410HP N/A W208 Possible?
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Joined: Jan 2010
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2001 CLK55 AMG
410HP N/A W208 Possible?
So I'm getting near the end of the road with the chasie and suspension. I have a few more things to do like cut and buff the paint and sand / polish the head lights and such. I'm starting to look at performance mods in the near future.
Our W208 CLK55 comes with 342 Horses and 376 torque. Now, if I:
-Weld on two 300 cell metal substrate primary cats (2" Piping from the headers back)
-300 metal sub secondaries (still trying to keep it cali smog passable)
-Do what Shardul did with his OEM headers (cut out the pipes inside it).
-Tune
What do you guys think that will put me at? (All HP/TRQ numbers at the crank)
Stock 342HP/376TRQ
300 Cell Primaries +10HP/10TRQ (Installed $250)
Secondaries +5HP/ 5TRQ (Installed $250)
Headers +10HP/10TRQ(Installed $250)
Tune +10HP/10TRQ(Installed $800)
Total 377HP/411TRQ(Installed$1550)
So ~35HP/35TRQ for $1550.
I need to make ~40 more horses. I may possibly get a ported and polished intake manifold which would give me a additional 10hp/10trq. So i'm still sitting at 370-380HP.
I don't want to spend $3000 on heads.
Maybe I'm not giving enough power to the parts I'm putting on?
What other options do I have?
Thanks guys!
Our W208 CLK55 comes with 342 Horses and 376 torque. Now, if I:
-Weld on two 300 cell metal substrate primary cats (2" Piping from the headers back)
-300 metal sub secondaries (still trying to keep it cali smog passable)
-Do what Shardul did with his OEM headers (cut out the pipes inside it).
-Tune
What do you guys think that will put me at? (All HP/TRQ numbers at the crank)
Stock 342HP/376TRQ
300 Cell Primaries +10HP/10TRQ (Installed $250)
Secondaries +5HP/ 5TRQ (Installed $250)
Headers +10HP/10TRQ(Installed $250)
Tune +10HP/10TRQ(Installed $800)
Total 377HP/411TRQ(Installed$1550)
So ~35HP/35TRQ for $1550.
I need to make ~40 more horses. I may possibly get a ported and polished intake manifold which would give me a additional 10hp/10trq. So i'm still sitting at 370-380HP.
I don't want to spend $3000 on heads.
Maybe I'm not giving enough power to the parts I'm putting on?
What other options do I have?
Thanks guys!
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2015.5 Volvo V60 Polestar
To be honest, I would say you are over estimating the parts.
Id say the cats combined if you are lucky is 10whp. I only increased about 5whp with my dyno tune on my 01. Maybe 5 for the header modification. So 20hp all said and done.
My 05 has the kleemann headers with deleted primaries, Kleemann tune, renntech air box with high flow filters and I would still say at max I have gain 40hp from the combo.
Id say the cats combined if you are lucky is 10whp. I only increased about 5whp with my dyno tune on my 01. Maybe 5 for the header modification. So 20hp all said and done.
My 05 has the kleemann headers with deleted primaries, Kleemann tune, renntech air box with high flow filters and I would still say at max I have gain 40hp from the combo.
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Posts: 3,589
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From: Texas
C63 507 AMG DA Car #19
I have a spare 5.5 AMG intake mani for cheap if you want it for porting/polishing.
Unfortunately or fortunately (dep on how you look at it).. these 5.5 liter amg n/a motors are pretty well optimized from the start, so you really don't get the 100HP increase with bolt-ons like many other rides.
The old 5.0 mustang of the 80's had horrible heads stock...... so you could bolt-on 100HP with h/c/i/tune. Not so with these cars.
I am "however" very curious to see what a properly set of ported heads/intake, exhaust, intake mods/cams / tune..... do when fully optimized for N/A!
It is very VERY tricky to properly port a set of heads particularly for a n/a combo where you are not simply stuffing more pressured air into the mix....... if you go too big on the ports you get lazy flow and all top end...... if you go too big on the comb chamber you change the ignition front........ and you could reduce c/r........ if you get the cyl ports out of whack it is not good....... on and on...... I've taken a die grinder to SBF heads with fair results....... I would pay (and did pay) to have my amg heads ported/polished.
GL. I respect your project goals.!
