Alright so I come from a family of Mercedes including a c, e, and S-Class and 2 ML-320s. And I am an undergrad in college right now. I made a deal with my parents that they'd buy me a daily car and help me get out of the nightmarishly unreliable Volvo S-40 T5 I bought as my first car my freshman year of college. The deal was they buy the daily and I get to buy the fun car with my own money. I want to look into buy an 03-06 CL-55 AMG or a CL-600 to be that fun car. I go to school in Connecticut and live in New Jersey so it will be the car I use on occasional trips and on weekends. I project that I'd drive it maybe 3-4 thousand miles a year and it will be stored indoors during the winter and during the week. What I want to know is before I go off saving up to buy a good one with about 60-80k miles will it blow up in my face as the Volvo did? We have a W-220 s-500 that we've had since 30,500 miles and is now at 220k. And we have a very good private mechanic that we've trusted all 6 Merc's with and soon to be 7 with my Dad's plan of a 2011 CL550 or Sl550. So will the CL-55 ever leave stranded on the road or break down once a day everyday regardless of how many miles are driven with no way to tell what's wrong with it, or will I be on a first name basis with every mechanic at my Local Mercedes Dealer getting "AMG Only" parts?

 

It going to be an awesome car to drive, and it is going to break down, occasionally require a tow, and need repairs that will cost thousands of dollars, period. If it doesn't, that is a freak and not the norm. Don't expect to drive it for years without spending thousands of dollars in repair almost every year. Sure, you may get some cheap years, but they will not be the norm. It is the way these are. If you can work on it yourself it will save you piles of money, but if you can't I'm not sure it is the best "fun" car.

 

You want a cheap fun car? Buy a Corvette, Mustang, or Camaro. They are cheap and fun. Unfortunately, even though you can get the car for 1/10th of what it cost new, the repair costs are still equal to that of a $100k+ car.

 

If you're dependent on a mechanic to maintain a W215, it will cost you dear. I've had an S600TT for four years, and if I had to pay someone, the repairs would have cost more than the car. Its not really one for starting out.


Nick

 

Yeah if I wanted something like that I would've bought that already haha. It's really that I want a fun Mercedes to use every once in a while. But thanks for the input

 

Do you really think it'd be that expensive if it's only driven 3,000 miles a year or so? My main thing is would it be easier (for the most part) to repair as things come up. My Volvo was a bad car because it never showed any signs of what its problem was. No codes, no sensors, and no fix. And I spent $2,300 with the problem only happening more often. I know no used car will ever be perfect, but that's why I have a new daily with a warranty haha.

 

Well, in three years and 19,000 miles, getting a good discount on parts, and doing everything myself except programming a key the SRS occupancy sensor, I have spent around $8-9000. I'm not talking about mod Joey, just repairs and tools, including a SDS. Figure at least 50-100% more if work was done by an Indy, and even more at the dealership paying list for parts. Also, I save a lot of money by doing things like rebuilding a valve block ($100 for fluid, filter & o-rings) vs replace ($1920 for valve block, $100+ for fluid & filter, plus my guess would be ~$300-400 in labor. Spark plugs cost me $256. Dealership charges about $1000 for a plug change on a CL65. Sunroof stops halfway to closing and opens back up, I cleaned the track and put on some light silicone grease ($0) Dealer would undoubtedly change over $100. Front brakes at the dealer? Expect to pay at least $2500, but could be closer to $4000. Or do it yourself for a small fraction of that if you know you can buy friction discs from Brembo and not replace the whole rotor & hat.

I would expect every trip to the dealer with a CL65 to be told the car needs over $10,000 in repairs/maintainance. If you don't know better (that some of it is unnecessary or can be fixed cheap, like door wiring) it would bleed you dry fast.

The CL is an awesome car, if you are willing to pay to drive one, do it, but if you are relying on someone else to tell you what it needs and are paying to have it done, it is going to be ridiculously expensive. I know some people have had their cars on the road and found them to be a lot more reliable than mine, but they are going to break, and it is going to be expensive, period.

Don't get me wrong, not selling mine anytime soon, but I need to stop typing and go out to my garage and put it together now since it has been broken down since before Labor Day. A solonoid failed on the front valve block. Got the new one for $300 below list price so it only cost 1620. Also have left over CHF-11 which cost about $20/liter at the dealership, but is a lot cheaper when you buy it on Amazon by the 20 liter jug.

