komart

Hi everybody! I have W204-180K. manual tranny. My query is regarding shifting from 1 to 2 gear – it does not go quite smoothly being compared to the shifting from 3, or 4 to 2. If I shift from 1 to 2 too quickly, I feel some restrain (shock) and even slight noise while the shifter passes from neutral to 2 gear position. To avoid this I have to wait for a second (in neutral position) and then to move the shifter to the position of the 2 gear. During the operation the clutch is completely pressed and cannot be the reason for this phenomenon. I will do appreciate any thoughts on this in case somebody has experienced the same problem.

C300Sport

I feel your pain. Mine is exactly the same way and I will, once again, request they check it out again during my next service. This is especiallly noticeable when cold but is still not very smooth even when when fully warmed.
What makes me feel this is more than just poor shift quality is the fact there can be a bit of driveline shuddering with the clutch fully depressed. Anyone have any ideas what could be causing this.

Sportstick

Is your shuddering at standstill, just as clutch is released, engaging 1st gear and starting to roll forward?

C300Sport

Actually it is while engaging second gear on the roll. The clutch takeup actually feels pretty smooth, it is just the shift action/linkage that seems to be a bit off. Of course, with the driveline "clunking" or "shuddering" when engaging a gear seems to feel more like the clutch is not fully engaged.
Any thoughts guys?

I_Love_MB

Well Mercedes 204's manual gearbox is really bad (atleast on all those cars which I drove for test drive) ...even my VW Polo had better gearbox than this one...this was the only reason, I choose Auto while buying my C.

Glyn M Ruck

Merc's manual tranny & clutch action is somewhat agricultural.

C300Sport

Unfortunately, I have to agree with you a bit on that. I can get over having a bit of a rough gate action as I rarely rush my shifts.
My concern is; what exactly is causing the clunk or shudder during the 1-2 shift? I have a decent understanding of the inner workings of a manual trans and just can't understand what is causing this. If it is "normal" and harmless, oh well, I will just get used to it, but if it is a sign of something wrong internally or something misadjusted, I would love to have it rectified.

lickem66

My 330i acted like that and I removed the CDV - Clutch Delay Valve. It's just a small valve inline on the clutch line. A lot of BMW folks remove it with either a gutted one or just removing it and connecting the line together. It was there to supposedly make shifts smoother by delaying the full release of the clutch. Removing it made the shifts smoother, especially the 1 to 2. Does MB use a CDV?

Glyn M Ruck

If you are truly experiencing shudder it is a clutch problem or mountings (engine & rear transmission). Some people induce shudder by up-changing too early & lugging the engine.

Clunks tend to be lash in the diff & propshaft - mainly splines. Even the auto can clunk it's axle & propshaft if you drive a little erratically & come off the throttle just as a TC lock-up is taking place or brake hard at this time.

I recommend you drive a demo unit at the dealer to see what is normal. Yeah! - I know there are not that many MT cars around.

C300Sport

So true about the lack of comparison cars. I can actually have the clutch engaged for several seconds prior to the shift (easing down the driveway at a 4-5 mph) and the car will clunk into 2. Guess I will try, once again to have them find the issue.

Glyn M Ruck

Does the second gear synchromesh operate properly? Is the change itself scrunchy - Does second gear ever grate? You might have a damaged synchro cone on second.

kaku

i also experience a slight lag/stutter when quickly shifting from 1-2. but if i ride out the clutch for a few seconds longer, i can always get a smooth engagement/transition.

i've never tried, but I head turning off ESP makes a noticeable difference..

komart

Glyn, as C300Sport mentions, I as well "have a decent understanding of the inner workings of a manual trans…" I have been driving manuals for more than 38 years (since the time when synchro did not exist at all). Please, correct me if I am wrong, but if there were a problem with synchro, it would not be a smooth shift from 3 (4) to 2, right? As I said in my initial post, the shift from 3(4) to 2 is smooth as it has to be. I read about switching off ESP and I will try to see whether this will help. I will try to shift at higher revs as well, but still cannot understand how it is possible other cars (far below from MB's prestige) not to have such a problem, but my 180K (2008 model) and as I can see many others to have it. If I were the only one experiencing that, I could think that there is something wrong just with my car, but many others complain as well…

Glyn M Ruck

Yes - I was really discussing C300Sport's case and yes if there was a damaged synchro cone I would expect trouble on the downshift to 2nd as well. In fact, probably even more so.

You obviously understand MT's & clutches well. In your case I think if you find nothing wrong you should put it down to crap MB MT's & clutches. To me MB's MT's & clutch action are a deal breaker. They are plain lousy & spoil the driving experience. For this reason I would not buy any manual Merc - while their boxes are a little better than they used to be they still suck! The Japanese will crap all over them. To me this situation is made even worse by the M271 engine which really needs a quick action GB to get the most out of it.

Where are you? Complete your profile.

C300Sport

Hey guys, to clarify, the 3-2 shift pretty well sucks as well but I tend to not down shift below 3 when slowing...come to think of it, the crappy feel of the 3-2 is likely the reason I am not doing it.
Anyhow, I plan on raising hell about this as it has gotten significantly worse over the last year...it was actually just fine when new.

Glyn M Ruck

C300 - in that case you might have a synchro cone that has deteriorated. Make sure they sort it out under warranty. I actually wonder if your clutch is disengaging properly. If not this can be hard on synchro cones.

komart

Hi guys. Many thanks for your participation and comments – very kind of you. Regarding 3(4)-2 shift I would like to say that I do not this for slowing, but in case when during city driving I have to make say 90°-turn from one street to the other without full stopping (no stop sign). In this situation I slow down by braking (the gear is 3, 4, or whatsoever) and when the decreased speed requires using a low gear to exit from the turn, I shift say to 2 (normally) or to 1 (if the car moves very slowly). In this case there is no problem at all – something that makes me happy considering what occurs when I shift 1-2... I have not checked yet whether shifting at higher revs will help. Recently I tried to notice at what revs an AT ML was shifting – it was around 2.5K. What is your opinion –what is the optimal revs' range for shifting 1-2, 2-3, etc.