As a newbie to the forum,
I am interested to see if other “E” class owners have had these experiences with the vehicle. I am to say the very least disappointed with the amount of failures when I consider the vehicle has had more problems than all the other Mercedes I have owned which have also covered at least 40,000 miles per annum.


Navigation failure, no disk errors, poor routing plans routing DVD lock up. Brilliant if you happen to be using it.

Keyless go opened windows and panoramic roof not doors, pain in the rain, or complete failure resulting in leaving vehicle returning later and using remote control.


Door mirrors one in one out, or refused point blank to fold out.

Key dependant memory option disabled, remote/keyless functions erratically, right hand approach keyless or remote doors open, mirrors static, left hand side keyless all static, remote the mirrors fold incredible.

Audio system Harmon Kardon switched off one side of vehicle speakers, currently
fades out, snap crackle and pops like an old vinyl record irritating 3 months awaiting Mercedes technical assistance, takes time to think up a plausible excuse

Distronic operational yet vehicle states that it has failed or it fails completely can be scary when it decides to shut itself down if you do not notice, the rear end of a lorry is not a pleasant place to find out its not going to stop the car.

Telephone audio quality to the person being called gets progressively worse, criticisms range from why are you talking from inside a tunnel to are you using a cheap hands free kit, its factory fitted, it was anything but cheap!

Command system lock up on playing DVD whilst stationary. Only after inserting an audio CD playing it, replace with DVD does it work.

Thermotronic heating system failed, faulty valve, I suspect inherent design fault as Mercedes technician knew the problem solution straight away.

More software patches than you could think possible including Brake recall patch
which I am lead to believe by the MB technician was to address counter number of Brake pedal pushes which switched off electronic fly by wire braking when a certain number was reached that could have been exciting.

Panoramic solar cooling not very goodl.

A Further substantial patch (product improvement) to be fitted on vehicle due for release in a few weeks in England 1-2 days depending on vehicle spec to carry out this work some patch! Scheduled in 2 weeks, 5 out of 11 E class items according to dealer, one item is telephone fix another is test the fuel injectors and replace if necessary.


Service Assyst system lost 3000 miles over 196 miles?



The vehicle has been back at the dealers to have service and a range of warrantee parts, "E" variation of service if the software is to be believed, vehicle returned £690.00 ($1,280 USD) service, I wait to see if the parts fitted are effective and in addition free of charge two dents in top edge of front wing MB repair scheduled, front tyres found to be demonstrating different wear rates suspension and alignment to be checked at next visit.



Assist system lost 800miles in 107 after service, currently 1,300 miles in 400 miles, to be revisited at next visit to MB.



Most of the time when the vehicle error log has been examined no faults found on log how obvious defective software is going to report a software error remains a mystery.



I can say that the engine/ gearbox has yet to manifest some sort of problem, except for the nice black cloud of smoke I sometimes leave other drivers in when I accelerate on the motorway.





E is for everything is the advertisement, “everything bad in a car, erratic, errant, and exasperating.



In all probability the last Mercedes I will ever own, if the first year is anything to go by it can only get worse, sad really as Mercedes was always my first choice because of reliability.

 

What can anyone say?? It is certainly a whole list of grief and I cannot blame you for feeling the way you do. My vehicle has not been perfect by any means, but compared to your unfortunate experience it is perfect.

Have you wrote a letter to Mercedes-Benz UK? A number of people have said it is a waste of time, but I do not accept that. I have always been treated fairly and with understanding. They need to at least make an attempt to compensate you for the dreadful experience you have tolerated this last year.

By compensation, it does not necessarily have to be monetary, they have great hospitality resources that I feel might be more appropriate.

The only matching problem that I have experienced is the 'folding' mirror.

In the ten months of ownership the drivers mirror has refused to unfold three times. We have the folding mirror option switched permanantly on, and the three occassions the drivers mirror has not come out, we just lock the car, unlock it and out it comes. (this obviously should not be necessary but it is not a big problem. Three times in ten months)

A problem you do not appear to be experiencing is the memory dependant key functions for the SEAT!!! If there are two drivers with 'noticeable' height differences, the memory settings are 'a problem' I note you mention you have a problem with the key dependant memory for the mirrors?

