lsb

OK, a beer it is then. PM me and we'll sort it.

Doctodd33

since my post got lost......does everyone's BS automatically downshift when decelerating?

LZH

Yes, in C and S mode but obviously not in M.

JDB

All of the cars downshift (in the two automatic modes "S" & "C"), as long as the engine speed goes low enough. In that European AMG I drove, the downshifts occurred with just a minimal amount of deceleration, keeping the engine revs up in the power band at all times.

What people were looking for regarding the CLK63 Black Series Transmissions was the "rev-matching" on downshifting, similar to what the SL63 does. I also think that there were videos floating around the internet of that special factory prepared white CLK63 Black Series at Laguna Seca. The sound track definitely sounded as though that vehicle was equipped with the a "rev-matching" transmission.

JDB

1SICKLEX

Great pics of that beast on the track! Thanks for sharing!

WTDoom

yes . very aggressively in s . keeps revs high also .

+1

thank you

grussell

Seriously, the BS is way too heavy to be an effective track car. It was a Cafe racer buit by MB for the street. If it was 500lbs lighter it would be a serious machine and I would have kept mine. Not to mention the slush box transmission that is about as quick as a snail.

The GT3RS is a far better track car and can walk away from a BS on the track in the hands of a talented driver. I would rather drive a BS as a DD though.

I have run 1:24.xx at WSIR in my track prepped GT3RS for 15+ laps. I have seen stock GT3's run 1:30's so 1:33 is good for the BS but overall it's not a great time and you couldn't do it lap after lap. at 4,000lbs it's just too heavy

WTDoom

i use my rs and my 993 rsr road legal racer on the track mostly.
but , as a car you can drive fast on the open road and powerslide at will , rare , great looking brilliant build quality with the capability for the occasional track day ( great for driving to the ring and doing a few ) and still with creature comforts/ good enough to drive into the city for meetings etc the black series is unbeatable .
also i love the fact that its a true enthusiasts car and is almost invisible to the non believers .
i sold my ferrari 599 for my first clk black series ( thats how much i ENJOY the black ).
i have been blessed with the choice of many supercars the last few years and i rate the black ( for FUN ) very very near the top . there are faster there are more expensive , more extravagant but few more fun . its so lively and slideable and has the bonus of still being fun at lower speeds also .
like it i do . good it is . i pity the fool

Jim Brady

Grussell,
I'm not going to question your track prowess, as you bested my 10 year old record in POC NI. Of course the track now has curbs. I haven't seen a "stock" 7gt3 run better than a 1:33 but it's posssible but some perpared cars on Hoosiers have been much faster. I have run several in various club settings with competent club drivers and it's a close race.

I don't think anyone would suggest the BS is a race car, but rather a capable street car that can be tracked with no fuss or concern over the reliability.
I believe that it is far easier for the average club guy to drive the BS faster than either the 7Gt3rs or 7GT3. For DE days the 20 minute sessions isn't a time trial, it's about fun. I've driven both and the BS is just more fun.

grussell

And we both know those curbs help a lot

The 7GT3's and RS's that I have seen run in the low 30's have all been on Hoosiers or Toyos. I haven't seen any fast cars at the big track on the crap Michelins that come on the car. I run mine on RA-1's.

When do you plan of taking your BS to the track again? I would love to come play.

Garrett

Doctodd33

sounds like a challenge......dont forget to video

LZH

The 33 I ran in my BS was on the stock R compound Corsas. With Hoosiers and some suspension work I have no doubt I would be in the mid 20's.

grussell

I call BS on that one.... Maybe and only maybe if you gut it, change all of the suspension and put slicks on it will you get into the 1:25.xx's

Let me know when you try, I would like to be there.

Jim Brady

Agree 100% re Michelins. Sam Hubinette's less than steller drive in a 7Gt3 backed porschephiles in a corner.
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/H...GT3_202155.htm
Not trying to strart a war but the 1:36.5 was
a hard pill to swallow. I think think that somebody got the set up way wrong.

Looks like October track day when it cools from the 105-110 in Aug thru. Sept. Stay tuned well get a few of the BS out to WSIR along with some F430's

FWIW, I've seen JrCarts BS and on the track it is a sub 1:30 car.
Jimmy

LZH

Exactly, and he actually added weight to it.
As far as Sam's GT3 run on the big track...not impressed at all. But, what do you expect from a drifter ?
I'll see ya out there in the Fall, Jimmy. The heat is keeping me on the Ocean

WTDoom

my experiences here in europe would seem to suggest on most euro tracks the gt3 rs is faster than a bs (both running a non tuned engine ) . i think im right in saying that our euro RS models are lighter and more aggressive than the us versions , so im not sure if that makes a difference . it looks like the bs has more potential to be tuned ( the engine is much less stressed than the RS unit ) but it would be interesting to see if the bs can overcome its weight disadvantage . especially if you dump the pasm on the rs .
fascinating .

c32AMG-DTM

Really? I know adding the rollbar added a fair bit of weight, but I thought he more than made up for that with the Dymags, CF buckets, exhaust, and myriad other weight savings measures.

