"soft" brake rotors?
04-02-2009, 01:50 PM
#1
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2004 CL600
"soft" brake rotors?
I took my 2004 CL600 in for it's first "B" service with 25,000 miles on the clock. The car was not put into service until August 2005 so my new car warranty is good until August of this year. The car has been very reliable and solid so far. To my shock the dealer told me I needed not only new front brake pads but rotors too as the originals were now "below minimum thickness".
I expressed some concern about excessive rotor wear for a car with so few miles. He told me the rotors were "made to be soft just like the performance tires" and they wear quickly. He asked if I was pleased with the brake performance, I am but I do not think I am getting a straight story here. Does anyone else have some insight on this issue?
The dealer also told me I needed new rear tires which did not surprise me
I expressed some concern about excessive rotor wear for a car with so few miles. He told me the rotors were "made to be soft just like the performance tires" and they wear quickly. He asked if I was pleased with the brake performance, I am but I do not think I am getting a straight story here. Does anyone else have some insight on this issue?
The dealer also told me I needed new rear tires which did not surprise me
04-02-2009, 03:30 PM
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CL500
I took my 2004 CL600 in for it's first "B" service with 25,000 miles on the clock. The car was not put into service until August 2005 so my new car warranty is good until August of this year. The car has been very reliable and solid so far. To my shock the dealer told me I needed not only new front brake pads but rotors too as the originals were now "below minimum thickness".
I expressed some concern about excessive rotor wear for a car with so few miles. He told me the rotors were "made to be soft just like the performance tires" and they wear quickly. He asked if I was pleased with the brake performance, I am but I do not think I am getting a straight story here. Does anyone else have some insight on this issue?
The dealer also told me I needed new rear tires which did not surprise me
I expressed some concern about excessive rotor wear for a car with so few miles. He told me the rotors were "made to be soft just like the performance tires" and they wear quickly. He asked if I was pleased with the brake performance, I am but I do not think I am getting a straight story here. Does anyone else have some insight on this issue?
The dealer also told me I needed new rear tires which did not surprise me
i replaced the rotors at about 25K, they say you should replace them everytime you replace the brakes. i dont know if this is true. but they do wear our quickly. can anyone else confirm?
04-02-2009, 06:27 PM
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GLC 63
I replaced mine as well. When I asked about turning the rotors, they asked if I was kidding. They said absolutely not. They replaced pads and rotors. But it was not as costly as I thought it was going to be.
04-02-2009, 06:52 PM
#4
Why should rotors be replaced if they are not damaged?
I thought that's why we replace brake pads early, so we don't damage the rotors. MB put brake pad sensors on their cars just for that reason.
Rotors need replacing when they are damaged by seized calipers and/or extremely worn pads, or if they are warped for what ever reason.
Also, the rotors can be machined, but the dealership won't do it. Why? Because they will say the rotors will be "below the minimum thickness"!
Any independant can turn rotors for about $20 ea.
I thought that's why we replace brake pads early, so we don't damage the rotors. MB put brake pad sensors on their cars just for that reason.
Rotors need replacing when they are damaged by seized calipers and/or extremely worn pads, or if they are warped for what ever reason.
Also, the rotors can be machined, but the dealership won't do it. Why? Because they will say the rotors will be "below the minimum thickness"!
Any independant can turn rotors for about $20 ea.
04-02-2009, 07:14 PM
#5
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Why should rotors be replaced if they are not damaged?
I thought that's why we replace brake pads early, so we don't damage the rotors. MB put brake pad sensors on their cars just for that reason.
Rotors need replacing when they are damaged by seized calipers and/or extremely worn pads, or if they are warped for what ever reason.
Also, the rotors can be machined, but the dealership won't do it. Why? Because they will say the rotors will be "below the minimum thickness"!
Any independant can turn rotors for about $20 ea.
I thought that's why we replace brake pads early, so we don't damage the rotors. MB put brake pad sensors on their cars just for that reason.
Rotors need replacing when they are damaged by seized calipers and/or extremely worn pads, or if they are warped for what ever reason.
Also, the rotors can be machined, but the dealership won't do it. Why? Because they will say the rotors will be "below the minimum thickness"!
Any independant can turn rotors for about $20 ea.
Mercedes rotors are softer than many others and are responsible for the unique braking feel and performance. Front rotors usually need replacement with pads on S or CL-class cars because of their weight. Rear rotors typically go every other pad replacement.
