Charles Joseph

R & R the motor $1500
Piston w/rings $750
7 sets of rings $420
Rod bearings $100
Rod bolts $100
Head gaskets $80
Gaskets & sealant $50
Labor on Engine $1400

Somebody said something about getting off cheap? I don't thing so. And we still don't know what really caused this to happen.

NitrogenBalance

Ouch. No diagnosis on why it happened?? How are we sure it will not happen again once you start running the motor again? I'd be nervous.

What about finding another M113 5.5 from a wreck?? From what I understand the CLK 55's have a higher CR where other 55's don't?? so finding an E or S 5.5 motor would maybe be even better suited for the kleeman....just a thought.

Charles Joseph

Unfortunately we are not sure that it won't happen again. That is why I am taking my time and stalling on the rebuild. I am hoping to figure out the why before it gets rebuilt.

The 2002 and older 55 motors were the same. The 2003 E and S 55's were supercharged from Mercedes. Lowering my compression with only a 6-7 psi blower will kill performance.

We are still trying to figure out what happened. I am trying to find someone to test the octane rating of the gas that is currently in the car.

CynCarvin32

This is not the first Kleemann car that has broke a piston. A local car here just had the same thing along with a toasted head with damaged valves. The weakest part of a AMG engine actually is the piston. They will break with moderate detonation. So your car likely detonated and cracked the piston.

Which piston was the issue?

No one knows what happened to this car locally but I suspect it was an issue with the kleemann ECU.

Edit: I forgot to say this car was a K2 E55 so it had the built bottom end from the factory.

ProjectC55

I have to agree! This is also why MB lowered the compression(9.0:1) on the F/I motors to try and prevent this from happening!

Charles Joseph

Yes, they lower the compression, but they run twice the boost. I am only running 6-7 psi. An E55 runs 12 psi, without a pully. And yes an E55 has had problems as well.

csumt76

Sounds to me like you are pissing in the wind. I don't think you are going to find out exactly what happened in that instant.. Sounds like a poor tune on a forced induction car to me. That labor amount is pretty reasonable actually, I wouldn't be complaining too much.

Blk04cobra1

actually, if he could post up a top and side view of the piston, we could likely find out the cause. If there is pitting on the top side of the piston, then detonation likely occured. If there's signs of scorching on the skirts, then you can determine that there was too much heat being generated and smoked the piston. There's plenty of tell tale signs to determine what happened

I also agree though that the price to fix it seems reasonable, even though ive never r&r'd a MB motor before.

NitrogenBalance

Ah, thats what I didn't know. You learn something everytime you post here
Good luck with the fix.

Charles Joseph

The top and sides of the piston look just like the other 7 pistons. There is no sign of any damage, or pitting. The sides of the piston do not look scorched or discolored.

I am not complaining about the price of the rebuild or the labor. I just do not want to do this and a month later it happen again. It may be time to sell it and move on to a SL55 and leave it stock!

Charles Joseph

If it is a poor tune then Kleemann needs to address it! That is why I am pissing in to the wind! If I **** long enough I may actually hit something.

Blk04cobra1

I hear ya, but you know what Kleeman will say..."it's not our fault"...good luck with your decision and I can surely sympathize

Charles Joseph

I am not looking to blame Kleemann. I just want to try and keep this from happening again. If they need to adjust the tune then so be it. We won't know if there is a problem if I don't keep beating on someone's head with my bad piston.

PTE

If It was truely A piston that was alittle less stronger than the other 7 and just failed under the higher stresses of forced induction, It may have lasted for a much longer time as a N/A motor piston. Then replace that piston . if it was caused by a injector flow issue(Dirty pluged filter in the injector inlet Screen or tip deposits) with can cause a lean mixture on just that pistons cylinder, replace that piston & injector. The Knock sensor may not have seen that #6 cylinder go into Detonation. Which I rather doubt ! They are placed in the Y core valley , between the cylinder Banks. Right between #6 & #7 . If I remember right this motor has 30,000 plus miles on it. Get the injectors tested flowed. Number them with a paint Marker. If this motor's #6 piston died because of poor Quality fuel. Which you and I have not control over .
I would look at replacing all pistons. The rest of them were exposed to the same fuel & are are of the same age & mileage. I believe they are a Hi silicone content (13%) cast piston, which are very strong and hold there shape , no or very little expansion.{very quiet , no piston slap on cold start up}. from cold too normal running temps. BUT when they reach a high temp or heavy detonation { This could take as little as 2.5 seconds} they will fail !! Even though My motor only has 14,000 miles on it. I sent the injectors out to be flowed & cleaned , Attached is the Chart, Just call and ask for Jeff. Him & I seen a lot of burnt & damaged pistons

Charles Joseph

The injectors are being flowed by Kleemann. Replace all the pistons? At $750 each? Thats $6000 (yes 3 zeros) just for pistons.

