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The dreaded M272 Balance Shaft

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E-Class (W211) 2003-2009

The dreaded M272 Balance Shaft

 
Old 07-24-2012, 05:59 PM
  #26  
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Fila I am still not sure if the V8 model is affected, have you found anything?
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Old 08-01-2012, 05:54 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by bmw87us View Post
Thanks for the reply. Since I'm not experiencing any problems with performance or handling I'm not going to take it in and have it disassembled. I work in marketing and just don't have the time to deal with a motor tear down, phone calls to MBUSA etc etc. Unless it goes kaputt, I'm going to keep on driving it. If I had a gun to my head I would be willing to bet that the job has already been done. There are a few telltale signs that the motor has been removed (despite a clean 2 owner carfax) such as lower front facia misalignment, scars on the engine mount bolts etc. Besides, according to my research, if the problem is just now occurring with the shaft, it would set a record for most miles before gear failure. I do however have a 3000 mile powertrain warranty with the lot I bought it from. I have 1900 miles to go on it. So I will keep my fingers crossed.
You may want to check and make sure the engine number of the engine in the car is the engine the car was born with.
Also, have the oil drained and inspect it with a magnet. If there is any metal in it, with the CEL and cam codes then you got a bad balance shaft. Wish and hope all you like but if it walks like a duck quacks like a duck and poos like a duck.... then it's a DUCK !!!
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Old 08-02-2012, 04:55 AM
  #28  
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My W164 ML350 2005 has this issue, the CEL has been on since February and it's done 133k miles. First thing to note is that the engine runs absolutely fine, starts OK and does the same MPG as it ever did. The light actually came on at around 125k miles - I have had the car from new (with dealer service history) and there has been no previous repair to the balance shaft.

Yesterday I had the four Camshaft Timing Control Solenoids (20/$33 each and 60/$99 to fit) replaced with the revised part as per the Mercedes bulletin and the CEL light went out.

For all of six minutes

There may possibly be an issue with the Camshaft Position Sensors, but they are quite expensive to fit in the hope that changes things and the codes point to constant camshaft adjustment ergo it is almost certain the sprocket is worn.

There is a simple way to check this - you need to remove the Camshaft Position Sensors and align the balancer (305) to front cover pointer. Once done, you should see stamped numbers in a circular pattern on the Impulse Wheels and they should align exactly with the holes. Mine didn't - they were adrift on the LH bank by a margin & this apparently is where the chain tension is, so the problem shows up there first.

An independent can do the repair for 1.6k/$2.6k to 2k/$3.3k - a dealer more like 4k/$6.6k as it's lots of hours labour.

My heap of junk is off to an auction next week so it becomes somebody else's problem

Last edited by bobmedley; 08-02-2012 at 05:03 AM.
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Old 11-06-2012, 09:06 AM
  #29  
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Update: Got the estimate for over $9K including new manifold. Now I have to see what MBUSA will do if anything, find an indy that can do it if MBUSA won't help or install a used engine outside the affected range.

How hard is it to replace the manifold and why would it need replacing? Does it crack or is it a gasket/vacuum leak issue? It just started to hunt at idle.

Thoughts?

Complaint:Engine light on,Idles rough
and engine reving
Parts list:Intake manifold 1150.00
Balance shaft* 550.00.
Timing chain** 395.00
Spark plugs****** 210.00
Intake gaskets20.50
Air filters************ 88.00
Times 2 oil & filter change 240.00
Cam plugs********* 40.00
Engine mounts375.00
Trans mount***** 95.00
Poly belt*************** 110.00
Belt tensioner* **245.00
Idler pulley********* 95.00
Total*********************** 3613.50
Tax******************************* 252.95
Parts total************ 3866.45
Labor************************ 5200.00
Grand total********** 9066.45
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Old 11-06-2012, 09:17 AM
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Not sure why the Intake Manifold would need replacing for the Balance Shaft issue. Perhaps someone on here can offer their opinion on that, unless yours just went bad ... but I am fairly certain, Intake Manifold is completely unrelated to Balance Shaft failure. May I ask how many miles you have on your vehicle?
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Old 11-06-2012, 09:52 AM
  #31  
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'98 E320, '93 400E, '14 AUDI tt
DO NOT let the local dealer do this repair, unless it is a warranty of course. They will sell you anything they think they can get away with. Find a good indy locally....but make sure they have replaced a balancing shaft (or 2) before.
Do the math and look at their labour charge $5200 ! ridiculous.
That works out to 40hrs, plus or minus based on hourly rates......at $100/hr it's 52 hours !!
It's a 12 hour job MAX by someone who knows what they are doing.
5200 should be the high side on the compete repair.
Good luck with MBUSA....in Canada they will do nothing. NOTHING.
I will never buy another Mercedes based on the way they have handled this issue alone.
Get your car away from that dealer, run...don't walk!