The rotor wear limit is important to observe. If the rotors are too thin they won't dissipate heat as quickly and hot spots will cause brake fade. Thin rotors can also cause caliper damage when, at the end of pad life, pistons are forced to move further out than their design limit.
Bottom line: if you don't believe the dealer is properly miking the rotor either demand to see the used ones or get a dealer you can trust. And if you accept that the rotors are past the MB limit but want to reuse them anyway, you're a fool.
04-03-2009, 09:54 AM
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If you need to take therotor off to turn them anyway, why wouldn't you just replace them?
The labor is already there by taking the rotor off as it is.
The labor is already there by taking the rotor off as it is.
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04-03-2009, 12:35 PM
#8
MBWorld Fanatic!
It's both. The rotors are definitely considered a maintenance item, and are priced relatively cheaply on most models for that reason.
04-04-2009, 10:20 AM
#9
Mercedes rotors should never be turned. It's your car, so you can hack at it anyway you want, but the OP and other posters have it right.
Mercedes rotors are softer than many others and are responsible for the unique braking feel and performance. Front rotors usually need replacement with pads on S or CL-class cars because of their weight. Rear rotors typically go every other pad replacement.
The rotor wear limit is important to observe. If the rotors are too thin they won't dissipate heat as quickly and hot spots will cause brake fade. Thin rotors can also cause caliper damage when, at the end of pad life, pistons are forced to move further out than their design limit.
Bottom line: if you don't believe the dealer is properly miking the rotor either demand to see the used ones or get a dealer you can trust. And if you accept that the rotors are past the MB limit but want to reuse them anyway, you're a fool.
Mercedes rotors are softer than many others and are responsible for the unique braking feel and performance. Front rotors usually need replacement with pads on S or CL-class cars because of their weight. Rear rotors typically go every other pad replacement.
The rotor wear limit is important to observe. If the rotors are too thin they won't dissipate heat as quickly and hot spots will cause brake fade. Thin rotors can also cause caliper damage when, at the end of pad life, pistons are forced to move further out than their design limit.
Bottom line: if you don't believe the dealer is properly miking the rotor either demand to see the used ones or get a dealer you can trust. And if you accept that the rotors are past the MB limit but want to reuse them anyway, you're a fool.
'Hack'? I squeeze steel bigger than any car. This is not rocket science
I am not accepting they are past the limit. Why are they past the limit? When changing pads, one should always clean up the rotor surface, but dealers don't do this any more and instead replace rotors.
Why? More money and less work for them.
If you believe different, I've got some ocean front property in Saskatchewan for you.
It would be foolish to spend funds needlessly, when a clean-up of the surface by turning would do perfectly Ok until the pads needed changing again at a later date.
Again, MB puts sensors on the pads so they would be well within 'limits' to keep the calipers and rotors working effectively. This was a wise move by MB and it would have been just as wise to mention this fact at the dealer instead of silently accepting the reason they give for having rotors replaced at such short intervals.
If someone accepts a line of reasoning and is opposed, but says or does nothing at the moment and it then further costs them money....well....PT Barnum comes to mind.
Who feels it, knows it.
04-05-2009, 01:47 AM
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GLC 63
If you were driving a Mustang or a Buick then yes turn the rotors.
Brake repairs - critical? Of course!
Mercedes brake rotors, unlike domestics, are built with minimal thicknesses to save weight - meaning they can't be "turned"; they must be replaced.
Mercedes brake rotors are also more sensitive to warping from heat, and overheated brakes are the second most common cause of failure (first is wear-and-tear).
And dont take it to Brakes Plus for gosh sakes.
Brake repairs - critical? Of course!
Mercedes brake rotors, unlike domestics, are built with minimal thicknesses to save weight - meaning they can't be "turned"; they must be replaced.
Mercedes brake rotors are also more sensitive to warping from heat, and overheated brakes are the second most common cause of failure (first is wear-and-tear).
And dont take it to Brakes Plus for gosh sakes.
04-05-2009, 02:30 AM
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a g
Mercedes rotors should never be turned. It's your car, so you can hack at it anyway you want, but the OP and other posters have it right.
Mercedes rotors are softer than many others and are responsible for the unique braking feel and performance. Front rotors usually need replacement with pads on S or CL-class cars because of their weight. Rear rotors typically go every other pad replacement.
The rotor wear limit is important to observe. If the rotors are too thin they won't dissipate heat as quickly and hot spots will cause brake fade. Thin rotors can also cause caliper damage when, at the end of pad life, pistons are forced to move further out than their design limit.
