ESIX3POWER

https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...ml#post4158103

220S

Sorry to hear it. I posted on the other thread. I hope you can settle it without a big hit.

fwiw, I did the same thing buying a new 2009 E350. I thought I'd get out of performance cars and behave myself for a while. The E350 was the most boring thing I have ever driven. The whole thing was so numb feeling. Big, big mistake. I just wasn't being true to myself.

I knew I wouldn't ever be happy, so I just had to dump it. I did sell it to a relative with a payment program for them and so I didn't take a huge loss. Plus I didn't like the W212 E63s and got a new W211 E63 with a really big discount instead. That all helped monetarily.

I still feel the same way about the W212s as I did earlier. Maybe in a few years when they make more changes, I'll consider a W212 E63. But I still don't like them.

You gotta do what really makes you happy inside. And sometimes that can cost more than you thought. But there's no reason to stay miserable. Good luck.

ESIX3POWER

I agree with you 220S and who knows, had i not driven the AMG version of the W211 for nearly 2 years I probably would not feel this way but the last month it's been eating away at me! I truly just can't get used to the interior at all!! I hate the feel of just about every thing inside.. It's not soothing or comforting..crazy part is that the exterior of the 212 is not the problem at all, I prefer it over the W211.. But as 220S mentioned, you spend most of your time inside the car and that's most important. Maybe my mind will change again but at this moment I don't feel like I want to continue with the W212..

ESIX3POWER

Also thought I should mention that I would ONLY trade for a W211 AMG E63 ,no other W211 model.. I don't know if this is just a phase and I'll get over it but right now I feel I need the 211 AMG to be happy again.. It's crazy because the first 5 months I could not be happier with the car but now that the honey moon is over and I have had time to really think and compare the little things that made you happy, I realise which I was happier with..

K-A

I responded in that Thread as well.

....But DAMN man?! What the hell, lol. We've just practically switched places on our views of the car, although I still acknowledge the lacking interior materials in some areas. You're right, the plastics aren't soothing or comforting at all. All in all it's a 50/50 thing, some of the interior is great and very coddling (I'd say this focuses on build quality and fit/finish) and some of it is lacking to the W211 (I'd say this focuses more on soothing/soft materials).

Hopefully I don't "wake up" from the honeymoon and REALLY come up in bad shape, considering my initial views. Fortunately, the exterior wouldn't be the problem anymore I don't think for me.

BTW, forgot to ask, what "panel gaps" do you mean? That's one area of this car I've found to be very much better than the W211, aside from the damn clamshell hood shutline.

220S

I hear what you're saying. And yeah, I can't see the outside of the car when I'm inside

The W211 arm rests are comfy and padded, the pleated Nappa leather door panels are squishy and soft. The seats are soft smooth leather but firm enough for the proper support with good side bolsters (only complaint is I wish they had real thigh extensions like BMW; but the W212 doesn't have them either.) Things inside are subtle and pleasing, no shiny chrome paint, no hard right angles, or hard plastics (like that fugly overhead light cover) etc..

When I drove a W212 E63 (several different times) I immediately noticed the hard door panels, the rock hard arm rest, the plastic, etc.. Plus it all seemed cheesy inside to me. I know exactly what you mean.

My biggest fear of thinking the grass will be greener in a different car is what happens if it's not? I don't want to take that risk right now.

I hope you get it worked out and find yourself back into an E63 soon.

And I hope MB gets the message and returns some of those nicer W211 elements to the W212 E63s someday.....

K-A

Other things I've noticed since being an owner of both.

In the footwell, the 211 had all carpeting, the 212 all plastic. Maybe "insignificant" since most wouldn't notice this, but these are what make a Premium car/Brand just that. Also, the bottom of the B-Pillar of the 211 is a thin nice carpet, the 212 plastic, albeit a "good" plastic. Perhaps M-B had a reason to go plastic? I did one time reach for the seat-belt, and I had a "bracelet" of sorts on my wrist, which is famous for catching onto my shirts and finely tearing them (it has some sharp-ish edges), it dragged against the B-Pillar and I freaked since I thought like the 211, it would tear the material.... Then I thankfully realized it was plastic. That was one time I liked the plastic.... Every other time, I wish it still had the carpeting.

