nl88

Hi All,

Just realised that there have been a few piggybacks mentioned here. However, I noticed that the Brabus Performance Kit hasn't been mentioned before.

Anyone have any experience with them ?

BRABUS PowerXtra CGI B40-600
base C 63 S (W/S 205). Please specify basic Version!
+66 kW / 90 hp, +100 Nm auf 441 kW / 600 hp, 800 Nm
Vmax: ca. 300 km/h (depending on the base)

BRABUS PowerXtra B40S-650
Base C63 S (W/S 205) Please specify basic version!
+ 103 kW / 140 hp, + 120 Nm to 478 kW / 650 hp, 820 Nm
Vmax: 320 km/h (depending on the base)

Vassago

Interesting, not much info on Brabus site. Subscribing to this thread to see what people have to say.

4dr.no

iTrader: (1)

Quick Google turned up this review. Looks like ECU reflash is needed.

https://www.topspeed.com/cars/merced...-ar172602.html

"True to its reputation, the German tuner developed a unique performance upgrade on the AMG C 63 S, dubbed the PowerXtra B40S - 650.” The kit is made up of a pair of turbochargers with larger compressors, new core assemblies, and reinforced axial bearings. There’s also an engine-specific ECU remap to improve the fuel-injection and ignition systems of the V-8. The result is an improvement of 140 horsepower and 80 pound-feet of torque over the engine’s standard output of 510 horsepower and 524 pound-feet of torque."

vaelin

That's almost the equivalent of their Stage 3 package; milder tune is via piggyback, above.

digitalnav

Brabus or Dinan... hmm...

vaelin

Dinan is down the road (101) from you and I and warrantied. Brabus is on the other side of the world.

AlexZTuned

There is a Brabus piggyback for stock turbos, and a Brabus ECU flash for their kit with upgraded turbos.

I believe the piggyback was something crazy like $9000.

I recommend looking into the RaceChip Ultimate for the C63S or wait for Dinan to release. RaceChip is TUV certified and it's a legit operation in Germany... I'm very tempted to try them out, it's under a grand.

digitalnav

I know i know... just that brabus name haha.

99% going with DINAN though just need them to realse the damn thing.

nl88

Seems like brabus is also covered by warranty. Managed to dig a little for the price. €59xx .. However it seems to only be available to c63S and not the non-s.

Zelvy Carbon

I have the Racechip on my C63s I just took it out to see what difference (if any) I could notice.

I was also informed by my dealer that I have voided engine warranty by installing it. I uncoupled the chip before taking it to the dealer for some warranty work (unrelated) but they noticed the wiring. I am in Australia. And I will be pursueing them legally as they are not within their right to void all engine warranty.

Sanch

Wow good to know, I'm also in Australia.

AlexZTuned

Not surprising in the least... if you leave parts of a piggyback still plugged in and they find traces of the device, say bye-bye to engine/trans/ECU warranty. If you removed it entirely before service, it would not have been detectable. Live and learn.

digitalnav

False, new ECUs for a while now keep track of boost pressure etc. they can easily backtrace to see if the car was running excessive boost. Very common on BMW's and the JB4, etc.

dforman15

I'm no legal expert and I'm not taking Mercedes side but I do believe they have the right to void your warranty in regards to the engine/transmission. If you chose to modify the engine parameters set by Mercedes ie. boost pressure, air/fuel ratio, and put additional stress on the motor and trans (which is what they will say), they can void the warranty. If for some reason down the road your motor or trans blows up, there is no way they will cover it. They will place blame on you for modifying your car. Of course you can fight them in court if you wish.

digitalnav

^^^ precisely.

This is why I'm waiting for DINAN and their warranty coverage.

AlexZTuned

That's true if you do an ECU flash and overwrite table values (and I'm sure a flash log will be counted internally). But when you use a piggyback, you're tricking the ECU into thinking it's running OEM parameters (by modifying the voltages of the various sensors). This allows the ECU to stay within OEM parameters and maintain OEM safety measures without raising any flags.

Basically the ECU thinks it's running stock boost/timing/AF, so there won't be any "excessive boost" or changed parameters to the ECU if they were to go digging.

digitalnav

False again. A Piggyback will send info that the stock ECU reads. This has been debated and debunked on various BMW models which im sure is the same for Mercedes.

I dont remeber the exact technical terms, i went down this route with my previous car and it was with it for over a year. All i know is that a piggyback, even when removed, will still store the higher values within the ECU.

If you have proof otherwise that its different on Mercedes, i'll glady retract my statement. Im all for learning new things, this is just from previous experience.

EDIT: as far as i recall they just "piggyback" onto the turbo lines and increase pressure and some other parameters. Its just manipulating the signal as a middleman.

Zelvy Carbon

I did some more digging, and you are both right really.
BASICALLY. Either way you are screwed.
REFLASH, they can count / see when the reflash has occured, so if something went bang and you took it to your tuner to get put back to factory before returning it to the dealer for "warranty". They can't see your settings, but you are sure to raise a lot of suspeicions, and given they can see the ECU was interfered with, you are voiding warranty.
PIGGYBACK, they can tell that too.
Meh, I don't care, I added aftermarket air filters, and ripped the 2nd cat from the downpipe ages ago, thus voiding warranty technically..
Under Aussie law, if I have a engine/trans issue that they cannot prove to be caused from the mods, I have a right to claim. IE, oil leak etc..

AlexZTuned

They manipulate two manifold air pressure sensors, two boost pressure sensors, and one camshaft sensor.

If the manipulated voltages sent back to the ECU are outside the stock parameters (the manipulated signals are detected by the ECU), then the ECU will protect itself and go into limp mode. This happened with poor quality chips like the original Rebellion piggybacks that some people ran. Once you go into limp mode, you will more than likely throw a CEL and/or store a code… and dealers could probably determine why the car went into limp mode.

On high quality piggybacks with smart processors (Dinan, RaceChip), this isn't an issue. The manipulated signals aren’t detected by the ECU, so the car doesn’t enter limp mode or throw a code. In that case, removing the piggyback would be virtually undetectable.

digitalnav

Well, this could be true. Guess we have to wait and see till someone actually takes a car with a piggy back into the dealer to get serviced with it removed and if they run into any hiccups.

Thanks for the insight!

AV1

[QUOTE=AlexZTuned;

I believe the piggyback was something crazy like $9000.

[/QUOTE]

This ^^^^^

There's a Brabus workshop located almost right next door to my place of work - which is a good thing - but unfortunately the prices they charge for their MB/AMG associated mods is just crazy...with regards to tuning boxes they can charge up to 10x the price of other typical products

Most people source these and other mods from other O/S suppliers.

subzero05

+1