evoi19

Thanks! Looking fwd to this build and seeing the potential out of the motor, bloc and tranny!

TurboKits.com

The initial tester whom still has not gotten us DYNO charts has had them on the car a year and close to 40K miles with the upgrades and has not had any rod issues. We do talk consistently and he is still saying he will get to the DYNO for us for more results. He works in Coal and is away for long periods of time, which has caused the delay. Hrd_workin stepped up ordered them, he has proven his commitment to the project and we should see some great results soon!

Hrd_workin

Thanks for the link TModelle spoke with Steve Nelson and he has a package:
set of 6 Custom JE Forged Pistons for the M276 (Pistons, Pins, Locs, Rings and Coatings).
and Nonoslide Cylinders and Matching Pauter Forged 4340 Con Rods with ARP Hardware with ARP2000 Bolts
Cost: $3130 + Shipping
Turn around time is 4-5 weeks once the sample piston and rod is received.

Do you know of a source I could get a spec low cost piston and rod for them to spec?

SLcharge

Now that you are at it, and invest in new pistons as well, I would reduce comp. ratio ( C/R ) from 10.5:1 to 10:1.
When increasing boost, on a stock C/R, it is very likely that you get detonations, or knocking, unless you have access to higher octane fuel.
This leads the ECU to retard the ignition timing in order to protect the engine, and this again leads to less power at the crank, so that you don't get full benefit from your increased boost.
In reality, you can run more advanced timing, with a lower C/R, and make considerable more power than with stock C/R, as long as your max combustion pressure is around 8 degree ATDC.
This will be established on the dyno.
Worst case, you will have to take back maximum boost, due to knocking, if stay with 10.5 C/R.

A good example is the same engine, (DELA30 ) cranking out 329 HP with less boost and C/R 10.7.

munis

I am having a hard time understanding what is your end goal here. Turbos are like 2.5 to 3k to upgrade. Say you spend another 3200 on the rods. Get a new tune? Say another 1000 there. Total of 7k already. And you are assuming after doing all this, that the tranny will hold, which so far have already broken in a couple of C43's which have a sturdier gearbox than the old 7 speed. Even after all this, you are looking at doing may be 11s 1/4 mile best case scenario and constantly hoping something else does not break? Cause the fuel pump in the car is not great either. If you want a fast monster of a car or something, I really do not see this car as the go to. You can probably sell your car, add 10k, and get a CPO RS3, spend 1500 dollar on it, and you will be faster than your C450 is ever going to be. Just an opinion though.

SLcharge

I know this guy, who is track racing an old Fiat X1/9, a small rear engine 2 seat sports car, back from the seventies. At first he was a total laugh, could not perform at all, but after a while he managed to get the car running and performing, getting better and better, and he just get a kick out of it, beating much bigger race cars on the track.

Sometimes things doesn't necessarily make sense, you just have to accept what a guy is doing, for what ever reason. The least we can do, is helping him get the best out of his investment, avoiding the most common traps.

The day he makes a 11s run, and beat all the beefed up muscle cars, he will be king, and all the trouble will be forgotten.

Just my 2 cents.

munis

I am not disagreeing with it. I am just saying there are better platforms for achieving the same results for cheaper and in a more reliable way. I have been driving the C43 for three years now and at no point did this car feel like a track monster to me and my car runs 11.4 in the 1/4 mile. RS3s with just a tune runs 10.6, and that car is at the same price point as ours. But then again, that's just me.

One of my friend used to tell me this, if want a faster car, get a faster car, after getting the C43, that statement made sense to me. I just can't think of a scenario where investing on a platform that has fundamental issues with performance mods has any fruitful outcome. Chris in the group already tried putting turbos on. Came back with a broken tranny and finally moved on to a M5. I hope OP is successful with his venture though. Will be good to see.

TModelle

PM me your VIN, I’ll get you the part numbers for your piston and rod.

xX G Xx

I been modding my cars since I first got my license @ 16. I dumped twice the worth of the car on mods before. From the look of OP's car, he's enjoys the same. It's not about going 10 seconds in a different and faster car. It's about being unique and being one of the fastest in his own platform. Trust me, if the OP has a RS3, he wouldn't be satisfied with simple 10.6 ECU tune. He would be modding the sh*t out it too.

