peaky power delivery. This contrasts with the more linear torque plateau seen on the M272 E35. The result is that although both cars aren't too far from each other in rated peak horsepower, the M272 E35 delivers more power across the rev range than the J32A3.