Abdelsami

Hi All

I have a C55 AMG 2006. Lately my engine broke down and I couldn’t find a replacement. The Garage advised me to install the E500 2004 Engine M113 5.0 natural aspirated engine and he said it will fit with no issues and that people does all the time.

after we finished the Job apparently there is a problem:

- on acceleration the car hesitates. Meaning that if you press half a pedal the car will start jumping as if there is no enough air.
- on very slight acceleration the car runs normal but you feet on the pedal should be very very light.

facts:

- No error codes discovered what so ever.
- No lights no nothing everything looks clean.
- No engine vibration on idle even on acceleration.
- No sign of Missfire.
- Spark Plugs are excellent.
- Air Mass sensor is Ok.
- Accelerator (something with this name) os ok
- on Neutral you can press the pedal to the metal and engine rotates smoothly.
- no gear issues at all. Even when test driving it at low speed you can easily down and up shift manually or automatically.
- They say the have checked everything but still investigating.

- C55 old engine is 113 988
- E500 engine used is 113 967

My question: is what they did is completely wrong? I saw some mercedes with other mercedes types engines installed before and all garages say yes it can be done. But what could be the issue here?

Any suggestions people?

SLcharge

What ECU is used with the engine ?
The one that came with the M113 or the one from the M113K ?

Abdelsami

ECU used is the same as the one on my C55. And by the way my old engine is 5.5 naturally aspirated and not super charged or something. The the engine iinstalled is also naturally aspirated 5.0

SLcharge

Sorry, I missed that.
But did you use the ECU that came with the E500 engine ?

Abdelsami

Any ideas?

SLcharge

But did you use the ECU that came with the E500 engine ?

Bobbyr5

Maybe try to reset the adaptations on the ECU and TCU through an SDS machine and see how it runs?

Just an idea...

SLcharge

The reason I am asking is because the ECU is linked to the car, with the cars VIN #, and unless your workshop have Abrites or similar software, they can't change the VIN # in the new ECU, and the car will refuse the ECU. I suspect that they used the ECU of your 5.4 liter engine, and unless they changed the engine code in this ECU with Xentry,, the engine will be over fueled, and you will experience problems.

Abdelsami

They used the ECU that is originally in my C55.

SLcharge

Okay, so you better kick some ***.

What you are experiencing is the ECU trying to adapt the fuel to the A/F table, and it can't because it is way off. It is over fueling as soon as you accelerate.

They need to change that, before you ruin your Cats.

Abdelsami

Really!

So they should have used the ECU of the E500? If so, because today i asked them why not use the ECU of that engine they said that if they used the ECU of E500 then there are other things which will not work and that ECU controls more than just the engine and that the Gear box will not function properly but i knew that they do not know exactly what are they into although they are very old in this business.


So what now? Change ECU or ECU modification or programming?

he claimed that

SLcharge

Change ECU is bad, will not work.

They need to access current ECU with Xentry Developer Tool, and change engine code, ( it is ticking a box ) and then the ECU will know what engine it is working with.
Everything will be right then.

Abdelsami

Thank you so much for the feedback. I will send it to them and check and will get back here to update you (InSha’Allah)

Salaam - Piece

SLcharge

If the workshop don't have the Xentry developer tool, member @pmercury can help out.

He is an expert on these things.

https://mbworld.org/forums/members/372055-pmercury.html

daynger

The C55 ECU will be expecting a C55 engine, not an E500 engine.
If the fuel injectors, maf, cas, knock or any other sensor or system is different the engine will not run properly.
Say the C55 engine had 200cc injectors and the E500 engine had 180cc injectors and you used the C55 ECU on the e500 motor the ecu would think it is injecting more fuel than is it causing it to run very lean.

If the shop has done this before they should know all of this.
In fact if teh shop had any clue at all they would know you cant just swap a motor and run the same ecu unless you install the C55 ancillaries that are different on to the e500 motor.
Then get a proper dyno tune to check the system will run safely.

WaveyKat

why didn't you get an E55 Motor :-)

cm60k

E500 Engine will work perfectly, just use C55 cams & injectors into E500 Engine,,

Everything else will be fine..

-;ZAYED;-

Abdelsami

Because E55 Engine is not easily available and is more than double the price.

i have got the E500 engine for around $550.00 and there were some engines also sold at $400.00

E55 would cost $1,200.00 or more.

Abdelsami

Salam Zayed

I don’t know if they did. But i will inform them.

how did you conclude to this idea? And by the way, are you in Dubai?

cm60k

Saalaam bro.,

i'm in "Abu-Dhabi",,

all 5.0L & 5.4L sharing the same heads, the difference with a cams only,

displacement is another thing,,

ECU should adapt to the timing angle, but should to keep C55 ECU, and using C55 cams with injectors for proper reading..

-;ZAYED;-

SLcharge

The 5.4 liter has different cams ( sharper, more duration ), different injectors ( larger ), longer stroke, bigger displacement, than the 5.0 liter.

If you start swapping the fuel injector, things start to go sooo wrong.
The ECU will fire the injectors the same way as the 5 liter injectors, and pouring even more fuel into the poor 5 liter engine.
The hotter cams, from the 5.4 liter would help compensate, if you leave the 5 liter injectors in .

The better solution is reprogram the ECU, to 5 liter engine, or take it on a rolling dyno and have it completely remapped.

cm60k

Good info., Thanks,,

I said so, cause my friend using "W210 E55 with "W164 ML500" Engine, and "W209 CLK55" with "W211 E500" Engine since around a year,

both cars got ECU/ME2.8,,

NO issues, everything runs great..

-;ZAYED;-

benzslo

You can use your ECU but you need to run the injectors from your 55 motor. Swap those in and you should be fine (provided there are no problems the shop did)

SLcharge

No, you can't.

Abdelsami

Salam Zayed

can you message me you UAE number? I am based in Dubai and I could use your advice on this.

( if you do not mind of course... )