 

Duly noted, I will keep this in mind. Fortunately I do have some experience working on our Mercedes on my own and we do business with our mechanic who only handles Germany and Italian Imports so we never have to pay full labor costs which is good. And dear God does my dad go through the brakes on his w220 at $1500 a pop every time he needs new ones so the prices aren't new to me. Good luck on fixing the solenoid!

 

"So will the CL-55 ever leave stranded on the road or break down once a day everyday regardless of how many miles are driven with no way to tell what's wrong with it, or will I be on a first name basis with every mechanic at my Local Mercedes Dealer getting "AMG Only" parts?"

"And we have a very good private mechanic that we've trusted all 6 Merc's with and soon to be 7 with my Dad's plan of a 2011 CL550 or Sl550"

I found the answer to your question in your question.

 

No, it won't break down all the time, but when it does it will be difficult to diagnose, and expensive to fix. The 55 isn't as risky as a 600 or 65 (which is particularly expensive), but you do need to enter ownership properly informed.

I have two V12TT's, and one has been nothing but trouble (everything went wrong), while the other has been no trouble - only a coil pack repair, parking sensor, LED indicator and consumables.

The bad one cost me about GBP 4000 over three years (and its "only" a 600), but that's doing everything myself. Having learned a lot, many of the problems are predictable and avoidable, so I'd have no hesitation getting another one, but I think many people would.

People like Matt and I are unusual, but if you're like us, you won't regret CL ownership. Just don't rush into it, and don't expect to drive it every day.

Nick

 

Undergrad here too, I'll be 20 in December. It's a hell of a car for young adults like us. The W215 V12TT was my dream car for a very long time, and that's the only reason I tolerate the abuse this car puts me through! You're unlikely to be stranded on the side of the road with the quality of the drivetrain, but there's always going to be annoying ****, ABC especially, that will send the car to your quality independent for fairly long periods of time. It'll break down sitting in your garage more than it will moving. It cannot, I repeat, CANNOT be a daily. It's the polar opposite of an econobox.

For me, it's a rare and unique platform for insane horsepower, with one of the most beautiful pillarless profiles ever. It's comfy, fast, and the world's best night cruiser. If you can keep 5k on the side every year for maintenance, and have no need to use it for daily transportation, I still would be wary. It's a labor of the utmost love, as Welwynnick said, but I doubt you'll regret it. I sure don't.

Keep in mind of your options in a W215 budget. W211 E55, E60 M5, 996 Carrera, S197 GT500, SN-95 Terminator Cobra, C5 RS6, C5 z06 Vette, 2G CTS-V, e9x m3, w204 C63. Feel free to ask me anything, I've probably gone through every decision you're about to make myself!

 

Im 22, i bought my 2006 CL55 about 7 months ago with 70k.. in excellent condition for 20k.
Last month i bought a 2004 E55 with 80k miles for the wife for 19k, from the same person.

After the initial cost of the cl55 ive dumped about 5k into performance mods and the car has never been in a shop since I've had it.. simply because i work on it myself.

5k in parts ( 300 stall converter, 180mm crank pulley, ecu tune, 82mm throttle body) would've cost me 5k + at least 10k in labor, if i had to guess..
The car is now sitting in my garage with a blown (seized) supercharger.. with 74k miles on it.
Ill never sell the car, but if i was not able to work on it myself it would be completely impractical.. and i make 6 figures a year..
Also , as someone said it is impractical to think you could use it as a reliable daily d..
I bought mine with no intention of that..
I do all my own research to troubleshoot problems and fix them.. and if you decide to buy a cl i would recommend you get very familiar with this forum, and try to learn to repair some things yourself if possible.
For me, taking the car to a dealership is of the table because i don't like things in my butt and that's all they want to do..
It seems like you know what your getting into.. and i'd say do it.. and if it ever breaks down and you decide the cost of repairs and LABOR exceed that of what the car is worth to you, remember my username, hit me up and ill come pick it up from you dirt cheap😂😂
Kenny

 

Just make sure you find one that has had maintenance done. Suspension and ignition can be a nightmare on 600. I have a a tuned cl600 that I daily drive and a highly modded 65 that I take out in cool weather. Both are headaches and costly, but hitting the gas and getting pinned in the seat eases the hurt. It's not a matter of if but when it breaks down. I would go with 55. A 600hp cl for under $15k is tough to pass up tho...

