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New DI Engines -- Excessive Carbon Buildup ??
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Joined: Dec 2002
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The MBCA has a tech guy who writes a column in the magazine each month, seems fairly knowledgeable, I could write him an email and ask about this - maybe he has some contact at MB who has some technical information on this issue. Luckily my trusty EFI engined car will be in my hands at least another 2 years!
MBWorld Fanatic!
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Nissan GT-R BE / '12 Ducati-1199 Panigale S / '12 C300-4M Loaded/GLK350-4M Loaded
The MBCA has a tech guy who writes a column in the magazine each month, seems fairly knowledgeable, I could write him an email and ask about this - maybe he has some contact at MB who has some technical information on this issue. Luckily my trusty EFI engined car will be in my hands at least another 2 years!
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,331
Likes: 9
From: Delaware
2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
On the Webers, I think I spent as much $ on rejetting and reducing the choke size, vs the base cost of the carbs .... each changed part was quantity of 6
. But once set, they were perfect from idle to max rpms, other than persistant gas leaks at the "sprung" manifold seal..
Last edited by kevink2; Feb 18, 2012 at 10:08 PM.
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 192
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Gotta love the good old side draught Webers. A lot easier to tune & balance than the Dell'Orto "equivalent."
Reminds me of my days of modifying Alfa's
Reminds me of my days of modifying Alfa's
MBWorld Fanatic!
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Nissan GT-R BE / '12 Ducati-1199 Panigale S / '12 C300-4M Loaded/GLK350-4M Loaded
Actually that was Kas Kastner.
On the Webers, I think I spent as much $ on rejetting and reducing the choke size, vs the base cost of the carbs .... each changed part was quantity of 6 . But once set, they were perfect from idle to max rpms, other than persistant gas leaks at the "sprung" manifold seal.
.
On the Webers, I think I spent as much $ on rejetting and reducing the choke size, vs the base cost of the carbs .... each changed part was quantity of 6
. But once set, they were perfect from idle to max rpms, other than persistant gas leaks at the "sprung" manifold seal..
... I finally converted to ITB's and everything changed...
You guys took me
Last edited by MBRedux; Feb 19, 2012 at 01:10 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 345
Likes: 0
From: St. Paul, MN
2013 E350 Wagon, prev 2005 ML 500 SE
new 2011 or 2012???
I was really sold on a 2012 E class Wagon DI V6 with the increased horespower AND substantially better mileage and improved tranny.
Now, the DI seems scarey for a long term vehicle.
If you were shopping E class, would you buy a new 2012 or new 2011??
I had pretty much written off the 2011's but now this info has me wondering.
Appreciate any opinions.
Now, the DI seems scarey for a long term vehicle.
If you were shopping E class, would you buy a new 2012 or new 2011??
I had pretty much written off the 2011's but now this info has me wondering.
Appreciate any opinions.
Last edited by MinnBobber; Feb 20, 2012 at 11:35 PM. Reason: add
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,986
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From: SEATTLE WASHINGTON USA
'08 C300 Lux Barolo Red Beige Leather P2 MM 18" wheels '84 944
I was really sold on a 2012 E class DI V6 with the increased horespower AND substantially better mileage and improved tranny.
Now, the DI seems scarey for a long term vehicle.
If you were shopping E class, would you buy a new 2012 or new 2011??
I had pretty much written off the 2011's but now this info has me wondering.
Appreciate any opinions.
Now, the DI seems scarey for a long term vehicle.
If you were shopping E class, would you buy a new 2012 or new 2011??
I had pretty much written off the 2011's but now this info has me wondering.
Appreciate any opinions.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,071
Likes: 20
Nissan GT-R BE / '12 Ducati-1199 Panigale S / '12 C300-4M Loaded/GLK350-4M Loaded
I was really sold on a 2012 E class DI V6 with the increased horespower AND substantially better mileage and improved tranny.
Now, the DI seems scarey for a long term vehicle.
If you were shopping E class, would you buy a new 2012 or new 2011??
I had pretty much written off the 2011's but now this info has me wondering.
Appreciate any opinions.
Now, the DI seems scarey for a long term vehicle.
If you were shopping E class, would you buy a new 2012 or new 2011??
I had pretty much written off the 2011's but now this info has me wondering.
Appreciate any opinions.
If you learn something, please post it here!... but I remain pessimistic.
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Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 345
Likes: 0
From: St. Paul, MN
2013 E350 Wagon, prev 2005 ML 500 SE
2013??
RLE,
do you think (know?) if there will be a 2013 E WAGON diesel??
That would be the ultimate missle for me. Except, posts about MB diesels with bad fuel/water ingestion / big non-warranty repairs have me concerned about going to a diesel. Here in the US, our quality of fuel regarding contamination can be suspect.
Clean fuel seems much more important in a diesel.
Comments??
do you think (know?) if there will be a 2013 E WAGON diesel??
That would be the ultimate missle for me. Except, posts about MB diesels with bad fuel/water ingestion / big non-warranty repairs have me concerned about going to a diesel. Here in the US, our quality of fuel regarding contamination can be suspect.
Clean fuel seems much more important in a diesel.
Comments??
Last edited by MinnBobber; Feb 20, 2012 at 09:04 PM. Reason: typo
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
Likes: 192
From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
Any modern diesel running a >2000bar injection system with amplifier injectors requires sqeaky clean uncontaminated fuel. Benz sells a bucket full of diesels in Europe & they are pretty well protected but some care is required.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,986
Likes: 6
From: SEATTLE WASHINGTON USA
'08 C300 Lux Barolo Red Beige Leather P2 MM 18" wheels '84 944
RLE,
do you think (know?) if there will be a 2013 E WAGON diesel??