Also, notice on the seatbelt "hanger", it's VERY sharply and squarely cut, I don't know why, but it seemed a bit cheap to me. Then one day, with the sun coming through the passenger windows, I noticed IT ISN'T CUT EXACTLY RIGHT, i.e the little plastic "plate" inside the hanger portion is an extremely small cut too small to fit perfectly inside the hanger, and I noticed a tiny little "gap" where the light was peaking through. Not sure if this makes sense, but I don't know how else to explain it.

And the finale! Everybody with a W212, look inside your trunk, and turn your head up to face the under part of the deck above you....




That's the thing, they did a lot of improvements with this car, but money was certainly an object, as they cut corners in the LITTLE areas nobody with any detail oriented awareness would notice, which were areas the W211 excelled at.

I hate to say it, but M-B has given into the "Lease" culture, people who just want the name, the dynamic looks, the popping smoke effect inside and out, amongst other more rational and positive things, and who throw the car back to the Dealer afterward. In that sense, they seem to figure "why fine tune all the little areas these people won't notice anyways, and those same areas which will be easily damaged and worn when bought second hand", etc.

madraddoc

I'm a first time E class owner (traded a 2004 SL500) but I feel your pain.

The trunk finish is, IMHO, just downright unacceptable for a luxury vehicle. It seems as though the E350 has even less material surrounding the trunk struts compared with my E550 but again, MB should NEVER have left these vehicles out of the factory with that appearance.

K-A

Agreed, it's so unacceptable it's not even funny. It's like, this is "Mercedes-Benz" for f's sake, how dare they? Would Rolls Royce cut corners? Believe it or not, M-B has built such a cachet that people do put both in the same sentence very regularly.

SolidGranite

This is all very disappointing... Remember, MB did lower the price of the E Class by $5000. I'm sure they had to find somewhere to do it without most people noticing..

220S

That's bizarre. It's like you're missing a whole section of your trunk liner. It's not so much the underneath of the rear deck, but the springs and hinges are now completely in the open.

Those hinges and springs are all covered smooth with a trunk liner section in my car. Nothing protrudes into the trunk, I can load it without worrying. I guess now you're going to have to be sure that nothing gets caught in them if you stuff the trunk full with stuff.....

btw, are you sure it's supposed top be like that? Maybe they forgot the rest of the liner at the factory

K-A

Yeah, it's ridiculous. Yeah, they're all like that. That isn't even my car, and I checked my car, and it's the same way.

I wonder if they'll include it any time during the W212's Production run?

Can you imagine, an E-Class with that kind of trunk lining? I'm sure even a Ford Mustang has a covered deck.

petee1997

The picture shows the trunk of a car with a fold down rear seat I believe. Secondly there are a lot of functions under there. The mechanism for the electronic trunk, release for rear sear, multiple speakers and probably a lot of other stuff only 220S knows about.
Something else,excluding the E63, the E class is not a luxury car. It is one step above a Buick Lacrosse. For the money, the E class is great value.
K-A comparing the car with a Rolls is ridiculous. If you want more luxury spring an extra 7 or 8 thousand for designo interior and paint instead of the standard taxi pack MB Tex.
Get over it guys. These are fifty to sixty thousand dollar cars that are mass produced in the thousands. If you want something special BMW will build you a Rolls Royce for around $500,000.00.

K-A

I'm using Rolls as just an example. The E-Class is still considered a Luxury/Premium car, especially since the C-Classes took entry level role.

I'm also pretty sure that all W212's have the bare trunk upper deck.

Also, again, for what this car is, you shouldn't have to spring up to Designo to get a tolerable refinement inside, and I'm basing this off of the previous E's that have been out. It's upsetting to see M-B cutting down the level of the car in aspects, to lower our regard for it. In the W124's time, it would never suffer these cheap-shots in terms of cost cutting, and was indeed considered amongst the top of the Luxury tops, that didn't cost $100K to boot.