 

Sorry, guys, i have read all the gloom and doom about the CL and i have to strongly disagree based on my personal experience.

I have a 2005 CL55 and it is the best car i have ever owned and is my daily driver. I bought it 10 years ago with 20K miles and it now has 95K. I would say all in with brakes, tires, servicing and repairs I probably average about 2K to 3K per year in cost. The car is virtually bulletproof. Over 10 years the only things that have gone wrong are engine mounts, ball joints, one headlight and the rear trunk struts. Not bad.

Of course there are the normal wear and tear items such as brakes and tires and lots and lots of gas.

But when you can drive a supercar that goes from 0 to 60 in just over 4 seconds (which is what i do every day on every commute), why would you not own it.

 

Good to hear something positive once in a while.

What are the Ferrrari and Porsche like to drive in comparison?

Nick

 

Nick, that is a great question. First, the Porsche is a great mini SUV and so not comparable to a high powered coupe. It is great for what it does but it doesn't come close.

So that leaves the CL55 and the 612. On paper they are similar. In fact there is an old Car and Driver article that compares a Cl600, the 612, an Aston Martin and a Bentley:

http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...mparison-tests

This is a great article and I agree with most of it. First let me say there is very little difference between a CL600 and a CL55. My neighbor has a CL600 and personally i prefer the 55 with the supercharger over the twin turbos. So i think everything in the article that applies to the 600 is at least true with respect to the 55.

So overall i essentially own the two top cars in the article. Not a bad place to be.

Basically the article says the Ferrari wins over the Mercedes because it is a Ferrari but for all real objective reasons the Mercedes wins. The Ferrari is a great car, much more raw than the MB and the paddle shifters are fun. Also, clearly if you pull into the valet with a red Ferrari you will be noticed much more than in a grey Mercedes. However, as a daily driver, i have to say that the MB wins. For a fun weekend car, the Ferrari wins.

So overall if i had to pick just one, it would be the MB. Fortunately i dont have to choose and i drive both.

Nick, now let me ask you a question. I have been toying with the idea of getting an AM Vanquish. I notice you are a Brit and was hoping you maybe had a chance to drive one. Any thoughts or comparisons?

Thanks a lot.

Ron

 

Great article Ron. I'm sure having both a CL & the 612 is great. I wonder if the CL65 could have pulled the win over the Ferrari given it would have won in every acceleration category and has better brakes than the 600. Probably not though, sounds like the Ferrari is a lot more nimble feeling and has the wow factor of the Ferrari name. Still as a daily driver I love my CL.

 

I wouldn't count on it. Motor Trend did that exact same comparison, and rather turned the verdict upside-down, largely because they gave much more weight to the gotta-have-it and fun-to-drive factors:

http://www.motortrend.ca/en/news/lux...es-comparison/

They got some great performance figures for the CL65 (60 = 3.8, 1/4 = 11.8 @ 121), but worse on the skidpan. The story seemed to be more of the same: great performance and refinement, capable but uninvolving chassis, and boring looks

No, I'm sorry, I haven't been in an Aston Martin, but had I the means, I would buy one on looks and noise alone.

However, I have had the opportunity to drive a few Ferraris and Porsches, including the 612, and that did stand out. There are many comments about its agile steering and handling. The Ferrari has strangely fast and light steering, and it gives you the impression that you're not hauling much weight into a corner. Well, that's true, but the Merc isn't that bad either, it just feels it. It has a feeling of being stable and nose heavy, and reluctant to change direction, whereas the Ferrari is darty and responsive for such a big car, perhaps over-responsive, to the detriment of stability.

https://mbworld.org/forums/s-class-w...els-tyres.html

I'm going to take another opportunity to bang on about my third favourite subject, which is the front wheels and tires on any V12TT car. I experimented with putting rear wheels on the front, and found it very successful. I couldn't recommend it for Airmatic cars, but I think it releases a lot of previously hidden talent and enjoyment in our chassis. The steering (while still the weak link of the W215/220 IMHO) is direct and responsive, the nose dives into corners, but the tail still stays put. It's willing to change direction, but not OVER-willing like the Ferrari.