Hrd_workin

You hit it right on the head my friend. Not to say the other post is wrong, just a different view.
Been modding cars as well since the HIN (Hot import nights ) hay days back in 98 even took 1st place in the 4dr wild class with my $16k Honda Civic that, like you said, I put $30K into lol. Crazy to some; I would agree BUT it’s in the blood to be different.
Could have gone with one of the Mustang 5.0’s that are like a “million” of them rolling around for the cheap American hp but really enjoy having a unique ride vs a common fast one.
Got my eye on a UGR twin turbo Gallardo Performante...but for now have this “lil” project and enjoying the feedback from you all.
much appreciated for the help, shared experiences and responses. 😁👍

Hrd_workin

Will do!
Thank you

Hrd_workin

xX G Xx had seen your post on your big brake kit. Amazing!
Contacted D2 racing for a set for the front and rear. From your post (https://mbworld.org/forums/c450-c43-...ml#post7812558) you had mentioned that you went with the 380mm. Are you running on 19's or 20's with your C43?
Spoke with Brandon Terretti and they "recommend at least a 356mm rotor with 8piston front and 4 piston rear and rear comes with the electronic parking brake option."
I am running 19" TSW Mallorys so wanted to check if the 380mm would fit; those look like they would stop a bull elephant on a dime.

Thanks!

xX G Xx

I'm running 19" forged wheels and the below brakes filled completely:

Front: AP Racing Radi-Cal 8520 with 380mm 2pc rotors
Rear: D2 Racing EPB system with 380mm 2pc rotors

Fitment will be dependent on your wheel design plus the caliper design. Not all 19" have the same clearance and not all 6 pots are the same size. Best to test fit first or at least give your inner wheel clearance diameter to the supplier/shop and let them confirm.

Mine 19" design didn't have the best inner clearance. My original choice for the fronts were the Alcon RC6, but that thing was HUGE and didn't fit in my 19s.

The 8 pistons are over kill, but if u like it, do it. But you will need 400mm rotors to make it look good. And, u will need new larger wheels~

For your current wheels, i would go with the 6 piston fronts with 380mm and the EBC 4 piston with 380mm.

Hrd_workin

Hey buddy, I appreciate it again and for the PM with the links. Going to contact D2 in Taiwan; will see what they say.

Hrd_workin

Hey thanks again for the part numbers. Just waiting on AMR to get back to me about install so that I can order them and have them sent over to Steve at Top End Performance for custom spec and fabrication.

Hrd_workin

Thanks so far for everyone’s input and help with this project. With the issues of heat being a killer on this I had come across weistecs 722.9 transmission pan upgrade.

From their info carries an additional 2.5 quarts and increased fins internally and externally for cooling. Also has additional ports to hook up an additional transmission fluid cooler.
https://www.weistec.com/722-9-transmission-pan.html
Does any one have experience with this to reduce heat and wear on the tranny for turbo upgrades?
Thanks again!

TModelle

Glad I could help. I’ve built a couple of custom engines myself with JE and Pauter, they’re all still performing well after many years.

Hrd_workin

Update:
Just ordered sample piston and rod from MBpartspros.com
Once they arrive sending them to Steve over at Top End Performance to spec and fab the custom JE pistons and Pauter rods.
Waiting for Matthew AMR_Matt for a breakdown to see if they can install as well as possibly do the weistec pan and weistec transmission upgrade. Hopefully they are able to.

Any members out there who have experience with the C450amg 7-speed tranny upgrades?
Heres the link:
https://www.weistec.com/722-9-bullet...e-mct-awd.html
Looks like weistec has a transmission upgrade which offers

• Increased Torque Capacity
• Weistec Performance Clutch Material
• Increased Number of Discs per Clutch Pack
• Redesigned Clutch Piston Geometry
• Increased Frictional Surface Area
• Increased Clutch Material
• New OEM Gaskets and Seals
• New OEM Fasteners and Hardware

Hrd_workin

Appreciate the feedback. 😁👍
Now that the samples are being sent for fab here shortly; would running water-meth also improve running a lower C/R (vs stock C/R) as it is supposed to increase octane levels (have 93 here in Texas but can get higher grade race fuel locally) while lowering IAT?
Second would the lowering of the C/R be on the fabrication of the new pistons and rods side or the tuning side to lower C/R or both?
Thanks in advance for everyone in sharing your experience and knowledge.

waisoserious

Wow you are really going all the way with this.
I have a few questions. Just out of curiosity, but I dont want it to come off the wrong way so forgive me if the questions sound rude.