Unfortunately or fortunately (dep on how you look at it).. these 5.5 liter amg n/a motors are pretty well optimized from the start, so you really don't get the 100HP increase with bolt-ons like many other rides.
The old 5.0 mustang of the 80's had horrible heads stock...... so you could bolt-on 100HP with h/c/i/tune. Not so with these cars.
I am "however" very curious to see what a properly set of ported heads/intake, exhaust, intake mods/cams / tune..... do when fully optimized for N/A!
It is very VERY tricky to properly port a set of heads particularly for a n/a combo where you are not simply stuffing more pressured air into the mix....... if you go too big on the ports you get lazy flow and all top end...... if you go too big on the comb chamber you change the ignition front........ and you could reduce c/r........ if you get the cyl ports out of whack it is not good....... on and on...... I've taken a die grinder to SBF heads with fair results....... I would pay (and did pay) to have my amg heads ported/polished.
GL. I respect your project goals.!
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,257
Likes: 5
From: Chicago
2015.5 Volvo V60 Polestar
I have a spare 5.5 AMG intake mani for cheap if you want it for porting/polishing.
Unfortunately or fortunately (dep on how you look at it).. these 5.5 liter amg n/a motors are pretty well optimized from the start, so you really don't get the 100HP increase with bolt-ons like many other rides.
The old 5.0 mustang of the 80's had horrible heads stock...... so you could bolt-on 100HP with h/c/i/tune. Not so with these cars.
I am "however" very curious to see what a properly set of ported heads/intake, exhaust, intake mods/cams / tune..... do when fully optimized for N/A!
It is very VERY tricky to properly port a set of heads particularly for a n/a combo where you are not simply stuffing more pressured air into the mix....... if you go too big on the ports you get lazy flow and all top end...... if you go too big on the comb chamber you change the ignition front........ and you could reduce c/r........ if you get the cyl ports out of whack it is not good....... on and on...... I've taken a die grinder to SBF heads with fair results....... I would pay (and did pay) to have my amg heads ported/polished.
GL. I respect your project goals.!
Unfortunately or fortunately (dep on how you look at it).. these 5.5 liter amg n/a motors are pretty well optimized from the start, so you really don't get the 100HP increase with bolt-ons like many other rides.
The old 5.0 mustang of the 80's had horrible heads stock...... so you could bolt-on 100HP with h/c/i/tune. Not so with these cars.
I am "however" very curious to see what a properly set of ported heads/intake, exhaust, intake mods/cams / tune..... do when fully optimized for N/A!
It is very VERY tricky to properly port a set of heads particularly for a n/a combo where you are not simply stuffing more pressured air into the mix....... if you go too big on the ports you get lazy flow and all top end...... if you go too big on the comb chamber you change the ignition front........ and you could reduce c/r........ if you get the cyl ports out of whack it is not good....... on and on...... I've taken a die grinder to SBF heads with fair results....... I would pay (and did pay) to have my amg heads ported/polished.
GL. I respect your project goals.!
Super Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 724
Likes: 0
'05 CLK55, '04 CLK320
I have a spare 5.5 AMG intake mani for cheap if you want it for porting/polishing.
Unfortunately or fortunately (dep on how you look at it).. these 5.5 liter amg n/a motors are pretty well optimized from the start, so you really don't get the 100HP increase with bolt-ons like many other rides.
The old 5.0 mustang of the 80's had horrible heads stock...... so you could bolt-on 100HP with h/c/i/tune. Not so with these cars.
I am "however" very curious to see what a properly set of ported heads/intake, exhaust, intake mods/cams / tune..... do when fully optimized for N/A!
It is very VERY tricky to properly port a set of heads particularly for a n/a combo where you are not simply stuffing more pressured air into the mix....... if you go too big on the ports you get lazy flow and all top end...... if you go too big on the comb chamber you change the ignition front........ and you could reduce c/r........ if you get the cyl ports out of whack it is not good....... on and on...... I've taken a die grinder to SBF heads with fair results....... I would pay (and did pay) to have my amg heads ported/polished.
GL. I respect your project goals.!
Unfortunately or fortunately (dep on how you look at it).. these 5.5 liter amg n/a motors are pretty well optimized from the start, so you really don't get the 100HP increase with bolt-ons like many other rides.