While I enjoy watching Sammy in his natural environment, and he certainly is a pro racer, I agree with LZH that a professional drift racer may not be the best measuring stick for turning a quick laptime. Surely some pro-level "grip" racing talent has driven a well-prepped 997 GT3RS(R) around WSIR at some point, no?

In any event, both are quite capable for dual purpose cars - sounds like most agree the 997GT3RS might be somewhat quicker in the right hands, and that the CLK63BS would probably be quicker for the majority of everyone else because of being easier to drive at/near the limit. Naturally, of course, also depending on the track. Is that a fair assessment?

BTW - OP, both of your cars are beautiful - thanks for sharing pics of your experiences!

WTDoom

thank you thats very kind .

agree about the black being faster for the average driver though but definitely not for the experienced porsche driver

LZH

You may be right. Here is the most recent quote from him that I could find about the overall weight of his car.

I do not think he ever got the CF driveshaft done. I did however, get a chance to drive his car on the big track and I can tell you this; it was an absolute track beast. To suggest you need to take 500 lbs out of the stock BS for it to be a competitive track car is not accurate. When I drove Jims car the seat would not move, it was in a fixed position that was way too far back for my taste on th track. I could barely reach the pedals...Anyway, I was hesitant to push it plus I had Jims added weight running shotgun. With that being said, one of Jims buddies timed one of my laps and it was a 37. I was going through 8 at just over 120mph...
I might also note that he was running the Corsas as well and had some ECU issues with his tune that day. So, I am very confident that his car....sorted out and on Hoosiers could very well dip into the low 20's on the big track.
Lastly, I agree that a stock BS is pretty easy for the novice to drive quickly. The amount of mechanical grip this car has is excellent and it really hides it weight in the corners. However, the suspension and wheel mods to Jims car made it VERY difficult to drive quickly. It was able to hide it's weight even better han a stock BS, but I could tell that if pushed hard, all that "hidden" weight could bite you the *** VERY quickly and without much warning at all. His car was the real deal on the track and demanded attention, respect and talent if pushed to the limit.

grussell

Now we are down to low 20's in a 3800lb street car........

If anyone can run a sub 1:30 in a street legal BS on R comps, you have my utmost respect!

LZH

I never said I ran, or, that a BS on R comps COULD run sub 1:30. I simply said that the best I could manage was a 33, bone stock in R comps. Further, I drove another members (Jrcart) highly modified BS on the same track and running maybe 5/10ths was able to EASILY run a 1:37. I have no doubt that Jrcart's BS with Hoosiers could run mid 20's and my stock BS with the same rubber would be high 20's. But that begs the question....

Did you ever run your BS on the Big track ?

Jim Brady

Well....with this aero package it will be a piece of cake.
http://www.mercedes-amg.com/privatel...ead.php?t=4241

WTDoom

can someone post pics please have no access with a euro vin

c32AMG-DTM

It's pictures of the CLK "Ring & track taxi" racer. Check the "SL65 at Laguna Seca" thread and you'll see some pics of it.


Photo credit: MJ50

LZH - when you say "Hoosiers" do you mean a full slick race tire, or do you mean R6's? If the latter... are Hoosier's R6 R Comps worth ~10-15 seconds per lap vs. Pirelli's Corsa R Comps at WSIR? You seem to have a lot of track experience, so don't take my post as doubting, but you seem to be pretty cavalierly throwing out a huge laptime reduction by theoretically switching to a different R Compound tire (if you're talking R6's).

otoupalik

Sorry I am late to this thread. I see many of my customers and friends have picked up a lot of the slack! Thanks Sacha, Jim and Luke. As I have been intimately involved in all things track related at evosport (including the race program and the CLK63 chassis dev) I will pipe in.

The alignment is CRITICAL to get the car to handle. You need to get with a talented tuner shop that understands the way a car should be set-up. The number one variable that needs to be addressed first is rear toe. The car needs more rear toe than factory settings. This gives you FAR more rear grip on throttle application.

Well, having run in the 20's at willow in a bunch of cars (porsche, ferrari, bmw, radical, etc), I will tell you that the BS IS a 20 second car. A street legal car is a high 20's car. I did 31's in JRCart's car with a passenger going 9/10ths. Luke and Jim Brady were there that day. Alone in the car with a 10/10th run, it would be 29's at least.

Now, that is YEARS away from 25's or 22's.

Now, if Luke and I get our way, we will have a low 20's BS to show everyone one day!

Agreed on JRCart's for sure.

Yes, it is surprising to say the least. I love driving a "star" and giving people all kinds of shock. That is also why we bring BMW's to POC! It is fun to put a BMW in the top 10 in qualifying at Willow or CA Speedway in the fast group. The fast P-car guys are always shocked to see it. In fact, in qualifying, most never want to let our cars in the fast line for the out lap even though we are able to put the top5 - top10 time down. lol.

Thanks
Brad

PS - I see you have Lauren running your POC car? He is a great guy.