Bottom line: if you don't believe the dealer is properly miking the rotor either demand to see the used ones or get a dealer you can trust. And if you accept that the rotors are past the MB limit but want to reuse them anyway, you're a fool.
Mercedes rotors are softer than many others and are responsible for the unique braking feel and performance. Front rotors usually need replacement with pads on S or CL-class cars because of their weight. Rear rotors typically go every other pad replacement.
The rotor wear limit is important to observe. If the rotors are too thin they won't dissipate heat as quickly and hot spots will cause brake fade. Thin rotors can also cause caliper damage when, at the end of pad life, pistons are forced to move further out than their design limit.
Bottom line: if you don't believe the dealer is properly miking the rotor either demand to see the used ones or get a dealer you can trust. And if you accept that the rotors are past the MB limit but want to reuse them anyway, you're a fool.
04-05-2009, 02:39 AM
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a g
'Hack'? I squeeze steel bigger than any car. This is not rocket science
I am not accepting they are past the limit. Why are they past the limit? When changing pads, one should always clean up the rotor surface, but dealers don't do this any more and instead replace rotors.
Why? More money and less work for them.
If you believe different, I've got some ocean front property in Saskatchewan for you.
It would be foolish to spend funds needlessly, when a clean-up of the surface by turning would do perfectly Ok until the pads needed changing again at a later date.
Again, MB puts sensors on the pads so they would be well within 'limits' to keep the calipers and rotors working effectively. This was a wise move by MB and it would have been just as wise to mention this fact at the dealer instead of silently accepting the reason they give for having rotors replaced at such short intervals.
If someone accepts a line of reasoning and is opposed, but says or does nothing at the moment and it then further costs them money....well....PT Barnum comes to mind.
Who feels it, knows it.
I am not accepting they are past the limit. Why are they past the limit? When changing pads, one should always clean up the rotor surface, but dealers don't do this any more and instead replace rotors.
Why? More money and less work for them.
If you believe different, I've got some ocean front property in Saskatchewan for you.
It would be foolish to spend funds needlessly, when a clean-up of the surface by turning would do perfectly Ok until the pads needed changing again at a later date.
Again, MB puts sensors on the pads so they would be well within 'limits' to keep the calipers and rotors working effectively. This was a wise move by MB and it would have been just as wise to mention this fact at the dealer instead of silently accepting the reason they give for having rotors replaced at such short intervals.
If someone accepts a line of reasoning and is opposed, but says or does nothing at the moment and it then further costs them money....well....PT Barnum comes to mind.
Who feels it, knows it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXpjBxD0Rhg
04-05-2009, 10:16 AM
#13
MBWorld Fanatic!
'Hack'? I squeeze steel bigger than any car. This is not rocket science
I am not accepting they are past the limit. Why are they past the limit? When changing pads, one should always clean up the rotor surface, but dealers don't do this any more and instead replace rotors.
Why? More money and less work for them.
If you believe different, I've got some ocean front property in Saskatchewan for you.
It would be foolish to spend funds needlessly, when a clean-up of the surface by turning would do perfectly Ok until the pads needed changing again at a later date.
Again, MB puts sensors on the pads so they would be well within 'limits' to keep the calipers and rotors working effectively. This was a wise move by MB and it would have been just as wise to mention this fact at the dealer instead of silently accepting the reason they give for having rotors replaced at such short intervals.
If someone accepts a line of reasoning and is opposed, but says or does nothing at the moment and it then further costs them money....well....PT Barnum comes to mind.
Who feels it, knows it.
I am not accepting they are past the limit. Why are they past the limit? When changing pads, one should always clean up the rotor surface, but dealers don't do this any more and instead replace rotors.
Why? More money and less work for them.
If you believe different, I've got some ocean front property in Saskatchewan for you.
It would be foolish to spend funds needlessly, when a clean-up of the surface by turning would do perfectly Ok until the pads needed changing again at a later date.
Again, MB puts sensors on the pads so they would be well within 'limits' to keep the calipers and rotors working effectively. This was a wise move by MB and it would have been just as wise to mention this fact at the dealer instead of silently accepting the reason they give for having rotors replaced at such short intervals.
If someone accepts a line of reasoning and is opposed, but says or does nothing at the moment and it then further costs them money....well....PT Barnum comes to mind.
Who feels it, knows it.
Does "I squeeze steel bigger than any car" mean someting on your planet?
