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I spent about two weeks looking at diffusers from various vendors. Modecarbon, vorsteiner, Renntech. Went to the next step down at RWCarbon and VFR Tuning. Even looked at some ebay ones for about 1 hour. In the end I didn’t go with the premium guys because I just couldn’t afford it – out of my budget. I spoke with Nick at modecarbon. Very friendly and very helpful, but I just don’t understand why, if all your company does is make carbon component, it would take 4 weeks turnaround!!! Seems like something they should have an inventory for. Imagine if each time you ordered tires you had to wait for Bridgestone to make them. I went with RWCarbon over VFR Tuning because THEY ACTUALLY HAVE A PHONE NUMBER and a person you can talk to. VFR never responded to any email. Couldn’t find a phone number anywhere else where you can talk to a real person. Even modecarbon I basically had to convince them to call me back and only after I asked them kindly to send me pictures of the diffuser tabs.
BTW, I had the install done by European Collision Center in San Francisco. They are certified by Mercedes to do all repairs for Mercedes models. So any issues they faced were unlikely due to lack of experience.
Pros: FINISH and APPEARANCE Layup: was very impressive overall. Weave pattern was slightly bigger than the OEM carbon spoiler on the trunk. The corners of the fins had one spots where the carbon layers were stretched funny – so the weave looked warped. Would need to be within 3 feet to see or notice.
Shape: The diffuser is basically the same dimensions as the OEM and the top fit spot on with the bumper. No big gaps or tight spots. Nice and tight all around.
Finish was the same as the OEM trunk spoiler. Smooth clear coat gave it a deep 3D finish. It had a consistent clear coat depth from top to bottom of the diffuser.
Cons: TABS TABS TABS!!! SIZE: The tabs on top were not long enough either to connect to the bracket AND to the bumper panel. The installer got the top tabs into the bumper panel, but they needed to be at least another 1cm to connect to the L-shape mounting bracket. Some of the tabs were too thick to go in without “impacting” he size of the OEM mounting points. They had to “modify” the mounting points (widen or cut).
SPACING: The tabs along the top were not spaced correctly. When you start from one side, but the time you get to the other side you are about ½-1cm off and the installers had to widen (ie. Cut extra space) the last 3 tab holes to get them in. It was a four guy job for my installers. Two guys would hold the bumper and bend/twist the right direction as the other two guys pushed/pulled the diffuser to get it into the hold. This could be resolved with thinner tabs and thicker tab-ends.
MISSING tabs along the bottom of the diffuser. The bottom of the diffuser (the side that goes underneath the car) did not have tabs to connect to the OEM L-bracket that holds the OEM diffuser to the metal frame. The bottom is just smooth all the way across. See pictures
There are no installation instructions so I am not sure if they are supposed to be missing or if RW Carbon does not want us to use the OEM brackets, but if I didn’t use it the diffuser was too flimsy and I would not feel save driving with it. Installers had to build an epoxy bond to “glue” the bracket to the rear of the diffuser. It is now SOLID, but if I ever need to work on the bumper (repaint, replace, re-use OEM diffuser) it will be a pain in the butt to do! Needed to drill some holes on the ends (down behind the tires) to secure it to the bumper panel like the OEM diffuser.
I don’t know how I feel about the diffuser being semi-permanent or having to alter the OEM mount points. Perhaps I received a faulty one….perhaps you aren’t supposed to use the OEM bracket. At the end the diffuser fit and looks awesome as you can see in the picture and got tons of complements. I’ll probably forget all about it in a few days…but for now I do kinda wonder if the $650 (w/tax+shipping) I paid was any different that an ebay one.
2012 C63;1971 280SE 3.5(Sold);2023 EQS 450 SUV 4 Matic (Wife's)
Thanks for the review. I have the same diffuser and the same colour car. I will be installing mine over the winter so I appreciate the heads up as to the challenge before me.
What really irked me the most was that the complete misdirection with the company. I specifically asked Eric over the phone if all the tabs mount to the OEM holes and if there is any modification needed. He said they do and no additional modification is needed. I guess he is technically telling the truth that if you dont want to mount to OEM bracket there is no modification needed. I would hope all these vendors could be professionals and a little forthcoming when there IS MODIFICATION NEEDED. Or, be upfront and tell me that your product doesn't use the OEM bracket.
They should show the products online...with detailed images of each piece including the tabs. They should try and think about it from the customer's POV - we are spending all this money for $70K+ cars and shouldn't have to manhandle it.
U don't need the oem bracket to mount the diffuser, I have the expensive Vorsteiner diffuser & had to custom make some aluminum cylinder to go over my long bolt & which is secure with a nut & washer. It's very solid now.
Trust me no matter how much the diffuser cost, they are all more or less the same in term of insrallation process.