I do not have Distronic, Keyless Go, or Panoramic roof so cannot comment about those.

Thankfully I have NOT experienced any of your other terrible problems.

Good luck with any action you might take,
John

A cool windy morning in Torquay

 

I always hear that the early models like mine, had all the problems. Sept 03 is not early and its annoying to see the E still has the original elec problems.
As i understand there are a updates to the software more frequent than OTHER CARS. Its a very complex car.

I'm still trying to sort the remote central locking/alarm issues with the radio receiver not working. The car also tracks to left as i've mentioned before. It funny really no matter how many niggles i get with this car i still end up defending it. Its like your in love with this beautifull car and you turn a blind eye to the problems and just put up with them. Had this car been any other than a MBz it would have gone a long time ago.

 

Thanks for the replies Glojo, Adam3, what more can I say, it isn’t a question of money, I just need to be able to drive without the nagging doubt of what the H*ll will go wrong next.

When you become reliant on software to stop you at 75mph + doubt is something you do not need to have.

MB technical to examine the car next week, it says something when even the guys trying to fix the car at dealers think it a wrong un.

Mirror heads were replaced last week, however the fault with key dependency is now at the stage of Keyless, mirrors fold, remote they remain static... as for the seats being 6ft 4” the wife is shorter but she point blank refuses to drive the car and remains fixed to her SLK (r171) (a moment of weakness 11 months ago before all the problems really kicked off!) therefore key dependency memory hasn’t been used for the seat.

At least I no longer have external vanity mirrors anymore and can overtake without seeing the look of fear and horror on my own face..
As for the product improvement fixes due also next week, my understanding is no recall, fixes only applied if E class vehicle is returned to dealer for service or complaint, from what I was told it effects a lot of vehicles and after chassis number check 5 of 11 known items on my vehicle.

Adam3 point about loving the car well yes I can understand however it has now got to a stage of Divorce.

I await the finding of the MB HQ technician, ( they did have 10 but they are reduced currently to 6 technicians in the UK, of which 4 are long term personel, 2 are newish, managed to lose 6 long timers along the way sinking ship and all that!)

As for writing to MB HQ(branch office)UK to be honest I do not think much of them, when i last spoke to them Quote "We will not discuss return of the vehicle your contract is with the supplying dealer not with us talk to them" charming.
Liftman

 

I could never imagine that a highly reputed German automobile would have so many problems! You can see the description of the troubles I had to face here: http://www.auto-master.com.ua/eng/merc_e.html I supply all documents to prove my words.

 

This is annoying. When we had problems with our previous Mercedes-Benz the dealer actually advised that we write to Mercedes-Benz UK on the grounds that they took more notice of a complaining customer, than a complaining dealer!!!!!

MBUK immediately sent a bouquet of red roses to my wife and I received a bottle of my favourite tipple. They then took charge of the incident and dealt with it in a most satisfactory manner. (hence my coninued custom)

From reading your LIST of complaints you certainly do not appear to be treated in a fashion that any reasonable person would expect or accept.

Not only are Mercedes-Benz probably loosing one customer, they are running the risk of loosing a number of potential customers.

Please try to keep us updated on this sorry saga.

Good luck,
John

 

The latest update on this sad Saga and this piece of rubbish, finally on the 21st of December Mercedes UK technical department finally produced their technical report 1 month after inspecting the car.

However this was not before hiding behind the repairing dealers letter head and was not an MBUK official response. I can only assume some sort of legal trickery to protect themselves it is a pity they cannot stand up like men but hide away like dogs.



I can only describe the report as laughable they conclude:-



Distronic can fail if it gets dirty or wet so why fit it to the front of the car if it is so susceptible, you do not see this in the blurb anywhere that if it rains or gets dirty you possibly can not use it and you should not buy it if you think there is a chance you may wish to use it in the rain or in the winter when road dirt, salt etc could shut this system down!



I could possibly accept it fails to safe e.g. is inoperable in these conditions but when the vehicle states it is not available but I have given them photographic evidence showing it is working whilst unavailable therefore in my opinion dangerous, how do you know it is working or not?



The reopening of the windows on the keyless go system if you pull the door handle to open during close is a feature to prevent trapping, why the ventilated seat operates on the drivers seat to prevent a trap in remains unexplained.