It feels like a happy state of affairs where the steering follows your inputs, the nose follows the steering, and the tail follows the nose. Its a sort of cause and effect thing, where everything happens in the right order and the right time, without getting ahead or behind itself. Its responsive without being nervous.

Even better than that, the grip is enormous (depending on the actual tires) and the handling is properly balanced. Its neutral fast or slow, and the harder you drive the faster it goes, but the inputs and responses stay the same. It's not adjustable or easy to tail-out like a great sports car, so the Ferrari and others are probably better, but it's still very talented.

With staggered wheels and tires, you wouldn't guess what lies beneath.

Nick

 

Nick, I think you and Dr. Matt are essentially saying the same thing about driving the 612. It is a much more direct feeling. I call it raw, Dr. Matt said nimble, you said agile. All that certainly makes it fun as weekend car and occasional daily driver.

But if I was only going to have only one to drive day in and day out then I would have to go with the CL. That direct feeling can get tiring after a while and, of course, there is the passenger issue. My wife strongly prefers going in my CL over my 612. The CL has a more luxurious and stable feel (though my wife has a much less scientific approach, she simply says the 612 "sucks").

Now that is not to say that the handling of the CL cannot be improved. I read your piece on wheels and tires with great interest. You really have been experimenting. Recently I did my own wheel and tire project (though much more mild than yours) and I did find significant improvement and I would say I now have the steering feel and handling right where I want them.

I went with Brabus Monoblock VI wheels and Michelin Super Sport tires as follows:

Front: 255/35ZR19 ET40(offset) 8.5 rim width

Rear: 275/30ZR19 ET35(offset) 10 rim width

Nick, I saw you played with different tire combinations. Over the last 10 years I've tried virtually everything. I will say that I am presently a huge fan of the Michelin Super Sport's. For me they are just the right combination of handling, ride, noise and longevity. I have even gone as far as to switch my 612 from Perelli's to the Super Sports. You lose something in stickiness but make up for it in all the other factors.

I also used lowering links and lowered the CL 1.5 inches. I think the height of the car is also an important factor in handling in corners. I always drive my car in sport mode with ABC suspension at its lowest level. By lowering the car a further 1.5 inches I got some very positive effects that were instantly noticeable. (It was also easy to verify by simply raising the ABC suspension and going into the same corner.)

So now I have a much "tighter and direct" feel in the steering and the feeling of the "bulk" of the car going into the corners is also greatly diminished.

At the end of the day it is all about your own personal enjoyment and no two drivers are going to be the same. For me I would say that I have my CL exactly where I want it. But to your point, you can significantly improve upon what the factory provides you to achieve what works best for you personally.

Which then leads back to the original theme of my comment. I think the CL is an incredible car and well worth the investment.

Ron

 

Whenever I put together the ingredients for my dream car, I get this list:

Four seats
Four doors
Four litres
Four valves
Four cams
Four wheel drive
Lots of cylinders
Lots of gears
Lots of power
Active suspension

And the only car that fits the bill is the Panamera. Well, I'm not going to spend that much on a car, and certainly not on an ugly one. And while Mercedes do make cars with 4WD and active suspension, they dont' make cars with BOTH.

Except that they do - the AMG ML63. And so do BMW - the X5M. And of course there's the Porsche Cayenne. I always thought of them as ridiculous, but I did a little research and found they seem to defy the laws of physics rather well.

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2015-bmw-x5-m-instrumented-test-review

http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2015-bmw-x6-m-vs-2016-mercedes-amg-gle63-s-coupe-final-scoring-performance-data-and-complete-specs-page-4

The best ones dip below 4 sec to 60, 10 sec to 100, 1/4's in the 12's, and over 0.9g lateral - 1.01g in one instance. Maybe they're not sports cars,, but they seem to defy their weight and C of G; they're seriously capable.

The formula seems to be big V8 engines with a pair of turbos, 7/8/9 speed transmission, huge wheels, tires & brakes, and active roll control suspension.

Even with their high CG, they can corner at 0.95g - better than any S-class. So as long as you can put enough rubber on the road, and keep it upright in corners, it seems you can make anything grip well. The S-class might be a limo, but it has all the right ingredients, so I think it ought to be able to do the same.

Nick