1. How much do you expect to spend on on upgrades after all is said and done? Do you have a budget that you dont want to go over? (Inc Turbos, Turning, standard bolt-ons, forged parts)
2. Why not just get a faster car from the factory? Since you are planning to change literally everything about the car, outside of its body.
3. How fast do you expect the car to go after you build your engine to accomodate the larger turbos? Do you expect to exceed 125mph or hit 130mph trap?
4. How long do you expect this project to take? If 1st stage is the turbos and tuning. 2nd stage is new pistons and con rods, how long do you expect to complete stage 1 and stage 2?

AhEmGee

I would expect someone doing a big turbo build to know this.
Lowering the CR requires physical changes to the engine. Typically when increasing boost far above factory levels, hardware changes are needed to withstand and allow higher boost levels.
Typically you would lower the CR by changing the rods and piston. These would usually be forged. The new position and rod would be shorter to increase the minimum volume inside the cylinder when the piston is at TDC, this would reduce the CR. You could also fit a thicker head gasket and should use stronger head bolts.
But it depends how far you're going .

SLcharge

Running Water / meth is a good idea, but I assume you have limited amount of tank volume, so you only have so and so many shots. Running stock C/R would limit you to run full power only as long as you have W/M available.

Lowering C/R does that you don't need high octane fuel, don't have to take back on boost, can run more advanced ignition, etc. I would not go for race fuel, as it limits your driving to routes where you can get race gas on the way. 93 octane will do fine, with 10:1 C/R
The best would actually be, if you had a dual map ECU. That way you could tune in the car, with and without W/M, switching between tables depending on use of W/M or not. Sadly I don't think it's possible on your car, since the ECU is very much integrated in the cars electronics.
So you actually have 2 choices here.
Mapping with V/M, the ECU will retard timing if you hit it, and there is no W/M available. If it has to retard more than a few degree, it becomes somewhat problematic since the ECU will go in and out of knocking, trying to get as close to the ignition table values, as possible.
Other option. Mapping without W/M, and you are always safe. Get the extra benefit from adding W/M, just by pushing a button. I believe it will not be much power you loose, compared to mapping with W/M.

Reducing C/R, you preferably move the piston pin upwards. If there is no room for that, an option is to lower the deck on the piston. If that is also not possible, then you shorten the c-c on the conrod. The vendor will need to know the CC volume in the combustion chamber though, in order to calculate C/R correct. Best is if he can make a bowl on top of the piston, so that the squeeze area around the piston edge is not compromised.

Hrd_workin

Hey I appreciate the feedback. I will definitely have to look into the head gasket (believe the Top End Performance package started above comes with new ARP bolts).
thanks for sharing the knowledge

Hrd_workin

Wow! Appreciate the info. Makes sense.
So tuning with 93 and W/M is the more feasible way to go.
ECU issue makes sense, decided to go with the Snow Performance stage 4 W/M since it is supposed to act like a standalone system with its own programmable software. Designed to allow the tuner full control to dial in the W/M throughout the power band.
Your right though getting the feeling I will be burning through the W\M like crazy; probably good idea to add in the low warning light and maybe bigger tank lol

Hrd_workin

Bluetooth app pulls up great and is hugely customizable

Multiple screens and customizable values you can monitor
Bought this OBD2 monitor from Amazon $79.99

Just had a chance to set it up and trial run it (waiting for my phone mount to come in) as we finally had a half day lower than 102-108 degrees and no rain (95 lol) Had issues with the free app that came with the OBDLink MX+. Customer service couldn’t figure it out; but finally got it working by getting a $9 app OBDFusion. Almost identical app to their free app OBDLink.
Next up is to get some 0-60 and street 1/4 mile times and see if it’s accurate as a base before all the upgrades.