The old 5.0 mustang of the 80's had horrible heads stock...... so you could bolt-on 100HP with h/c/i/tune. Not so with these cars.
I am "however" very curious to see what a properly set of ported heads/intake, exhaust, intake mods/cams / tune..... do when fully optimized for N/A!
It is very VERY tricky to properly port a set of heads particularly for a n/a combo where you are not simply stuffing more pressured air into the mix....... if you go too big on the ports you get lazy flow and all top end...... if you go too big on the comb chamber you change the ignition front........ and you could reduce c/r........ if you get the cyl ports out of whack it is not good....... on and on...... I've taken a die grinder to SBF heads with fair results....... I would pay (and did pay) to have my amg heads ported/polished.
GL. I respect your project goals.!
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,589
Likes: 68
From: Texas
C63 507 AMG DA Car #19
I believe shardul has a connection for 2.5-3K dep on what you get done.
Mine were in that ballpark range through MW back when I was dealing with them.
The price sounds high, but it's not as simple as local porting guy guessing on where to remove material...... I hear Shardul's heads have some serious r/d behind them..... flowbench etc..... so you know what your are getting.
I also don't know if there is a diff between a good N/A port job and a good blown port job...... someone else... chime in.
Mine were in that ballpark range through MW back when I was dealing with them.
The price sounds high, but it's not as simple as local porting guy guessing on where to remove material...... I hear Shardul's heads have some serious r/d behind them..... flowbench etc..... so you know what your are getting.
I also don't know if there is a diff between a good N/A port job and a good blown port job...... someone else... chime in.
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Posts: 1,224
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From: S.E. FLA.
05 ML-500 , 03 CLK5.5 AMG has left the Garage
The Price is right
Please keep in mind , big flow numbers are not the answer , for a street driven motor. The engine needs to have some driveability for DD . As far as pricing goes , that is what I was getting back in 07 . Here is a thread I posted a few years ago
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...___pte___.html
Cheers _PTEngineering
https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...___pte___.html
Cheers _PTEngineering
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,589
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From: Texas
C63 507 AMG DA Car #19
the way we got lower ET's in the 1/4 mile on N/A mustangs was the following:
1. Weight reduction plays a major role.
2. Tq Convertor and Gears... IF you can hook up.
3. Slicks.... it's all in the 60'. You can double the 60' reduction in the overall effect to ET. egs.... 2.3 60' cut to 2.0 60'...... can be .6 in the 1/4. etc.... these are rough.
4. After this it's about HP/TQ, and gear shift points, and tune. You don't want to cross the 1320' just after a shift to 4th gear...... you would change tire size, or gear ratio, or rev limit to avoid a gear change...... and then there is shift point..... you need to stay in the sweet spot of the tq/hp.... fortunately for us we have nice flat tq curve to play with.
All of this requires many many trips to the track to optimize the setup.
And the problem is after optimizing a street car for the lowest ET..... it's no longer an enjoyable daily driver...... skinnies are not safe for street, slicks are not safe/legal, wgt reduction comes with less safety and more noise/heat, and high stall convertor can be a pain daily driving...... so it's a trade off.
That is where the blower comes in... you can get 11 sec quarter mile performance with very little daily driver trade-offs in comfort/safety
GL.
1. Weight reduction plays a major role.
2. Tq Convertor and Gears... IF you can hook up.
3. Slicks.... it's all in the 60'. You can double the 60' reduction in the overall effect to ET. egs.... 2.3 60' cut to 2.0 60'...... can be .6 in the 1/4. etc.... these are rough.
4. After this it's about HP/TQ, and gear shift points, and tune. You don't want to cross the 1320' just after a shift to 4th gear...... you would change tire size, or gear ratio, or rev limit to avoid a gear change...... and then there is shift point..... you need to stay in the sweet spot of the tq/hp.... fortunately for us we have nice flat tq curve to play with.
All of this requires many many trips to the track to optimize the setup.
And the problem is after optimizing a street car for the lowest ET..... it's no longer an enjoyable daily driver...... skinnies are not safe for street, slicks are not safe/legal, wgt reduction comes with less safety and more noise/heat, and high stall convertor can be a pain daily driving...... so it's a trade off.
That is where the blower comes in... you can get 11 sec quarter mile performance with very little daily driver trade-offs in comfort/safety
GL.
Last edited by betrezra; Jun 14, 2012 at 01:30 PM.
