newbie question about "check engine electronics"
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Junior Member
Joined: Jul 2007
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From: alabama
1997 mercedes e300d
newbie question about "check engine electronics"
I have a 97 e300d. I noticed sometimes that when I accelerate, the car will suddenly downshift and then surge forward. I know it's not supposed to do lurch forward and I am concerned I am going to accelerate in traffic and smash into someone's tail end. I am not sure what the cause is, but the guy I take my car to said he thought it was the resonance valve (It leaks from 100-200psi).
Last week, I was driving under normal conditions and stepped on the gas and the "check engine electronics" lights came on. I took it to the mechanic and he reset the codes (there were no faults listed). It happened again the other day upon simple acceleration out of a driveway into traffic. The car didn't surge forward or anything, but the lights came on.
I asked the mechanic to order the valve (around $350 for the part and labor), but I am thinking it is something electrical in the tiptronic transmission or in some electrical switch.
Has anyone heard of anythig like this happening. I am totally perplexed and have searched this forum and others hoping to find a similar problem, yet nothing has been found. I'd really appreciate your input. I'm learning alot from this forum and this is my first Mercedes.
Last week, I was driving under normal conditions and stepped on the gas and the "check engine electronics" lights came on. I took it to the mechanic and he reset the codes (there were no faults listed). It happened again the other day upon simple acceleration out of a driveway into traffic. The car didn't surge forward or anything, but the lights came on.
I asked the mechanic to order the valve (around $350 for the part and labor), but I am thinking it is something electrical in the tiptronic transmission or in some electrical switch.
Has anyone heard of anythig like this happening. I am totally perplexed and have searched this forum and others hoping to find a similar problem, yet nothing has been found. I'd really appreciate your input. I'm learning alot from this forum and this is my first Mercedes.
MBWorld Fanatic!
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
If your
Cel came on and he cleared it,there was a code.Now get it read at autozone etc. for free and write down what the stored code was,even if the light went out it wont clear from pending status until several clear drive cycles.Read the codes......
Might be a transmission related code,is the sudden lurch similar to kickdown when you go into passing gear?Or is it an abnormal change in the cars shifting?Try to be even more descriptive than you have already been ,as to what it's doing,and then get those codes.....
ohlord
"GOT CODES?"
Might be a transmission related code,is the sudden lurch similar to kickdown when you go into passing gear?Or is it an abnormal change in the cars shifting?Try to be even more descriptive than you have already been ,as to what it's doing,and then get those codes.....
ohlord
"GOT CODES?"
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 65
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From: alabama
1997 mercedes e300d
check engin electronics
I will go to Autozone. The mechanic, who is a former Mercedes dealer mechanic plugged it into his computer and did the diagnostics test. It did have one fault, but is was not related to the transmission.
As I accelerate normally, the car downshifts and revs up to around 5000rpm, almost redlining. but I'm not going fast so I find it odd that it would rev that high. Most of the time it scares the bejesus out of me so I really have only seen the tachometer once, usually I am looking ahead, just in case.
I spoke with the mechanic again yesterday and he is sticking with the resonance valve. The car is not running smoothly from 3000-3500rpm, it almost feels like it is missing but it is not missfiring, I'd hear that sputtering noise if it were.
We looked at the valve controller on top of the resonance valve and every so often it would move wildly. We put a suction pump and applied pressure. The readings were consistant over 200 psi, but right below 200psi, the needle indicated a leak. The mechanic told me that sometimes the valve leaks and that would cause a number of behaviors, including the surging???
MB of Nashville said it would be here today and if that takes care of the problem I am very happy, if not, then we'll try something else.
The question I have is "why does the check engine electrnics light come on when simply accelerating? The light came on under normal driving conditions and the car did not surge forward. The surging has only happened about 6 times in the past 2 months, and thank GOD I was not in traffic when it happened. I usually let off the gas immediately, but it happens quickly.
As I accelerate normally, the car downshifts and revs up to around 5000rpm, almost redlining. but I'm not going fast so I find it odd that it would rev that high. Most of the time it scares the bejesus out of me so I really have only seen the tachometer once, usually I am looking ahead, just in case.
I spoke with the mechanic again yesterday and he is sticking with the resonance valve. The car is not running smoothly from 3000-3500rpm, it almost feels like it is missing but it is not missfiring, I'd hear that sputtering noise if it were.
We looked at the valve controller on top of the resonance valve and every so often it would move wildly. We put a suction pump and applied pressure. The readings were consistant over 200 psi, but right below 200psi, the needle indicated a leak. The mechanic told me that sometimes the valve leaks and that would cause a number of behaviors, including the surging???
MB of Nashville said it would be here today and if that takes care of the problem I am very happy, if not, then we'll try something else.
