Takada airbag recall
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From: Honolulu, Hawaii
2014 C63 AMG Edition 507 coupe
I had asked a similar question above as well.
So far, what I can deduce:
1. PFL: The Driver's side is affected. Is this the Inflator, or the Module, that is affected?
Is the Passenger side affected too on PFL?
2. FL: Passenger side is affected. Both BLKROKT and I have FL 2012 models, and our recall states only Passenger is affected. This appears to be the Inflator.
Any other FL cars out there with possible Driver's side affected?
So far, what I can deduce:
1. PFL: The Driver's side is affected. Is this the Inflator, or the Module, that is affected?
Is the Passenger side affected too on PFL?
2. FL: Passenger side is affected. Both BLKROKT and I have FL 2012 models, and our recall states only Passenger is affected. This appears to be the Inflator.
Any other FL cars out there with possible Driver's side affected?
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C63 AMG, P30
In other words, will they eventually recall FL steering wheel airbags too? I hope not...
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Joined: Mar 2017
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From: Honolulu, Hawaii
2014 C63 AMG Edition 507 coupe
So this is what I find odd too as I've checked a couple of FL vins... It makes me wonder -- are they recalling these on a rolling basis? Or have all recalls been made, and repairs are now being done with priority to the other cars first.
In other words, will they eventually recall FL steering wheel airbags too? I hope not...
In other words, will they eventually recall FL steering wheel airbags too? I hope not...
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2010 C63 2019 GLA45
So how does that upgrade look like?
The ignitor plugs into the PFL wiring harness? or you're keeping the ignitor and swaping the charges?
Then everything has to be coded by Xentry by someone that can do offline?
And all controls just work?
My problem with the FL is that the steering wheel already covers partially the dials at the top with my seat and wheel adjustments, PFL. With the FL, this must be worse, with the flat top.
The other question is best answered by somebody that works in the legal sector:
By modifying the airbag, are you not taking on liability towards the next owner of the car, even with everything being out of warranty? If something was to happen to the next owner, where does this leave you?
Now mind you, airbags do have a finite lifetime. Back in the late nineties, Mercedes was looking to repurchase a 1986 W126 to see how the airbag was performing, to conduct a crash test 10 years down the line. I think that 15 years may be the life end of the system.
Also, I owned a 1987 W126, a 420SEL, that I got into a frontal accident with (Porsche guy leaped his car out of a gas station 1 carlength in front of me), this was a 45 Mph accident. The front airbag did not detonate and I think the car had pyrotechnic pretensioners and those did not detonate either. I was not injured and looking at that first generation airbag, big as a bucket, I was kinda happy it didn't detonate..
Last edited by Vladds; Jul 25, 2017 at 07:31 AM.
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2012 E550 Cabrio
Agreed. They would recall all of them, then fix on a worst to first basis. Then at the very least, if something happened, they could say "well, we made you aware of the dangers and you still chose to get behind the wheel, unfortunately we couldnt get to it in time. But we tried".
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From: Honolulu, Hawaii
2014 C63 AMG Edition 507 coupe
Perhaps due to different market requirements they didn't use the same parts? Were other non-North American cars recalled?
Exactly. Assumption of the risk. We told you not to have a passenger in that seat, etc. It was obviously dangerous and you did it anyway.
At the very least it is comparative negligence.
Agreed. They would recall all of them, then fix on a worst to first basis. Then at the very least, if something happened, they could say "well, we made you aware of the dangers and you still chose to get behind the wheel, unfortunately we couldnt get to it in time. But we tried".
At the very least it is comparative negligence.
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By Marc Stern Jul 26 2017 - 11:27pm
Daimler Beats VW, BMW As Key Whistleblower in Europe Car-Cartel Probe
As the Justice Department begins its informal review of the automotive business practices of Germany's Big Five, it seems that the timing of this turn of events may have as much to do with who was first in the mad-dash to number one.