Last edited by Brian McL; 11-06-2012 at 09:58 AM.
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Old 11-06-2012, 10:06 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by a930rocket View Post
Update: Got the estimate for over $9K including new manifold. Now I have to see what MBUSA will do if anything, find an indy that can do it if MBUSA won't help or install a used engine outside the affected range.

How hard is it to replace the manifold and why would it need replacing? Does it crack or is it a gasket/vacuum leak issue? It just started to hunt at idle.

Thoughts?

Complaint:Engine light on,Idles rough
and engine reving
Parts list:Intake manifold 1150.00
Balance shaft* 550.00.
Timing chain** 395.00
Spark plugs****** 210.00
Intake gaskets20.50
Air filters************ 88.00
Times 2 oil & filter change 240.00
Cam plugs********* 40.00
Engine mounts375.00
Trans mount***** 95.00
Poly belt*************** 110.00
Belt tensioner* **245.00
Idler pulley********* 95.00
Total*********************** 3613.50
Tax******************************* 252.95
Parts total************ 3866.45
Labor************************ 5200.00
Grand total********** 9066.45
Soooo? for this much $$$ there is no head gasket / piston rings/ rod/mains/oil pump. $9000 and only a part of an engine that has been contaminated with metal shavings?
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Old 11-06-2012, 11:24 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by a930rocket View Post
Update: Got the estimate for over $9K including new manifold. Now I have to see what MBUSA will do if anything, find an indy that can do it if MBUSA won't help or install a used engine outside the affected range.

How hard is it to replace the manifold and why would it need replacing? Does it crack or is it a gasket/vacuum leak issue? It just started to hunt at idle.

Thoughts?

Complaint:Engine light on,Idles rough
and engine reving
Parts list:Intake manifold 1150.00 UNLIKELY YOU NEED THIS
Balance shaft* 550.00.
Timing chain** 395.00 UNLIKELY YOU NEED THIS
Spark plugs****** 210.00 UNLIKELY YOU NEED THESE
Intake gaskets20.50
Air filters************ 88.00 WHY ?
Times 2 oil & filter change 240.00
Cam plugs********* 40.00
Engine mounts375.00 THEY ARE NOT NECESSARY
Trans mount***** 95.00 NEITHER IS THIS
Poly belt*************** 110.00 IS IT WORN OUT? PROBABLY NOT!
Belt tensioner* **245.00 PROBABLY OK TO LEAVE THE OLD ONE, TOO
Idler pulley********* 95.00 WHAT'S WRONG WITH THIS ? PAINT MISSING?
Total*********************** 3613.50
Tax******************************* 252.95
Parts total************ 3866.45
Labor************************ 5200.00
Grand total********** 9066.45
THIS IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE OF HOW DEALERS OVERCHARGE AND BASICALLY ROB UNSUSPECTING AND TRUSTING INDIVIDUALS......EVERY SINGLE DAY!!!!( I GOT A STORY ABOUT A 2009 JETTA DIESEL THAT WILL BRING TEARS TO YOUR EYES)

DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT MBUSA ALLOWS TO BE BILLED TO THEM, PARTS/TIME, WHEN A BALANCING SHAFT IS SWAPPED UNDER WARRANTY.....IT ISN'T ALL THIS STUFF AND DEFINETLY NOT UPTO 52 HOURS LABOUR

YOU ARE SOOO GETTING SCREWED BY THESE GUYS !!!!
IF ANYONE ELSE HERE HAS USED THIS DEALER IN THE PAST YOU MAY WANT TO REVIEW YOUR BILL(S)

Last edited by Brian McL; 11-06-2012 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 11-06-2012, 12:14 PM
  #34  
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R350
Thanks guys.