Out Of Control!!
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Posts: 13,489
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haters crazy
I believe shardul has a connection for 2.5-3K dep on what you get done.
Mine were in that ballpark range through MW back when I was dealing with them.
The price sounds high, but it's not as simple as local porting guy guessing on where to remove material...... I hear Shardul's heads have some serious r/d behind them..... flowbench etc..... so you know what your are getting.
I also don't know if there is a diff between a good N/A port job and a good blown port job...... someone else... chime in.
Mine were in that ballpark range through MW back when I was dealing with them.
The price sounds high, but it's not as simple as local porting guy guessing on where to remove material...... I hear Shardul's heads have some serious r/d behind them..... flowbench etc..... so you know what your are getting.
I also don't know if there is a diff between a good N/A port job and a good blown port job...... someone else... chime in.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,862
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
MBWorld Fanatic!
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Posts: 5,475
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From: City with Tall buildings!
C43/55,2k11 Volvo S60 T6AWD,2k Audi B5 S4,95 Eagle Talon Tsi AWD 500+awhp
MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: A.D., U.A.E
2000 (W202 C200) & 2000 (W202 C55)
As i know,,
The SLK55 BS, got a adjustable sports suspension & a high performance brake system & ultra light CF front fenders &
CF roof & 100lbs weight reduction & AMGs special ECU & TCU tune.......
ZAYED,,
The SLK55 BS, got a adjustable sports suspension & a high performance brake system & ultra light CF front fenders &
CF roof & 100lbs weight reduction & AMGs special ECU & TCU tune.......
ZAYED,,
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,862
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
Which? AMG
When? Since inception.
In doing an intensive search on the engine performance upgrades on this little beast I came across a few articles that state it has tweaked AMG valve timing and some state revised AMG cams. I'm not sure if that is one in the same, though I recall one article in which AMG admits to changing the valve timing, though they advised that the engine performance increase comes largely from the long tube headers and a revised ECU. From that I take it that the valve timing was not tweaked through the ECU, but from actual revised cams. Do a search and you should come across the same info.
It has a modified AMG air intake/air box with AMG sports air filters. I can't tell the difference as it looks exactly the same as the SLK55. Perhaps the air box is slightly taller or has been reworked inside.
When? Since inception.
In doing an intensive search on the engine performance upgrades on this little beast I came across a few articles that state it has tweaked AMG valve timing and some state revised AMG cams. I'm not sure if that is one in the same, though I recall one article in which AMG admits to changing the valve timing, though they advised that the engine performance increase comes largely from the long tube headers and a revised ECU. From that I take it that the valve timing was not tweaked through the ECU, but from actual revised cams. Do a search and you should come across the same info.
It has a modified AMG air intake/air box with AMG sports air filters. I can't tell the difference as it looks exactly the same as the SLK55. Perhaps the air box is slightly taller or has been reworked inside.
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Posts: 1,862
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
I got 400hp up from 355hp from my 55 N/A in my SLK55. 
Mods are:
- PTE cams, titanium retainers
- Evosport longtube headers
- Evosport full exhaust (Race cats, X-pipe, resonators)
We got great gains from these mods. I know I can get more if I go with a larger airbox, throttle body, and modify the intake manifold. Perhaps I'll do that at a later date.
Check out my build thread and see it on the dyno!
https://mbworld.org/forums/slk55-r17...ond-amg-3.html
Mods are:
- PTE cams, titanium retainers
- Evosport longtube headers
- Evosport full exhaust (Race cats, X-pipe, resonators)
We got great gains from these mods. I know I can get more if I go with a larger airbox, throttle body, and modify the intake manifold. Perhaps I'll do that at a later date.
Check out my build thread and see it on the dyno!
https://mbworld.org/forums/slk55-r17...ond-amg-3.html
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,862
Likes: 5
From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
I had a specific look in mind for it and I have to admit, it came together great and looks sporty yet classy. That little beast is such a pleasure to drive. My girl drives it mostly and she said that it's such a chick magnet!
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 5,475
Likes: 5
From: City with Tall buildings!
C43/55,2k11 Volvo S60 T6AWD,2k Audi B5 S4,95 Eagle Talon Tsi AWD 500+awhp
Which? AMG
When? Since inception.