Although it looks like the Justice Department’s viewing of a major German auto business collusion case seems pretty straightforward, there’s more to it than meets the eye. According to a story in Forbes this week, the fact that German authorities have been looking into the auto industry’s business dealing has caused industry leaders to engage in a mad-dash to be the first whistleblower. Authorities probing major German car-cartel.Authorities probing major German car-cartel.
Daimler Grabs the Golden Ring
Indeed, it looks like Daimler grabbed the golden ring, which could save it billions, while Volkswagen, which thought it had won the honors, came in second and BMW is a distant third. Under European Union law, the first one to become a whistleblower usually comes away with little more than a slap on the wrist, if that much, and little else. The second-place whistleblower may be liable for up to 50 percent of any penalty, while number three pays the bulk, in this case, BMW. The information was developed by a German newspaper, Sueddeustche Zeitung, and used by Forbes in its analysis of the situation.
Funnily, this deals with the fallout of the Dieselgate scandal, and while Daimler – manufacturer of Mercedes-Benz vehicles – has a heavy concentration of diesel in its fleet and while VW has admitted it cheated on diesel emissions, the company that is the most innocent, BMW, may be paying the bulk of any penalties.
During the weekend, the Justice Department announced an informal review of the cartel-like behavior of the German auto business, which has featured open interaction between manufacturers since the 1990s. According to reports over the weekend, some 200 employees of Germany’s Big Five automakers – Volkswagen, Porsche, Audi, Daimler and BMW – communicated through 60 or more working groups to set industry policies on such things as components, steel, emissions control and the like.
One of the key issues of the last two decades has been diesel emissions control and the use of AdBlue, the urea formaldehyde doping agent that is a key to controlling nitrous oxide emissions in diesel engine exhaust.The way it works, simply, is that the AdBlue chemical is injected into the exhaust manifold and then passed through a catalyst to clean up emissions. A problem developed between auto manufacturers in the size of the tanks that were to store the chemical before injection. Rather than opting for large-sized tanks, cartel groups worked on the problem and developed tanks that were inadequate for the task. The cartel’s actions were taken to prevent “an arms race” in tank sizes, says Forbes. So far, there has been no adequate explanation as to why the automakers developed overly small storage, though, in the past few months there have been hints that AdBlue supply limits constrained its use.
Daimler Wins Whistleblower Dash
Daimler won the mad-dash to be whistleblower early. At that time, Daimler’s attendance in the secret meetings started to drop off with cartel group meeting minutes complaining that “Daimler’s attendance [at] the exhaust treatment working group meetings continues to leave something to be desired.” The meeting information came from documents seen by Der Spiegel, while the data on timing was developed by research conducted by Sueddeutsche and the broadcasters NDR and WDR.
Volkswagen had believed it was the first whistleblower, but its declaration was dated July 4, 2016, 10 days after authorities conducted raids the automaker. The raids weren’t even carried out about the car-cartel but were the result of investigatory work on a steel cartel. The raid apparently pushed VW to own up to things quickly. However, VW was probably not quick enough. VW Offices Raided Over Cartel Practices.
Indeed, it may go all the way back to 2011 when the EU raided the offices heavy truck manufacturers MAN (VW’s truck unit), Daimler, Iveco, DAF and Volvo/Renault. In 2016, the European Commission issued fines totaling $3.5 billion for price-fixing. Since MAN was the principal witness, it skated, while Daimler paid $1.28 billion. (Like as not, there probably is more than a little payback in Daimler’s jumping onboard the whistleblower bandwagon first.)
So, said Forbes, as a result of the positioning of Daimler and VW, it is likely that the full force of the cartel violations will jam up BMW, the automaker termed “the least suspicious when it comes to Dieselgate cheating the car-cartel supposedly enabled.”
All of this was the result of the unraveling of Dieselgate. In 2014, a private research group from West Virginia University performed road tests on a VW Passat TDI, a VW Jetta TDI and a BMW X5 diesel. The X5 passed quickly, while the VWs notoriously flopped. In the years following the 2014 findings, VW turbodiesels, Audi turbodiesels, Opel, Fiat and Renault diesel were among the top polluters according to listings compiled by regulators and the European media. BMW’s vehicles were usually absent.