I did however run a test where the windows were closed using the keyless go closure imagine my surprise when all the pressure sensors on the windows are overridden, if elderly or children got their fingers in the way of the window closure the forces applied I believe could break bones or worse, the system shuts down after 2 seconds and only by switching on the ignition to activate inside window switched or using infra red sensor in drivers door with the key to reopen windows is it possible to get free. It took some 20 minutes or more before the mark in my hand had gone after trying it out. (Will not repeat this in a hurry) I will ask the HSE to examine this as a potential danger to owners.



Memory seats and mirrors functioned correctly yet still fail to operate correctly for me, seat finds own position, thermotronic sets temp different to stored temp, easy entry fails to function, mirrors remain out or sometimes fold as per setting. I can only conclude design defects in interoperability of system. Design defects liability period, which used to be six years if I remember correctly under English law?



Overheating and failure of Harmon Kardon system, recommendation to fit Saudi cooling conversion to add cooling fans, this type of mod was undertaken previously on Mercedes S class for similar Known problem, what I fail to understand is how is a fan with limited air supply to cool a box, housed in a box (inner rear wing) housed within another box (car boot(trunk)) going to possibly work, maybe now at low air temps but what about the summer when the temp will (hopefully) be in the mid 20s?



Mobile phone system, despite the fact that I have spoken directly to the MB technician with the unit in a failed state which was progressively getting worse no action taken, one word pathetic.



Several weeks ago I took the car back to the dealers as it was shaking like a wet dog and a tremendous roar through the exhaust system whilst driving along, although no fault could be found car returned for the next few weeks this got progressively worse returned again to same dealer, the star diagnostics system which personally I feel was probably designed by a moron finally detected the problem (that is if it is to be believed) that all SBC speed sensors on all wheels have a CAN problem, ESM all wheels signals for the traction control are implausible, Distronic ESP, SPS and BAS signals are implausible, so since xmas eve the vehicle is back in the dealers and no word at present as to what, however as a note for all E320 CDI owners some of the things mentioned for this condition were

• Turbo charger on this model has issues with sticking variable vanes know by Mercedes, submarine check possibly to be initiated on service visits.
• Catalytic converters may have destroyed themselves several different dealers.
• ESP system failure.

As a final insult the supplying dealer has offered to buy back the vehicle and replace it with a new one, one small flaw the vehicle is worth in their opinion 21,800 GBP 40,000 USD, the vehicle when new 15 month prior cost 48,000GBP (52,000 with options list price) 95,000 USD some depreciation.



I can only reiterate that I will never ever buy a Mercedes again I would advise anybody that to think very carefully as you may find like me no car and it is going to cost some 26,000 GBP 50,000 USD for 15 month of ownership for this rubbish.

 

Latest Update,

Vehicle remains at dealers due to Xmas holidays vehicle has been off road for 3 weeks so far on this occasion, dealer believes they have cured the car shaking symptoms and the various errors with the wheel sensors / ESP finally traced to torque converter failure, torque converter replaced.


It appears that with the torque converter failing the electronics thought the vehicle had lost traction at wheels and the vibration and shaking of the vehicle was due to the incorrect interpretation by the software subsequently altering engine output.


Technician checked catalytic converters no visual problems found, I guess this means they haven’t fallen apart, whether they function correctly only an emissions report will confirm if they have sustained any functional damage.


The erratic functionality of seat memory, door mirrors folding or not as the mood takes the car, easy entry-exit, thermotronic temp setting, lethargic or non operation of muti contour seat (found by on road tests by technician) traced to memory module in drivers seat (master) from conversation the fault potential with this unit known although undocumented currently on the 5th or 6th generation of module.


Awaiting additional parts for other problems, further update when or indeed if vehicle is returned.

 

Although this is obviously a very annoying experience, and you have not been treated well, at least it sounds as though they MAY be on the track of what is actually wrong.

If they successfully replace the torque converter and the memory module then that could fix most of your problems. It must seem like a lot of faults, but in fact it maybe all down to two parts that need replacing.

Good luck and I hope your car is returned running perfectly.

 

Sheesh! That's a monstrous list. Sorry about the misfortunes with your car.