The car has 120K miles. We had the extended warranty until 100K. It's our third and last MB.

Our local dealer is Baker Motor Co. and they suck, so we took it to Dyer and Dyer in Columbia. First time dealing with them.

They want THREE weeks to repair it!!'

Our indy and another shop here in charleston sc don't do the repair. Not sure of anyone else here or columbia who can do it. Next choice might be Atlanta, as we have family there.

I question some of the items as well (motor/trans mounts, belt, pulley, etc.). The belt and plugs were changed within 10-15K miles.

The manifold I could probably do myself, but I'm not sure what's wrong with old one. I don't see it related to the balance shaft, but the surge in idle at start up and while parked and idling.

We have a call into MBUSA now.

Last edited by a930rocket; 11-06-2012 at 12:20 PM.
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Old 11-06-2012, 12:37 PM
  #35  
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I can't help with an indy in that area....if you lived here I would do it for you. Start a new thread requesting an indy in the area that is convenient to were you live.
There MUST be someone who can recommend a shop.
I've had MB my whole life....8 vehicles, purchased new...and this 2008 C class will be the last 'cause when the shaft went in our car MBCanada / dealer couldn't care less.
I replaced it myself, with a friend, (no big deal really, just time) and have the car for sale.
But now potential MB buyers are getting smart, they want proof the car doesn't have the bad engine by serial number.. (and MB is NO help when you call with a VIN requesting engine info. Like "...what problem with the engine are you talking about"? I went throught the same BS denial with wiring harnesses in the mid-90's)
And if it does have a suspect engine the buyer wants proof the shaft has been replaced before they will buy or offer such a low price it's ridiculous.
It just sickens me to see the path MB has gone down with the customer service.
Issues arise, things break but they have turned their back on this and as far as I'm concerned they turned their back on me so screw them.
I tell everyone I know buy a Lexus...."buy a Lexus" (never thought I would say that) or BMW. That is the next car.
Good luck
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:27 AM
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R350
Brian,

I'm pretty mechanically inclined, as I've rebuilt cars, suspensions, V8 engines, my Porsche 911 Turbo engine, etc.

Does the engine need to be pulled out, or can I do it from the front? Seems like there is plenty of room to work on it, compared to others I've worked on.

Do you have a list of parts/part numbers you installed?

Thanks,
Jim

Originally Posted by Brian McL View Post
I can't help with an indy in that area....if you lived here I would do it for you. Start a new thread requesting an indy in the area that is convenient to were you live.
There MUST be someone who can recommend a shop.
I've had MB my whole life....8 vehicles, purchased new...and this 2008 C class will be the last 'cause when the shaft went in our car MBCanada / dealer couldn't care less.
I replaced it myself, with a friend, (no big deal really, just time) and have the car for sale.
But now potential MB buyers are getting smart, they want proof the car doesn't have the bad engine by serial number.. (and MB is NO help when you call with a VIN requesting engine info. Like "...what problem with the engine are you talking about"? I went throught the same BS denial with wiring harnesses in the mid-90's)
And if it does have a suspect engine the buyer wants proof the shaft has been replaced before they will buy or offer such a low price it's ridiculous.
It just sickens me to see the path MB has gone down with the customer service.
Issues arise, things break but they have turned their back on this and as far as I'm concerned they turned their back on me so screw them.
I tell everyone I know buy a Lexus...."buy a Lexus" (never thought I would say that) or BMW. That is the next car.
Good luck
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Old 11-07-2012, 01:37 PM
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Called MBUSA and the case manager says MBUSA will not help. She reported that I didn't get my car serviced at the dealer. When did that become a requirement? Asked for her manager and she refused.

Same run around deal when the air intake drain clogged and water damaged the blower motor. I fixed that in an hour and a $150 part.

Can MBUSA suck any more?