_______________________
By Marc Stern Jul 25 2017 - 2:01pm
U.S. Launches Review Of Reports VW, BMW, Daimler Colluded for Decades
According to a news report, the Justice Department has launched an informal review of German reports of major collusion among the country's major carmakers. The report appeared in the influential German magazine Der Spiegel.
The Justice Department has launched an informal review into reports that German automakers may have colluded to gain advantages over their rivals. The report follows stories over the weekend indicating that Germany’s major automakers, Daimler, BMW and Volkswagen may have conspired for decades. The review involves a look at Volkswagen and its subsidiaries, Audi and Porsche. There is no indication that a formal Justice investigation is in the offing. Justice Department Reviews Euro Collusion Report.
Review Follows Report In German Magazine
Der Spiegel, a major German magazine, raised the issue last week when it maintained that starting in the 1990s the carmakers met to coordinate vehicle technology, costs, suppliers and strategy. Further, the carmakers were reported to have worked on diesel emissions standards.
The Spiegel report said that there were intercompany talks involving 60 working groups made up of more than 200 employees. The teams reportedly looked into auto development, gasoline and diesel engines, brakes and transmissions. There were also reports that the talks may have involved the sizing of AdBlue tanks for diesel cars. AdBlue is the tradename of the urea formaldehyde liquid that is central to the emissions-cheating scandal to which VW has pleaded guilty and which has now cost the automaker more than $25 billion. Daimler reportedly remains under investigation, sources have told Der Spiegel.
Authorities on Saturday said they had received information about the collusion and were studying the issue. The European Commission and the German cartel office are involved. Dieselgate Haunts Major German Automakers
According to the Spiegel article, the automakers engaged in their cartel-like actions to stymie competition. They agreed on issues such as component costs, as well as such technical details as convertible roofs.
Automakers Deny Reports; Termed ‘Conjecture’
Kenn Sparks, a BMW spokesman, declined comment on the Justice Department review and the automaker declined any collusion with other automakers. VW refused to comment, although the automaker had earlier said the report contained “speculation and conjecture.” Spokespeople for Daimler and the Justice Department declined to comment.
The report could be sticky for Volkswagen whose plea deal with the U.S. calls for the automaker to commit no other crimes and to cooperate with any U.S. emissions-related probe. If Justice launches a formal investigation, the criminal section of the agency’s antitrust branch would handle the probe. The emissions cheating scandal fell under different divisions.
Germany’s cartel office, the Budeskartellamt, said on Friday that it had conducted searches of the car companies last year as part of its probe into a potential steel cartel. It did not offer any elaboration on further probes of car technology because it doesn’t comment on ongoing investigations.
Source: Bloomberg
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Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 148
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From: Honolulu, Hawaii
2014 C63 AMG Edition 507 coupe
I don't think that investigation will have any revelations relating to Takata (other than maybe how long they knew about the problem before acting). I mean, it is fairly common knowledge that manufacturers know of product defects and go ahead with production anyway. They just settle out. Look at the Pinto or any large truck-frame vehicle with an external fuel tank and a battery literally located next to it with nothing to protect it in an impact... This is probably different though. This is an issue with Takata. Not collusion of German manufacturers. All sorts of non-German manufacturers are having the same problem and doing the same phased approach to fixing because parts just haven't been manufactured to fix the problem. The exact same type of problem Toyota and Lexus are having getting interior panels for all the cars with defective melting panels. Seriously, like 9 month+ waits while parts are produced. You can only fix something if the parts exist....
Last edited by BadCompany; Jul 27, 2017 at 10:00 PM.
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2012 E550 Cabrio
True that. What is the cost of a recall? If its less than the projected law suits then lets do it. But if its more, let em Pinto. Should be criminal charges in those cases, whether they cause death or just financial destruction.