 

Hi liftman,
I am so pleased to hear that finally.... finally progress is being made with your vehicle.

How sad that it has taken them so long to remedy these faults.

The paragraph that I have kept from your post is one that 'stands out' as it highlights problems that have been happening to our vehicle. A driver is hopefully coming this morning to collect our vehicle and take it away for various 'upgrades' to be installed.

I am going to ask that both front seats be checked as the passenger one very rarely carries out the 'massage' procedure. Do you know if there is just one 'memory module' for both the seats, or do they have seperate ones?

Thanks again, and good luck,
John

 

Thanks to all for feedback Glojo to answer memory seat question,

The technician said that the drivers seat memory module mas the main unit and that the passenger was a slave to this, however from what he was saying that the unit in the drivers seat had a hell of a lot of connection in his words.

He also said that there are a lot of versions depending on the spec of the vehicle.

Finally on the Harmon Kardon system he is not confident on the fix, in the area where the heat problem is, also is situated the boot close system, navigation system, pump for multi contour seats etc, he reckoned to get in fix fan and replace it took over 3 hours, do not think i would want to spend 3 hrs in the boot (trunk)

Hope this mail helps, will collect car 8 am tomorrow returning the ML loaner, if it is fixed great if not back to square one.

Finally after all the grief sent an e-mail to Daimler Chrysler may not achieve anything, however I care about where and what I spend my money on, cost was not an issue, product Quality and after sales support is however.

.

 

Hi liftman,
Still no signs of my car. It looks like it has a similar problem to yours in relation to the memory module. I phoned the dealer at lunchtime and they were still working on the vehicle trying to resolve the problem??

I have said it before (several times) and I will say it again.

I think that Mercedes-Benz have not carried out sufficient development on the 211 and we, the paying public are doing it for them.

If your problem and mine were broken, or defective parts, then it is a simple case of taking out the defective piece and inserting the new item.

This is not the case though, technicians are not sure on what is causing the problem and are trying different alternatives to get the car working.

How many threads are there where members are complaining about seats loosing their memory settings?

Moan over, cause I still like the 211 and the faults are just a nuisance.

Good luck with your car,
John

 

Just had the dealer on the telephone.

They have fitted the latest main memory module which hopefully will resolve the 'forgetful' memory settings on the seats.

Installed a new modified kit for the folding mirrors.

AND....... Replaced a kinked pnuematic pipe that was causing problems with the central locking!!!

Joke, just joking there was a kinked air pipe, that was indeed replaced, but it was for the dynamic seats.

It has also had four TSB type 'recalls' which took a number of hours and finally they have reset the computer 'thingie' (by now he was talking faster than I could write)

Hopefully everything should now be sorted, but...... Watch this space.

Good luck again liftman.

John
A sunny cool afternoon in Torquay

 

Now for the bad news, back in the ML loaner, got to the dealer yesterday morning, decided I would road test car before taking it away drove about 15 miles... performance ok, keyless and key entry / close seemed to work, found steering a bit heavy put this down to driving position ML vs E. about to say i will run it and see, when i tried keyless go start, seat shot forward pinning me between seat and steering wheel set position back, used key memory position ok, keyless shot forward again, easy entry exit then shut down, gave technician keys, told him i do not nor will I accept this, waited about 45 mins while star diagnostic run, no faults found now thats a surprise.

The Outcome they do not know what’s wrong will have to check with MB technical.



When I next try to collect the dam thing I will check everything!!!!



I did learn new E class suffers the same suspension problems with ball joints as the old model 60,000 miler in for this fault Avantgarde (sport) with normal suspension, I hope my air suspension is less wearing on the suspension.



Regards



Liftman

 

Hi liftman,
This must surely be coming embarrassing, have you actually spoke to the Managing Director of the dealership?

Regards,
John

 

The Distronic will never stop the car. It will disengage below 30 km/h. And it will also give you maximum 20-30% of the brakes potential

Where else should they fit it, if not in the front of the car?

 

Thank to all for your observations, Oslo sorry probably I should have qualified the statement, in “stop the car”, it would have been better to say it “is not going to keep the vehicle at the safe distance as set within the car although still within the normal Distronic operational range.
As you know if the closure rate between you and the vehicle in front is greater than accepted parameters the alarm sounds and Distronic deactivates deferring to driver and manual braking control.