Last edited by a930rocket; 11-07-2012 at 01:40 PM.
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:57 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by a930rocket View Post
Do you have a list of parts/part numbers you installed?
DTB attachment covers repair & parts https://mbworld.org/forums/4525797-post6.html
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Old 11-08-2012, 07:17 PM
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Anyone have the serial numbers effected I have a 2007 E350 that maybe stricken
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Zsolt67 View Post
Anyone have the serial numbers effected I have a 2007 E350 that maybe stricken
https://mbworld.org/forums/4646893-post60.html
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by konigstiger View Post
Thank you sir
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Old 11-10-2012, 11:55 AM
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Found two shops that will do it. One for $3600 and the other for $4000.

Went to the dealer yesterday to bring it home and have an indie fix it. They brought the car around and it barely ran and then wouldn't start. Ran fine when we brought it in. Just a CEL on.

Left it there and a bunch of wrenches looking at it when we left.

Thanks again Mercedes Benz....
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Old 11-14-2012, 04:56 PM
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Balance shaft repair in SC

a930rocket-

If you can get the vehicle to Marion, SC then check with Ken Baker Originals there. I had to do this repair in May for my 2006 E350 and I saved by having my neighbor pull the engine for $1,000 and I drove the engine down to Ken Baker- they did the repair for $1,700 since the engine was already pulled. I have since put 10,000 miles on the car (Drove to Key West and back from the Carolinas) not a single problem or hicup. They seemed to know what they were doing and they mentioned completing the repair before on other vehicles so I would recommend them.
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by a930rocket View Post
Brian,

I'm pretty mechanically inclined, as I've rebuilt cars, suspensions, V8 engines, my Porsche 911 Turbo engine, etc.

Does the engine need to be pulled out, or can I do it from the front? Seems like there is plenty of room to work on it, compared to others I've worked on.

Do you have a list of parts/part numbers you installed?

Thanks,
Jim
You don't NEED to remove it but it makes the job easier. You can get away without taking the heads off.
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:39 PM
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Thanks stevenseb. I've got Carl Troy at European Road and Race here in Charleston lined up to do the work at a much mote reasonable price. I'd pull the engine/trans myself, but can't due to time constraints. I've also talked to Carl about the intake manifold. Obviously they don't wear out, but they have variable controls that wear out or break (the three rods and connecting plate) from what I've read. Multiple calls to the MB dealer produced no information on what is wrong with it, except it needs to be replaced.

My faith in honest dealers is long gone.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:12 AM
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I'm looking at a 2010 ML 350, VIN: 4JGBB5GB1AA623657, any help would be a blessing. Have a 2007 S550 with the gear issue now don't want to do it again.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:37 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by all4peace4all View Post
I'm looking at a 2010 ML 350, VIN: 4JGBB5GB1AA623657, any help would be a blessing. Have a 2007 S550 with the gear issue now don't want to do it again.
Not affected, you're fine.
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Old 09-04-2013, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by a930rocket View Post
Found two shops that will do it. One for $3600 and the other for $4000.

Went to the dealer yesterday to bring it home and have an indie fix it. They brought the car around and it barely ran and then wouldn't start. Ran fine when we brought it in. Just a CEL on.

Left it there and a bunch of wrenches looking at it when we left.

Thanks again Mercedes Benz....
Maybe something else in addition to the balance shaft, because the only consequence of the balance shaft issue is the teeth breaking off and the balance shaft not rotating to counter the pulses of the engine, causing the engine to vibrate some, but not run poorly or not start. I had a friend with the balance shaft issue and she couldn't afford to repair it for a couple of years so just drove with it. It vibrated some but not unbearably. When she finally could afford to repair we looked at the engine after it was pulled and all the teeth had fallen off and were in the pan. Still ran fine, though, and no problems starting.
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Old 10-05-2013, 06:20 PM
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Hello My Scottdale neighbor. I am looking at 2008 E350. IS this car on the list of Trouble??? WDBUF56xx8B358593

Thanks,
Bill
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:47 PM
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My E300

was written off by my insurance company.
I just test drove this 2008 E350. Loved the car, but the OD is reading 63k which is when this engine has issues.
I looked in the owners manual and it showed me were to find the Engine number but it was not on the firewall, unless it's behind the cover.

I want to avoid this balance shaft issue. I tried using the RU site and could not get the engine number, and MB was closed.

IF someone could help me that would be awesome.

Bill
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