The question I have is "why does the check engine electrnics light come on when simply accelerating? The light came on under normal driving conditions and the car did not surge forward. The surging has only happened about 6 times in the past 2 months, and thank GOD I was not in traffic when it happened. I usually let off the gas immediately, but it happens quickly.
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
Post that
Code,and the stored codes if any.5000 rpm burst in the diesel is wild!That thing is a torque monster ,so i can see why you get scared...Code is for some reason,so even if not related to the problem,you need to fix it.
ohlord
"GOT CODES?"
ohlord
"GOT CODES?"
Member
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From: Weymouth, MA
1997 E300D
I'm pretty sure your mechanic is spot on, its a common issue with surging and the resonance flaps. His scanner is also more than likely far more accurate than the ones at AutoZone, as the AZ ones give a generic OB2 code which could be one of ~6 MB specific codes. More than likely you're getting P0120 or P0200, TPS and Injector circuit malfunction.
Just have your Indy fix it
Just have your Indy fix it
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 65
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From: alabama
1997 mercedes e300d
newbie question about "check engine electronics"
The part is in. The guy I take my car to is reasonable, seems to be a smart mechanic, and stangely, does't take offense to me looking into forums for answers.?
I do appreciate all the help and answers on this forum, THANK YOU!
I have replaced the blower motor with instructions on this site, thanks again, and also replaced the belt on my blower motor in front of the radiator, so thanks to all that help.
I hope and pray that takes care of the issue. I'll let y'all know the outcome.
I do appreciate all the help and answers on this forum, THANK YOU!
I have replaced the blower motor with instructions on this site, thanks again, and also replaced the belt on my blower motor in front of the radiator, so thanks to all that help.
I hope and pray that takes care of the issue. I'll let y'all know the outcome.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 65
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From: alabama
1997 mercedes e300d
newbie question about "check engine electronics"
Part replaced, cost $325 including labor. The problem has not reared its ugly head, but the rpms still fluctuate, now around 2400rmp, maybe 100-200rpm when operating at a constant speed. I guess now I have a new problem. Any guesses?
Thank you ohlord and Zachb for contributing.
Thank you ohlord and Zachb for contributing.
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Member
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 135
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From: Weymouth, MA
1997 E300D
Try heading over to Mercedesshop.com a lot of guys over there now the diesels...
http://mercedesshop.com/shopforum/forumdisplay.php?f=15
Zack
http://mercedesshop.com/shopforum/forumdisplay.php?f=15
Zack
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Newbie
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 14
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From: Suffolk County Long Island
1997 E300D
I just bought my 1997 e300d used (100282 miles - a baby) in July and apart from investing a couple thousand on stuff - new tires, a/c recharge, new stereo etc, I just got whacked with transmission problems with under 3000 miles of my driving it. Brand new tranny @ 103,000 miles at the advice of my mechanic who said his experience with rebuilt ones is poor. The a/c system will require replacing in the spring - a pretty long job from what he's telling me. There had been no indications of tranny trouble prior - it just went. Cost labor and parts $5000. Ouch. Estimated cost of replacing the a/c $3-$4000. Ouch again. Ouch ouch ouch. Still averaging 31mpg though...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 6,171
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
Time to get
rid of it.$9grand in repairs you could buy a 99gasser or find a better condition diesel.
why be a glutton for punishment?Strip out any money you put into it and use them on the new rig.
There is a point when you have to cut and run.
You might get 4k for the junker if you are lucky
bite the bullet.
ohlord
Used trans would be less money,they are out there and 4grand for a/c rebuild?what is he doing replacing everything but the kitchen sink?
Run!!!
Just read the post again,you did the trans?5grand!!!
try it sell it now as a car that needs a/c work maybe you can find someone that wants it and can do the a/c.Get out and away from that car,and next time inspect,inspect,inspect.
why be a glutton for punishment?Strip out any money you put into it and use them on the new rig.
There is a point when you have to cut and run.
You might get 4k for the junker if you are lucky
bite the bullet.
ohlord
Used trans would be less money,they are out there and 4grand for a/c rebuild?what is he doing replacing everything but the kitchen sink?
Run!!!
Just read the post again,you did the trans?5grand!!!
try it sell it now as a car that needs a/c work maybe you can find someone that wants it and can do the a/c.Get out and away from that car,and next time inspect,inspect,inspect.
Last edited by ohlord; Oct 14, 2007 at 03:06 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 291
Likes: 0
From: Vancouver
E320
I actually took my car and have it checked. The codes are in my car, but my mechanic said the problem is most likely:
Air Mass Flow Sensor
Both Oxygen sensor
He told me the signal was really strong for these two sensors. Most likely its them causing the problem. I will post the codes up later.