As for the quality & fitment , it's a hit or miss regardless of the company. My Vorsteiner doesn't fit well, and I've seen ebay rep Vorsteiner with better fitment lol
2000 Acura NSX, 2012 C63 P31 (gone and not forgotten), 2015 C63 507
Originally Posted by SuperSic58
I would hope all these vendors could be professionals and a little forthcoming when there IS MODIFICATION NEEDED. Or, be upfront and tell me that your product doesn't use the OEM bracket.
Cant get them to post fricken pricing they are so shady..youre asking for too much lol
Thank you for the in depth review. We have already updated the website with your feedback in regards to the installation process.
-Matt
Rw Is it really that complicated to install? Why wouldn't you have made the tabs larger? Wondering if there is really any reason to buy yours over an eBay one sounds like figment is similar. It's almost as if you guys did not design these. If you did ease of installation is a huge selling point. Not having to customize your stock bumper. Don't see why it couldn't have been designed like the stock fitment?
Op how much did it cost for the install?? I was going to tackle this myself but it might be worth paying to get it done by the sounds of it.
I got everything done for exactly $209 at European Collision Center in SF. They said 2 hours of labor because they assumed it was going to "as easy as the OEM" and didnt expect.to have to do any modifications. I dropped off at 959am and left at 1250pm....so almost 3 hours for them to figure out how to get this to work.
Anyone who thinks all the companies (i.e RW, Mode, JB, JL & more) design their own CF parts is totally wrong.
Most CF parts comes from few companies in Asia who manufacture/ wholesale them to retailers (including ebay vendors). What differenciate the vendors we all know & deal with is the customer service & quality control.
Try to buy from a company who stock the product & physically saw the product before shipping. Avoid companies who drop ship directly from Asian wholesalers.
I got everything done for exactly $209 at European Collision Center in SF. They said 2 hours of labor because they assumed it was going to "as easy as the OEM" and didnt expect.to have to do any modifications. I dropped off at 959am and left at 1250pm....so almost 3 hours for them to figure out how to get this to work.
209$ to install a diffuser? Wow, that's crazy. I can see swapping the oem bracket to the aftermarket diffuser being a bit longer, but not 3 hours. Lol
I DIY mine, and yes it doesn't fit perfect & it never did (bought it from a good local friend).. But it's good enough since we can't really see the gap unless u look for it.
It's the standard PFL big fins that JL Motoring sells, Serge gets them from the same place.
That's a bummer to hear that the JL Motoring one fits easier and quicker. I considered them but there was no phone number and i saw that they used metal "bending tabs" that basically hold the thing to the bumper like industrial strength twist-ties (more or less). Also their fins were much thinner...which i kinda liked...but was hesitant would break during shipment. Eric at RW confirmed as much which is why they changed the design to thicker. Perhaps if JL had a number i could call i woulda pulled the trigger. But have absolutely zero complaints about the look and finish if the final product and am happy with the quality of RW. Seemed like decent guys, but probably just never installed the products themselves to see how much work goes into it.
Just wanted to make all aware its not as cut and dry as it first seems.
Anyone who thinks all the companies (i.e RW, Mode, JB, JL & more) design their own CF parts is totally wrong.
Most CF parts comes from few companies in Asia who manufacture/ wholesale them to retailers (including ebay vendors). What differenciate the vendors we all know & deal with is the customer service & quality control.
Try to buy from a company who stock the product & physically saw the product before shipping. Avoid companies who drop ship directly from Asian wholesalers.
Well said. Look around and youll see RW is a good value IMO.
Seems like they had good inventory and a customer service that will actually answer phones and emails! Took 2 days to fedex from LA to SF. Mode carbons $850 diffuser would take 4 weeks (really?!?!?) and they dont answer phones. Told me its cuz they build each one by hand in house. Im skeptical. JESUS H!!!
That's a bummer to hear that the JL Motoring one fits easier and quicker. I considered them but there was no phone number and i saw that they used metal "bending tabs" that basically hold the thing to the bumper like industrial strength twist-ties (more or less). Also their fins were much thinner...which i kinda liked...but was hesitant would break during shipment. Eric at RW confirmed as much which is why they changed the design to thicker. Perhaps if JL had a number i could call i woulda pulled the trigger. But have absolutely zero complaints about the look and finish if the final product and am happy with the quality of RW. Seemed like decent guys, but probably just never installed the products themselves to see how much work goes into it.
Just wanted to make all aware its not as cut and dry as it first seems.
They're all pretty much the same, more or less. Glad you got yours installed. The aftermarket diffusers make a big difference in appearance, IMO. Of course, they do nothing functionally, lol.
95% of them are made in China/Taiwan. They buy them in batches, which allows them to drive the price down a bit, and then they stock them. Which is why they tell you, when they run out of stock, it's a 4 - 6 week.
Production typically takes only about a week or two, and shipping by boat, because it's significantly cheaper than by air, takes about 3 - 4 weeks. Which means, it takes about 6~~ weeks from when you order if it's "not in stock"
So, whether you buy a "Legit Vorsteiner" or a "Replica Vorsteiner", it's probably from the same factory truthfully.