04-05-2009, 07:15 PM
#14
It means I know what I am doing when it comes to steel!
Does anyone here know what the 'specs' are? It doesn't seem so to me.
Has anyone asked at the dealer? I'll bet not.
Also, I've turned the rotors on many cars, my MBs included and have had no problems.
Does anyone here know what the 'specs' are? It doesn't seem so to me.
Has anyone asked at the dealer? I'll bet not.
Also, I've turned the rotors on many cars, my MBs included and have had no problems.
04-05-2009, 08:26 PM
#15
MBWorld Fanatic!
An honest dealer mics rotors at every pad change and changes them when they're past the wear limit. This is often every pad change, or sometimes every other pad change. This is the way MB brakes are engineered.
As I have said, if the dealer changes rotors that have not exceeded their service limit you need a new dealer. If you ignore the service limit, you are a fool. Turning an MB rotor will always take off enough metal to exceed the service limit, which is why the factory, not the dealers, prohibit it.
Feel free to repair the brakes on your car anyway you like. Just don't do any friends any favors.
04-09-2009, 01:11 PM
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2004 CL600
2 Front Pads $260, Quote for 2 Front Rotors $850
I kicked this off. Car has 25K on the clock. My dealer service technician observed "Front pads and rotors are below replacement thickness".
Question remains, do I really have to spend $1,100 + every time I need new brake pads or 25K miles? Seems excessive.
Is anyone out there affiliated with an MB dealer or the manufacturer that can weigh-in on this?
I am going to take the car to my local mechanic for a second look at this. I just bought some new 19" CL63 wheels with some fat Michelins so I don't spin the wheels quite as much on launch..
Question remains, do I really have to spend $1,100 + every time I need new brake pads or 25K miles? Seems excessive.
Is anyone out there affiliated with an MB dealer or the manufacturer that can weigh-in on this?
I am going to take the car to my local mechanic for a second look at this. I just bought some new 19" CL63 wheels with some fat Michelins so I don't spin the wheels quite as much on launch..
04-09-2009, 09:35 PM
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a g
I kicked this off. Car has 25K on the clock. My dealer service technician observed "Front pads and rotors are below replacement thickness".
Question remains, do I really have to spend $1,100 + every time I need new brake pads or 25K miles? Seems excessive.
Is anyone out there affiliated with an MB dealer or the manufacturer that can weigh-in on this?
I am going to take the car to my local mechanic for a second look at this. I just bought some new 19" CL63 wheels with some fat Michelins so I don't spin the wheels quite as much on launch..
Question remains, do I really have to spend $1,100 + every time I need new brake pads or 25K miles? Seems excessive.
Is anyone out there affiliated with an MB dealer or the manufacturer that can weigh-in on this?
I am going to take the car to my local mechanic for a second look at this. I just bought some new 19" CL63 wheels with some fat Michelins so I don't spin the wheels quite as much on launch..
04-09-2009, 10:59 PM
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GLC 63
I have a 2003 CL600 and last July I had the front breaks, sensors and rotors replaced at the Dealership.
Parts 437.81
Supplies 11.01
LAb-Machanical 220.00
Tax 36.77
Total 705.59
Parts 437.81
Supplies 11.01
LAb-Machanical 220.00
Tax 36.77
Total 705.59
04-10-2009, 02:32 AM
#19
MBWorld Fanatic!
I kicked this off. Car has 25K on the clock. My dealer service technician observed "Front pads and rotors are below replacement thickness".
Question remains, do I really have to spend $1,100 + every time I need new brake pads or 25K miles? Seems excessive.
Is anyone out there affiliated with an MB dealer or the manufacturer that can weigh-in on this?
I am going to take the car to my local mechanic for a second look at this. I just bought some new 19" CL63 wheels with some fat Michelins so I don't spin the wheels quite as much on launch..
Question remains, do I really have to spend $1,100 + every time I need new brake pads or 25K miles? Seems excessive.
Is anyone out there affiliated with an MB dealer or the manufacturer that can weigh-in on this?
I am going to take the car to my local mechanic for a second look at this. I just bought some new 19" CL63 wheels with some fat Michelins so I don't spin the wheels quite as much on launch..
BTW, S65/CL65 brakes will fit in your new wheels. If you want a huge increase in braking performance you could consider upgrading. No better time than when you need new rotors anyway. It's night and day with respect to the stock V12 brakes.
04-10-2009, 10:22 AM
#21
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