Air Mass Flow Sensor
Both Oxygen sensor
He told me the signal was really strong for these two sensors. Most likely its them causing the problem. I will post the codes up later.
Senior Member
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 291
Likes: 0
From: Vancouver
E320
Codes
Thanks ohlord,
The codes are here:
010 HOT FILM AIR MASS SENSOR
036 LAMDA CONTROL
P0101 HOT FILM AIR MASS
I don't have a clue what they mean, but it sounds like if I leave it any longer, it could get serious. ohlord and other w210ers, do you guys know where I can get these parts apart from the dealer? They cost over $800 for the Air Mass Sensor and around $300 each for the Oxygen Sensor too. In addition, does anyone know how to replace these sensors? Thank you all very much for your time and kindness.
The codes are here:
010 HOT FILM AIR MASS SENSOR
036 LAMDA CONTROL
P0101 HOT FILM AIR MASS
I don't have a clue what they mean, but it sounds like if I leave it any longer, it could get serious. ohlord and other w210ers, do you guys know where I can get these parts apart from the dealer? They cost over $800 for the Air Mass Sensor and around $300 each for the Oxygen Sensor too. In addition, does anyone know how to replace these sensors? Thank you all very much for your time and kindness.
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 299
Likes: 15
From: Boston, MA
2002 E320 4matic 92K (bought 12/20/06). 2000 E430 4matic (RIP 12/9/06) :(
4ra4y, they may be DIY items, but ohlord says everything is DIY 
as some of us are uncomfortable trying DIY stuff, read a thorough DIY here or at benzworld.org (if one exists), then buy the parts (try autohausaz.com, benzbin.com, stopshopanddrive.com, bmaparts.com, etc. - just NOT the dealer!). If you don't want to tackle it on your own, take it to your indie to do.
as some of us are uncomfortable trying DIY stuff, read a thorough DIY here or at benzworld.org (if one exists), then buy the parts (try autohausaz.com, benzbin.com, stopshopanddrive.com, bmaparts.com, etc. - just NOT the dealer!). If you don't want to tackle it on your own, take it to your indie to do.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 6,171
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
MAF and O2 sensor
Are well within the realm of any diy'r.A few bucks in tools for the proper o2 socket and a few extensions added to any basic tool kit.I'm not telling him to rebuild a trans,just a few simple diy jobs.
Senior Member
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 291
Likes: 0
From: Vancouver
E320
ohlord
OK GUYS, I FINALLY MANAGED TO ACTUALLY RECORD THE CEL PROBLEM I'M EXPERIENCING. CAN ANYONE PLEASE ADVISE ME WHAT TO DO.
BTW, I'M NOT STEPPING ON THE ACCELERATION! I JUST TURNED THE CAR ON AND IT WAS REACTING LIKE THIS BY ITSELF. I JUST RECORDED THIS PROBLEM WITH MY PHONE. SORRY FOR THE POOR QUALITY.
LINK:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVWY6J36I_w
Thank you everyone for watching the link and your advise.
BTW, I'M NOT STEPPING ON THE ACCELERATION! I JUST TURNED THE CAR ON AND IT WAS REACTING LIKE THIS BY ITSELF. I JUST RECORDED THIS PROBLEM WITH MY PHONE. SORRY FOR THE POOR QUALITY.
LINK:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVWY6J36I_w
Thank you everyone for watching the link and your advise.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 6,171
Likes: 16
300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
forget the codes
on the dash,get the codes scanned with a scanner,port under the dash and post them.could be several things,vacuum leak,dead maf,bad o2 sensor.etc.
"GOT CODES?"
"GOT CODES?"
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
From: alabama
1997 mercedes e300d
check engine electronics
OK it was the Resonance Intake Valve that was causing sputtering and surging. The valve was replaced by the dealer who disgnosed the problem, then screwed up the electronics royally.
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 299
Likes: 15
From: Boston, MA
2002 E320 4matic 92K (bought 12/20/06). 2000 E430 4matic (RIP 12/9/06) :(
I dunno, O2 sensors? I don't have a lift and just jacking it up might not do the trick. No idea where they are even located. Would love to do this myself on my wife's VW but not really willing to unless it's easily accessible, and I'm told they are not. The VW has an 80K emissions warranty so it may be covered; still have to see about that once I get the vag-com reading. Where are the O2's on the benz? Is there a DIY posted?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 6,171
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
pre cat
are from under the hood with proper socket and extensions.Heavy duty ramps from walmart if you need to get at the post cats o2 sensors.Autohausaz.com for the sensors and if not done due to failure and the common codes,they are 80tho mile maint items for the to do list.Diy most likely on benzworld.org w210 diy section or mercedesshop.com diy section,proper socket and a little common sense with the wires and the job is not hard.