However, I Do have to say, some of the Reps do have slight variations in the mould. It's not one factory that churns all of them out, it's a few different ones, and depending on their mould and finishing, some of them do fit a little better than other ones.
It's just CF at the end of the day, there's nothing too special about how to make it.
EDIT: I will say though, CF Parts made in Japan are much higher quality and fit much better though, but, thats because they produce their own CF Parts in Japan, and their QC is significantly better. Though, it reflects in their pricing.
Well said Phil, u really understand the concept. Lol
But Phil I gotta disagree with u on the CF made in Japan, we bought an expensive Tom's kit from Japan for the ISF, the front is nice & sturdy but the sides & diffuser are paper thin .. Plus CF weave is wack at some area lol
And I LOL at the quote "build each one by hand in house" lol
Well said Phil, u really understand the concept. Lol
But Phil I gotta disagree with u on the CF made in Japan, we bought an expensive Tom's kit from Japan for the ISF, the front is nice & sturdy but the sides & diffuser are paper thin .. Plus CF weave is wack at some area lol
And I LOL at the quote "build each one by hand in house" lol
Interesting.
I've only ordered a few parts through Japan in CF, and they've seemed to all be pretty good. NEWING-ALPIL though. Guess it might depend on the company!
But still ,at the end of the day, any, and all CF is hit or miss. I will never fit perfectly, just because it doesn't flex well, and honestly, there are so many places where the fitment could be slightly tweaked. Could be using a mould towards the end of it's life, when the heating/cooling was done, could've been bent a little, so many different place(s) where it can go wrong.
If my CF fits like 80%, I'm pretty happy with it.
CF and FRP man, a nightmare to get it to fit perfectly. Dont' expect perfection, you'll only end up disappointing yourself!
I would also like to chime in with my experience from RW carbon. Bought a black series style front lip and DTM style diffuser from them. Both arrived yesterday and went to the shop today to get them installed.
Front Lip:
The fitment over all was close to perfect, had one minor gap from initial fitment, but was able to get rid of it by moving the bumper forward slightly. Currently the lip hugs the bumper really well, with two small gaps on the side. Virtually unnoticeable unless looking really close.
Diffuser:
Ran into the same problem as mentioned above with the oem brackets, but did not have any issues with tab fitments. My mechanic took about 10 seconds to shaved off some plastic from the bracket and was able to screw in the middle section. For the fitment as a whole however was a bit more tough. My diffuser had a bit of curvature to it (not sure if it is due to design or from manufacturing) so the sides did not align very well (didn't take pictures). Even though the all the tabs fit, they alone WILL NOT hold the diffuser in place. Was straight forward to deal with, one guy would keep the diffuser in place with a little force, while the other tapped screws into the tabs to secure it.
Pricing wise I got it cheaper than OP. Was quoted $1100 shipped for the lip and diffuser.
Overall, would rate my experience with the products very well. There were issues, but all were easily solved and very minor compared to what my mechanic have seen before. Would recommend to others looking for aftermarket carbon parts.
I know car is a bit dirty, will get it washed soon. Also forgive my paint skills.
Well said. Look around and youll see RW is a good value IMO.
Seems like they had good inventory and a customer service that will actually answer phones and emails! Took 2 days to fedex from LA to SF. Mode carbons $850 diffuser would take 4 weeks (really?!?!?) and they dont answer phones. Told me its cuz they build each one by hand in house. Im skeptical. JESUS H!!!
As you can read my sig below I have bought from Mode Carbon and RW Carbon. Customer Service from both companies were about the same. I had a number of communications (telephone & IM) with Nicholas, he is very personable. The products I received from Mode Carbon is of high quality both fit and finish. The CF side mirrors I bought from RW Carbon do not fit as well as the OEM. The mirror cover developed a hairline crack (the piece between the lights) because it doesn't quite fit in the cut out, so it's pre-loaded. Both mirrors covers are the same, passenger side is slight worse; hence the hairline crack. It's ok, because I recognize these are after market parts and may not fit 100%, that's part of the game.
I had one mix up with Mode Carbon sending the wrong spoiler (sedan) while I have a coupe. While that did happen, I did receive a superb product and Nicholas wanted to make up for it, and I politely declined. Since then, I bought the Front Splitter and Rear Diffuser on separate ocassions because I trust their quality and recognize Nicholas will go out of his way to make things right (for me). BUT, I just want to share that it is a "two-way street". I never bashed Mode Carbon or Nicholas for the errors on the spoiler the first time purchase, (privately or publically). Stuff happens. Maybe it's an age thing, or that I myself work in a customer support capacity for 30 years (Boeing Commercial Aviation Services) and I deal with airline engineers/ mechanics... You get what you pay for, and you receive what you outwardly project.
11-15-2015, 12:24 AM