That would be the ultimate missle for me. Except, posts about MB diesels with bad fuel/water ingestion / big non-warranty repairs have me concerned about going to a diesel. Here in the US, our quality of fuel regarding contamination can be suspect.
Clean fuel seems much more important in a diesel.
Comments??
do you think (know?) if there will be a 2013 E WAGON diesel??
That would be the ultimate missle for me. Except, posts about MB diesels with bad fuel/water ingestion / big non-warranty repairs have me concerned about going to a diesel. Here in the US, our quality of fuel regarding contamination can be suspect.
Clean fuel seems much more important in a diesel.
Comments??
A friend has been driving his 2007 E Bluetec since new with no fuel system problems of any kind. 36-37 mpg hwy is pretty normal.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 360
Likes: 3
From: Pittsburgh, PA
2020 C363 S / 2007 SLK55 / 2016 F150 4x4 / 1998 Cobra Convertible
Buy one and sell it off early
Buy one and keep your fingers crossed.
I'm (foolishly?) opting for #3. I keep cars for 10 years or more so my guess is that either there won't be an issue or I'll be removing the heads every few years. If there is a problem, I'm not expecting MB to stand behind addressing it with the current engines...but rather redesign new ones and hope they didn't p*ss off too many owners. Also, I don't know if MB has extendend warranties but this might be the first time I purchase one if it would cover this issue once it gets bad enough...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,071
Likes: 20
Nissan GT-R BE / '12 Ducati-1199 Panigale S / '12 C300-4M Loaded/GLK350-4M Loaded
1) Don't buy one, and take the wait and see approach.
2) Buy one and sell it off early
3) Buy one and keep your fingers crossed.
4) Call and ask questions... over and over if need be until one of us gets a straight answer!
I'm (foolishly?) opting for #3. I keep cars for 10 years or more so my guess is that either there won't be an issue or I'll be removing the heads every few years. If there is a problem, I'm not expecting MB to stand behind addressing it with the current engines...but rather redesign new ones and hope they didn't p*ss off too many owners. Also, I don't know if MB has extendend warranties but this might be the first time I purchase one if it would cover this issue once it gets bad enough...
2) Buy one and sell it off early
3) Buy one and keep your fingers crossed.
4) Call and ask questions... over and over if need be until one of us gets a straight answer!
I'm (foolishly?) opting for #3. I keep cars for 10 years or more so my guess is that either there won't be an issue or I'll be removing the heads every few years. If there is a problem, I'm not expecting MB to stand behind addressing it with the current engines...but rather redesign new ones and hope they didn't p*ss off too many owners. Also, I don't know if MB has extendend warranties but this might be the first time I purchase one if it would cover this issue once it gets bad enough...
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,331
Likes: 9
From: Delaware
2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
One thing MB may have done with the DGI system is angle the injector so that it washes the opened intake valve.
Bosch FSI Video
Pic of Ford Eco-Boost Combustion Chamber
.
Bosch FSI Video
Pic of Ford Eco-Boost Combustion Chamber
.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,071
Likes: 20
Nissan GT-R BE / '12 Ducati-1199 Panigale S / '12 C300-4M Loaded/GLK350-4M Loaded
Good try, but no cigar!
One thing MB may have done with the DGI system is angle the injector so that it washes the opened intake valve.
Bosch FSI Video
Pic of Ford Eco-Boost Combustion Chamber
.
Bosch FSI Video
Pic of Ford Eco-Boost Combustion Chamber
.
PS: Remember this is not a CIS system. In that case it might have worked!
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,331
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From: Delaware
2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
"One thing MB may have done .... "
I did say may ...
I thought with ~2000 psi injector pressure, some part of the cone would be sufficent to reduce build-up, IF MB used this angled injection.
Mabe some day they will say something, but if Glyn can't find out, looks doubtful.
.
I did say may ...
I thought with ~2000 psi injector pressure, some part of the cone would be sufficent to reduce build-up, IF MB used this angled injection.
Mabe some day they will say something, but if Glyn can't find out, looks doubtful.
.
MBWorld Fanatic!
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Nissan GT-R BE / '12 Ducati-1199 Panigale S / '12 C300-4M Loaded/GLK350-4M Loaded
Good point, but that would mean that the VW and Audi's that do incorporate the Bosch system would be cleaned and have no issues ... yet their DI appears to be the worst offender thus far... I guess we'll have to wait and see if the new MB DI engines develop issues to find out... too bad.
Last edited by MBRedux; Feb 22, 2012 at 11:08 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,071
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Nissan GT-R BE / '12 Ducati-1199 Panigale S / '12 C300-4M Loaded/GLK350-4M Loaded
I fully agree, everything is speculative at this point. However in light of the fact that Mercedes has refused to release any "real facts" on this issue, and probably never will, only hastens my resolve to seek the truth, to encourage others who may be impacted to do the same. I see no real harm (other than the fear that further discussion may impact sales) to discusses this issue until someone is able to extract these "real facts", since you said at first you would but have now rescinded for some strange reason.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,071
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Nissan GT-R BE / '12 Ducati-1199 Panigale S / '12 C300-4M Loaded/GLK350-4M Loaded
Super Moderator
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
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From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
You really are a conspiracy theorist. Better watch your mail for a bomb. You are asking all the wrong questions. 