My concern in my vehicle has displayed on several occasions “the Distronic is not available” warning on the central speedometer display yet has continued to track the vehicle in front, the warning message had no alarm signal, was not fixed until cruise control deactivated and could be replaced by any one of the numerous items you can display during normal operation of the vehicle whilst still tracking the vehicle in front and displaying the tracking speed bar on the speedometer, so I do not know if it will stay at the set distance, will it attempt to slow the vehicle or alarm if closure rate is too great for Distronic to handle, also it is possible that it works, I wasn’t going to attempt to find out, and remains unused since.

On the position question I was I am sorry to say being sarcastic.

Glojo in answer to your question yes in writing I wait to see, however I have to be fair to the technician who does try very hard to sort thing out with limited backup, the potential good news is it is understood what the problem is, the new module has two memories, one for keyless go and a different one if the key is used.

Quote from dealer e-mail:-

We have found that there are 2 separate memories. To make both keyless go and standard ignition match seat and heater settings etc... , firstly you must set your desired position and heat settings in the keyless go way, press m, 1. After this insert key into ignition without moving anything and turn till dash lights are on again you must now press m and 1. This should make settings for both ways exactly the same.


Old module worked the same for key and keyless, I wonder what will happen on the passenger side if I use the key or keyless? Probably open the panoramic roof (sarcasm).
Operative word is should in the above quote nothing like confidence to assure you all is well.

I will try again this weekend to collect the vehicle; I will miss the ML as it is great for waking up the middle lane huggers as you pass them in the fast lane of the motorway.



Liftman

 

Latest update....



1. Distronic no longer exists on vehicle, all settings gone!

2. Harmon Kardon system all upgrades gateway fan software etc. failure!

3. Command destroyed cd, new one working on journey, started to cycle intro of tracks randomly cd no longer functions in anything, car, house etc.

4. Drivers memory seat failed and easy entry/ exit all setting erased themselves, on key and keyless go new memory fitted.

5. If you open passenger door, switch on ignition keyless (to use cigarette lighter for instance) switch off, remote control vehicle closure blocked to close door keyless close functions only remote is useless.

6. Power close on boot (trunk) no longer functions it reopens at half way point.

7. Mobile phone started to block SMS, phone has to be removed and replaced, complaint from dealer over the audio quality whilst discussing how I would like to give Mercedes an E class enema.

8. Parameter steering sluggish in morning, feels like power steering gone then returns after a delay.



I am so p*ss*d that I do not look for problems anymore they find me, will probably go Legal, and forward all correspondence to every car magazine I can, doubt the latter will achieve anything but it will make me feel better- forewarned is forearmed.



Due back on the 7th February for another week 2 days in body shop, supposed to use vehicle to attend meetings in France the week after somehow I do not think so.



Note the new ML loaner I had whilst the vehicle was off road, the phone system died and the driver’s seat went bang and I do mean bang, quality!


I have sent all correspondence to the most senior level of Mercedes, from HQ Germany, UK, repairing and supplying dealership UK, however so far no real solution. I do not think they give a damm.

As a point of interest the word is out on Mercedes the SMMT figures show that Mercedes have a smaller market share now than Honda, Mercedes sold 11,662 less vehicles in 2004 to 2003.

Liftman

 

jeez that is a hell of a lot of problems you got there.

my friend who is driving a 5 has had strange problems too, like idrive freezing, randomly opening and closing sunroof, and a rather strange incident where wind from outside actually started blowing in from under the footwell! needless to say, he was not amused at all either.

do keep us updated on the condition of your vehicle. mine is a (relatively) simple, manual-unheated-seat, non-air-suspension Avantgarde, and it has given no problems so far after 24 months. you mentioned something about Avantgardes having a suspension ball-bearing failure: if you're free could you elaborate a bit about that? i understand it doesn't really have anything to do with this thread but am just concerned.

 

When in the dealers the technician explained that the 60,000 miler in the shop, was in for joints problem same problem as the W210 had, i spoke to someone else they had also replaced ball joints on a W211 both Avantgarde (sport) models which has the harder suspension, never driven a non air E class so cannot say, I suppose it depends upon type of roads you drive on, sometimes here in the sticks when you sound the horn you get an echo the pot holes are that deep.