In doing an intensive search on the engine performance upgrades on this little beast I came across a few articles that state it has tweaked AMG valve timing and some state revised AMG cams. I'm not sure if that is one in the same, though I recall one article in which AMG admits to changing the valve timing, though they advised that the engine performance increase comes largely from the long tube headers and a revised ECU. From that I take it that the valve timing was not tweaked through the ECU, but from actual revised cams. Do a search and you should come across the same info.
It has a modified AMG air intake/air box with AMG sports air filters. I can't tell the difference as it looks exactly the same as the SLK55. Perhaps the air box is slightly taller or has been reworked inside.
When? Since inception.
In doing an intensive search on the engine performance upgrades on this little beast I came across a few articles that state it has tweaked AMG valve timing and some state revised AMG cams. I'm not sure if that is one in the same, though I recall one article in which AMG admits to changing the valve timing, though they advised that the engine performance increase comes largely from the long tube headers and a revised ECU. From that I take it that the valve timing was not tweaked through the ECU, but from actual revised cams. Do a search and you should come across the same info.
It has a modified AMG air intake/air box with AMG sports air filters. I can't tell the difference as it looks exactly the same as the SLK55. Perhaps the air box is slightly taller or has been reworked inside.
Last edited by ProjectC55; Jul 11, 2012 at 01:31 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
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Posts: 1,862
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From: Sin City
2005 E55 AMG - - 2005 SL55 AMG - - - - - - 2006 SLK55 AMG - - - - - - 2013 Ducati Diavel AMG -
Yea I saw the info on revised valve timing but I'll bet your slk55 is faster than the black series SLK. Im still debating on whether to get the pte cams due to other priorities but did you find the cams made an appreciable difference? I was not happy with the Kleeman Cams plus I did not get the software since at the time Cory said he could not do my car.
The PTE cams do pull slightly more at high RPMs. HP and TQ continues to grow at higher RPMs compared to stock. The stock RPMs seem to flat line at 5800-6000 RPMs, whereas the PTE cams doesn't drop off as drastic. If you look at my dyno chart you'll notice the HP doesn't drop off as much as stock from 5750 RPMs to 6500 RPMs. Also the TQ continues to pull to 5000 RPMs, unlike stock which falls off at 4500 RPMs.
As you know, the Kleeman cams are milder so you would definitely need intake and exhaust mods to help see a gain. And without software the cams are a marginal gain if that.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 7,053
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From: A.D., U.A.E
2000 (W202 C200) & 2000 (W202 C55)
By the way: do you have an idea if possible to put the E55k/SL55k/CL55k/S55K or SLK55 oil cooler with filter housing to the W202 C43 or C55,, im thinking
to do that cause they have an External cooler......!!
ZAYED,,
to do that cause they have an External cooler......!!
ZAYED,,
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,257
Likes: 5
From: Chicago
2015.5 Volvo V60 Polestar
Thanks, but more like neck and neck since my SLK55 is still heavier. All told, the extensive use of carbon fiber, the absence of the standard car's retractable hardtop and the lighter wheels lead to a total net weight savings of around 100 lbs. for the Black Series. If I had some intake mods then I'm sure it would be faster.
The PTE cams do pull slightly more at high RPMs. HP and TQ continues to grow at higher RPMs compared to stock. The stock RPMs seem to flat line at 5800-6000 RPMs, whereas the PTE cams doesn't drop off as drastic. If you look at my dyno chart you'll notice the HP doesn't drop off as much as stock from 5750 RPMs to 6500 RPMs. Also the TQ continues to pull to 5000 RPMs, unlike stock which falls off at 4500 RPMs.
As you know, the Kleeman cams are milder so you would definitely need intake and exhaust mods to help see a gain. And without software the cams are a marginal gain if that.
The PTE cams do pull slightly more at high RPMs. HP and TQ continues to grow at higher RPMs compared to stock. The stock RPMs seem to flat line at 5800-6000 RPMs, whereas the PTE cams doesn't drop off as drastic. If you look at my dyno chart you'll notice the HP doesn't drop off as much as stock from 5750 RPMs to 6500 RPMs. Also the TQ continues to pull to 5000 RPMs, unlike stock which falls off at 4500 RPMs.
As you know, the Kleeman cams are milder so you would definitely need intake and exhaust mods to help see a gain. And without software the cams are a marginal gain if that.