Jrocket

WTF!!!!! A custom set of CP's are only 750 bucks.At 6k your getting reemed bad! Whos the manufacture?

MarcusF

Charles I think you're doing the right thing in leaving no stone unturned. I'd make sure the builder checks the oil jets. As the wrench is disassembling the engine, he's performing an autopsy. Like a person, every engine dies for a reason. If they check everything, something should turn up. After labeling which cylinder each came from, I’d lay all the bearings, rings, wrist pins, rods and pistons down. I’d look at colors, scratches, and odd marks. When I built Porsche motors I was taught one of the steps of a rebuild is to determine why the engine failed. One thing worse than spending $4500 on a rebuild, is spending it AGAIN. According to the press kit, your car has forged aluminum pistons. They’re expensive because they’re supposed to be very good slugs. Having a single one fail isn’t impossible, but it’s not very probable. If overtaxed, the others should all be ready to fail.

Jrocket

On top of that,I'd look closely at the top half of the rod bearings,specially on the rod/piston failure.If the motor was detonating hard the bearings will show it.

ProjectC55

But those pistons in the E55k are built for F/I. So they are definitely entirely different and purpose built. Like the ring lands maybe placed lower in the 9.0:1 pistons as compared to the N/A pistons.

How many blown motor W211 E55k's have been reported?

I think a set of aftermarket pistons like mahle ,cp,or Ross would be much cheaper and a better way to go as well!

Charles Joseph

AMG. That is what Mercedes gets for these pistons.

PTE

If you look long enough , You will find out that the pistons used in your engine by AMG are {Mahle} a world class piton manufacture. I couldn't find any statement telling they were a Forged Piston. What I did find was the statement , Special Alloy , to meet the demands of Hi temp and pressure. Being the AMG pistons are so Quiet on cold start up. Unlike a forged piston!
I'll look Farther, As so not to give any miss information. Thanks ___PTE___

Worldcarfans /Mercedes-amg Engines in Depth Quote the pistons which are made of a special material that is extremely resistant to heat and pressure.

ProjectC55

Wow that's a surprise and good to know! Guess he better look into Cp or Ross for the price. I plan on running over 25psi boost on my Talon with the Ross pistons I now have!

Jrocket

I agree.I bet Mahle makes AMG's pistons.I have a set of custom made CP's in my twin turbo motor and they were only 800.00 for the entire set!These were custom built slug to my specs and all for the price of 1 AMG piston?

Charles,do yourself and your wallet a favor and send one of your stock pistons to CP,Mahle or somebody and have them copy your specs and them have them coated.You'll be better off in the end.

I would bet the stock piston's for a non kompressor motor are the new high silicone casting that alot of the manufactures are doing.If your going to run any psi at all,get some forged and have them coated well.

spr

I would be interested to know what type of pistons the stock factory NA 55 motor are. The blown ones are likely forged. I would like to know if the regular ones are cast or hyperutectic or what???? I would also magnaflux the piston or whatever to see if you can see any fissures or whatev which might give you a clue, or for that matter check all the other pistons. If I were you with it already apart, I would replace all of the pistons with some forged ones if they are not forged etc. bumping the compression down would also be a great idea but that's a function of piston and rods etc. but you could effectively and more safely make more power then.. hence not worrying about issues.

On a side note however I spoke to the Kleemann guys when I was considering the blower. While their blower and intercooler design is more superior than the factory arguably, unless I am mistaken they are entirely lacking in how they do the fuel, spark, and boost adjustment. As I was told and may be wrong they just stick in a boost sensitive fuel pressure regulator and increase the static pressure?? Kinda sleazy. I find it interesting how their new setups wholly abandon that method. A cool way to do it is to steal an 55 blown setup and change the parameters accordingly to monitor spark, boost, and fuel and have it tuned correctly.

(Caveat) I mean no offense and might be wrong with how Kleemann does their past setups

Hopefully everything works out for you though.

ProjectC55

If that's the case then AMG has a Krazee mark up on the pistons! I would call mahle or another source and do exactly what you are saying!