Quaife LSD - Motul 75w90 or 75w140
02-10-2017, 08:52 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Quaife LSD - Motul 75w90 or 75w140
Hi,
I have purchased a Quaife LSD for my C63 w204, it's now on the way from UK to Shanghai. It's my first mod on the car to increase its performance.
I'm wondering about the oil for this LSD Diff: Motul Gear 300 (75w90) or Motul Gear Competition (75w140)?
I use the car daily and also on trackdays on 2 tracks here in Shanghai. I just bought this car 2nd hand recently, and took it once to the track. I'm planning to track it regularly, maybe once a month.
I saw in previous threads dealing with LSD that some of you already used both or them, i'm wondering what was you decision factor and what is your actual feedback?
Thanks for your advices
here my check-in: https://mbworld.org/forums/new-membe...-shanghai.html
I have purchased a Quaife LSD for my C63 w204, it's now on the way from UK to Shanghai. It's my first mod on the car to increase its performance.
I'm wondering about the oil for this LSD Diff: Motul Gear 300 (75w90) or Motul Gear Competition (75w140)?
I use the car daily and also on trackdays on 2 tracks here in Shanghai. I just bought this car 2nd hand recently, and took it once to the track. I'm planning to track it regularly, maybe once a month.
I saw in previous threads dealing with LSD that some of you already used both or them, i'm wondering what was you decision factor and what is your actual feedback?
Thanks for your advices
here my check-in: https://mbworld.org/forums/new-membe...-shanghai.html
02-10-2017, 10:39 PM
#3
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2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
Motul Competition Gear Oil
02-11-2017, 02:16 AM
#4
02-11-2017, 03:34 AM
#5
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Every vendor I could find selling Quaife on this board recommends the Motul Competition in their packages. Which is 75w140.
Example: https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...san-diego.html
Is ACG wrong?
A few also run the Castrol Syntrax 75w140 and I haven't heard of any blowing up.
Edit: I did a Google search and turned up a lot of 75w90 being used as well. Seems to be quite the debate. Quaife does not list anything on their site, just to use the manufacturer recommended gear oil. But the consensus on the intertubes looks like 75w90 is the winner. So I stand corrected.
Example: https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...san-diego.html
Is ACG wrong?
A few also run the Castrol Syntrax 75w140 and I haven't heard of any blowing up.
Edit: I did a Google search and turned up a lot of 75w90 being used as well. Seems to be quite the debate. Quaife does not list anything on their site, just to use the manufacturer recommended gear oil. But the consensus on the intertubes looks like 75w90 is the winner. So I stand corrected.
Last edited by BLKROKT; 02-11-2017 at 03:43 AM.
02-11-2017, 12:35 PM
#6
MBWorld Fanatic!
I had this talk with WaveTrac directly way back when I installed mine. It really just depends what application it's used for. Mostly track use the 140 weight, mainly street use the 90 weight.
Originally Posted by Wavetrac
What gear oil should I use? [-]
Your new Wavetrac® differential is incredibly durable and will withstand the harshest environments...as long as suitable oil is used. Many customers ask what oil we recommend for use with the Wavetrac® differential. We feel the best answer is:
Some have friction modifiers designed for limited slip differentials. These modifiers generally increase slipperiness and are intended to reduce clutch disc chatter in conventional clutch-type LSDs. Some gear oils such as Red Line Oil's Shockproof® type have microscopic solid particles in immersion in order to "cushion" transmission components, acting as an extreme pressure agent. The Wavetrac® and all helical gear differentials in general, operate using friction. The friction generated between its internal gears and its housing are what allow this type of differential to function.
Gear oil additives that drastically reduce friction will actually reduce the performance of gear differentials. The internals of the diff get too slick to generate adequate friction - reducing the differential's effectiveness - reducing its ability to drive both wheels.
In conclusion, when using a Wavetrac®:
Please note that you will void the Wavetrac® Limited Lifetime Warranty if incorrect gear oil is used.
Your new Wavetrac® differential is incredibly durable and will withstand the harshest environments...as long as suitable oil is used. Many customers ask what oil we recommend for use with the Wavetrac® differential. We feel the best answer is:
Use the "factory fill."
In other words, use the gear oil spec that your car manufacturer recommends for your car. The Wavetrac® is compatible with virtually all factory-installed gear oils used today. If you are racing your vehicle, and wish to upgrade the gear oil to improve performance or durability in racing conditions, choose the oil carefully: be aware that some gear oils have additives that are not recommended for use with your Wavetrac®.Some have friction modifiers designed for limited slip differentials. These modifiers generally increase slipperiness and are intended to reduce clutch disc chatter in conventional clutch-type LSDs. Some gear oils such as Red Line Oil's Shockproof® type have microscopic solid particles in immersion in order to "cushion" transmission components, acting as an extreme pressure agent. The Wavetrac® and all helical gear differentials in general, operate using friction. The friction generated between its internal gears and its housing are what allow this type of differential to function.
Gear oil additives that drastically reduce friction will actually reduce the performance of gear differentials. The internals of the diff get too slick to generate adequate friction - reducing the differential's effectiveness - reducing its ability to drive both wheels.
In conclusion, when using a Wavetrac®:
- Use factory spec oils for your car
- Use Motul Synthetic high performance oils if you wish to upgrade the oil. Please consult Autotech Driveline for recommendations.
- Avoid gear oils with limited slip additives.
- Do NOT use RedLine, Shockproof® or similar gear oils.