Liftman

 

Latest news...

A technical resolution manager has been appointed (all too late) to inspect the car, from what I understand they have the power to do everything to resolve the problems

I wont hold my breath and will continue down other paths to get this solved.

Liftman

 

Just a quick update:-

Vehicle went in on the 7th Feb, unfortunately whilst checking parameter steering for loss of power steering they found that the bottom ball joints had failed, not just one side but both sides, the technician thought it was incredible especially when you consider that I had the full geometry check undertaken at the end of November and no wear was present. The car had only been on the road for 6-7 weeks since the check, the rest off road in the garage. Solenoid valve assembly to be replaced, as a known potential problem of creating an intermittent power steering (probably another MB submarine fix).



Boot closure system failure traced to sound insulation becoming unglued, (like the car really) giving the system the impression of a blocked closure therefore boot reopened.



The saga of the disappearance of Distronic has by the technician been diagnosed as an attribute within the vehicle software being set as on to denote Distronic fitted, which has removed Distronic from being displayed on instrumentation and removing all warning alarms, they have switched this several times to prove software reversed.



The best bit of news I received was could they have the secondary entry key as the keyless go system had completely failed, they were unable to determine if it was key or system related, second key delivered no improvement system failure. Why I am happy with this news? finally the car has gone schizophrenic in the dealers care, demonstrating this and other random failures whilst in their possession.



I had got to the stage where I did not know if it was best to call a mechanic or a priest.



I will in all probability get the car back this week, as for the other problems these remain under investigation.



Liftman

 

Best of luck, liftman. Crazy mechanical errors really do cause headaches.

 

Email extract of content to MB after collecting vehicle on Thursday 17th Feb, 10 days after leaving vehicle with them.

Collected the above vehicle this morning, what can I say:-


1.Boot closing failure, possibly adjustment issue related to dismantling for audio gateway fan modification. Resolved

2.Mobile phone system command lock up on SMS. Not resolved

3.Memory seats system fails to retain settings, finds own settings, position and dynamic seat previous fix failure. Not resolved

4.DVD navigation disk not found disk inserted in boot DVD drive goes missing whilst travelling on motorway. Possibly resolved

5.Audio gateway fan modification failure, known issue, 2005 gateway redesigned? Not resolved

6.Distronic missing no display of system on vehicle, no changes made to vehicle software system at last visit. Resolved

7.Anti collision system no display of system active (speaker icon) on instrumentation, switch denoting system active illuminates. Due to item 6 resolved

8.Access to vehicle from passenger side keyless ignition on then off, command fails to shutdown remote control blocked only keyless close active. Not resolved (Dealer suggests a common fault on all keyless go W211?)

9.Mobile phone speech quality erratic. Not resolved

10. Easy entry / exit steering position erratic Not resolved

11.Parameter steering sluggish/poor Mercedes known issue. Left dealer first hard right slowing to corner right, steering heavy, comes back 2-3 seconds to light operation, this could be attributed to the use of a “C” class for the preceding 9 Days, however after 50,000 mile I know it does not function as it was or how it should be.

12.Explanation over the reopening of window using keyless system remains very dubious, why the ventilated seats become active still remains unexplained. Open

13.Assyst system inaccuracy Open

14.Distronic on whilst reporting failure Open





On the failure of the suspension I am intrigued as to reason for both sides failed, having had a full Mercedes steering geometry check at the end of November at a reduced although my cost (Mercedes technical refused authorisation) also given the vehicle has not been available for 4 weeks during this period for torque convertor replacement etc. If you recall geometry check due to irregular tyre wear pattern.


Further comments on my dissatisfaction followed given the time and effort by repairing dealer and myself and we are just getting no where, repairing dealer has now basically said they can continue but they feel that it may get resolved if the supplying dealer has the vehiclee, sad!


Additional items dealer noted as repaired but not reported by me, gearbox oil seal leak, diesel fuel line leak.


We shall see what occurs during the next week with MB, taking the vehicle over the channel travelling in Europe, hope the French dealers speak English. Hopefully I won’t find out.

Liftman