Code:
Performance Gear Oils we recommend: Requirement Oil 75W90 Motul Gear 300 (100118 1l) 75W140 Motul Gear Competition (101161 1l) Motul Gear Oil is available from Wavetrac dealers
02-11-2017, 08:50 PM
#7
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Thread Starter
Today I received feedback from Quaife:
They suggest the Motul 75w90, or any other similar oil that fits the OEM spec (open diff, not the OEM LSD with clutch system). They also noted that they cannot recommend the Motul 75w140 as they are not sure if it includes a modifier for clutch.
I found the Motul specs, they are attached.
Even if I plan to go to trackdays frequently, the car is mostly used on the streets. I will then probably stick to their recommendation.
Thanks for your inputs
They suggest the Motul 75w90, or any other similar oil that fits the OEM spec (open diff, not the OEM LSD with clutch system). They also noted that they cannot recommend the Motul 75w140 as they are not sure if it includes a modifier for clutch.
I found the Motul specs, they are attached.
Even if I plan to go to trackdays frequently, the car is mostly used on the streets. I will then probably stick to their recommendation.
Thanks for your inputs
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02-11-2017, 09:18 PM
#8
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They also have an LS version of the Gear 300 which is designed for mechanical limited slip (quaife and wavetrac) diffs. I believe their 140 is LS by default.
I don't think they have any gear oils with friction modifiers for clutch type diffs.
EDIT: https://www.motul.com/my/en/news/gea...-gear-changing
I don't think they have any gear oils with friction modifiers for clutch type diffs.
EDIT: https://www.motul.com/my/en/news/gea...-gear-changing
Last edited by Jasonoff; 02-11-2017 at 09:22 PM.
02-11-2017, 09:44 PM
#9
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I use the Motul 75W 140 competition with my wavetrac. It's super quiet and definitely locks up when needed.
Last edited by chrisridebike8; 02-12-2017 at 11:03 AM.
02-12-2017, 10:42 AM
#10
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2012 C63;1971 280SE 3.5(Sold);2023 EQS 450 SUV 4 Matic (Wife's)
It looks to me like the Motul 75W140 Competition does have a friction modifier for clutch type LSDs.
From the PDF linked above: "Included friction modifier avoid noisy or dragging limited slip differential."
From the PDF linked above: "Included friction modifier avoid noisy or dragging limited slip differential."
02-12-2017, 01:15 PM
#11
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That's where it's a little confusing, because it's also designed for a gearbox with or without synchros. A little further up in the type of use section it says "synchronized or not synchronized gearboxes". Wouldn't a friction modifier be bad for a trans with syncrhos?
That and the fact wavetrac recommends the 75W140 but explicitly says "Avoid gear oils with limited slip additives" lol.
That and the fact wavetrac recommends the 75W140 but explicitly says "Avoid gear oils with limited slip additives" lol.
02-12-2017, 02:33 PM
#12
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It is confusing for sure. I always believed if the diff oil said it was suitable for LSDs that it contained friction modifiers for clutch style LSDs.
02-12-2017, 08:06 PM
#14
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Thread Starter
I should receive the Quaife this week in Shanghai. I decided to lubricate it with the Motul 75w90 non LS as it is the one recommended expressly by Quaife.
Plan to install it this sunday morning and directly go to track it sunday afternoon on the SIC (Shanghai International Circuit). I'm really looking forward with excitement for this day: will be the first time for me on this nice track and testing the LSD.
I will roast my tires as they are near to the wear marks. lol
Plan to install it this sunday morning and directly go to track it sunday afternoon on the SIC (Shanghai International Circuit). I'm really looking forward with excitement for this day: will be the first time for me on this nice track and testing the LSD.
I will roast my tires as they are near to the wear marks. lol
02-12-2017, 08:07 PM
#15
MBWorld Fanatic!
I should receive the Quaife this week in Shanghai. I decided to lubricate it with the Motul 75w90 non LS as it is the one recommended expressly by Quaife.
Plan to install it this sunday morning and directly go to track it sunday afternoon on the SIC (Shanghai International Circuit). I'm really looking forward with excitement for this day: will be the first time for me on this nice track and testing the LSD.
I will roast my tires as they are near to the wear marks. lol
Plan to install it this sunday morning and directly go to track it sunday afternoon on the SIC (Shanghai International Circuit). I'm really looking forward with excitement for this day: will be the first time for me on this nice track and testing the LSD.
I will roast my tires as they are near to the wear marks. lol
02-21-2017, 05:04 AM
#16
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Thread Starter
Surprise surprise:
This sunday I went to the shop to get the Quaife installed, and after they open the diff, a Quaife was already inside! looks like an older type compared to the new that i just got (the ring has no wave). But anyway it's fine to me, so I just kept the actual setting and I will sell the new one.
Regarding the oil, I ended up with AMS severe gear 75w90 as the Motul was out of stock at the official dealer.
Went to the track and destroyed the rear tires and the brake pads. Great car on the Shanghai International Circuit, lot of fun! Changed the old Pirelli P zero rosso against Yokohama AD-08R and noticed great improvement regarding the stability of the car on the track
This sunday I went to the shop to get the Quaife installed, and after they open the diff, a Quaife was already inside! looks like an older type compared to the new that i just got (the ring has no wave). But anyway it's fine to me, so I just kept the actual setting and I will sell the new one.
Regarding the oil, I ended up with AMS severe gear 75w90 as the Motul was out of stock at the official dealer.
Went to the track and destroyed the rear tires and the brake pads. Great car on the Shanghai International Circuit, lot of fun! Changed the old Pirelli P zero rosso against Yokohama AD-08R and noticed great improvement regarding the stability of the car on the track