Anyway, that's my negative side speaking. I love my car, and couldn't really enjoy it more. Enough so that the interior stuff doesn't bother me much, at least not yet, but I do have to turn my head on some things here and there, and I do realize what isn't up to par, especially being an owner of the previous E.

K-A

Petee. Being especially that you know our little "detail oriented" gripes we've stated, please remember to post a little Review stating whatever changes or non changes may have occurred on the 2011's! I'm not expecting many big things, however what I'm curious (and fearful due to possible jealousy if this becomes the case) of, is whether any of the small areas get changed, a material here, a knob there, or a trunk lining anywhere.

bigben320e

What? No, that is not correct. The E especially the 550's and on up are considered and classified as luxury cars.

One step above the Buick LaCrosse? Many would beg to differ, even Buick owners. There are a lot of options and details in MB's that are steps above anything Buick has out.

If this is the case with current said E class that is scary. If MB has sunk that low...uggh.

I totally agree, MB has been dropping refinement in areas but don't seem to be dropping what they want for the cars.

K-A

Yeah, the Lacross thing makes no sense. In that case, then an S-Class is simply "two steps above a Lacross". Fact is, and E-Class is more Premium than a Lacross in every which way, which is all that matters.

And again, if the "E" legacy starts dipping down into being comparable to Lacrosses and such, then it would be the W212's fault, as historically this has never been the case.

The E-Class is technically classified as a "Large Luxury Car", for whatever it's worth.

Anyway, again, pro's outweigh the cons here for me by a longshot, but no doubt some cost saving measures have been taken, and they've been taken out of the "attention to detail refinement" areas. Sure M-B has sunk money in the areas we all notice, which is great, but anyone with an eye for detail, will find areas where it lets down, compared to the W211.

I knew the W204 C-Class would be like a cancer to the M-B line, as the interior of it is putrid in terms of refinement and luxury, that's why I've complained so much about it. I was afraid that if not enough people complained, M-B would use that approach to the rest of the line. Let's see how the next S-Class turns out.

petee1997

Well it looks like I got everbody's attention with my comments. Keep in mind I never complained about the E class and will soon have two W212. I was simply responding to those of you that find the W212 somewhat lacking. I'm satisfied with my car for what I spent. My postings from the past year will certainly confirm this. I'm also a realist. The E class is just a step above a Buick Lacrosse. Don't confuse car segments with snob appeal.




PS The C class is not entry level. In Canada we habe the B class and Europe has an A class as entry level cars.

220S

I agree. It's a mid-level car with a logo attached to it that has mythological implications.

And the E Class is the most ubiquitous car on the road. Seriously, if you want to get lost in the crowd, get a Mercedes E Class (which actually is part of the attraction for me personally.) Most Mercedes Benz cars have a pretense to them that just doesn't quite equate in the real world of automobile exclusivity. Hey, that's what marketing can do to the human brain

If you are concerned about driving something special you really need to up the ante. Don't fool yourself (or anybody else) with an E Class.

Back OT: for the record, there have been numerous threads on the BMW forums (I also have a 330i) about visible cost cutting with the 3ers over the years. There are a lot of interior niceties that are in my E46 which are now missing in the E90s.

Anyway, here are the pics of my trunk. I think the main thing happening is the reduction of liner material in the W212 (and yes, I have split folding rear seats as you can see in the pic.) Under the rear deck, you can see the guts to the deck which gives you access to speakers, etc.. But the W211 did have more lining to cover up the loose ends, and particularly the hinges and springs (which is what prompted me to joke that maybe they forgot to install some lining on K-A's car.)

Petee: In another thread (about MBTex vs leather) I think you mentioned something about there being no perforated leather in MBs. fwiw, the full Nappa leather seats in the W211 AMGs have perforated leather. Maybe I misunderstood your post, but here's a pic.

Wig

220S - I am sure this is correct in southern California, so your point is valid for your area.

Your point does not apply to many other areas. In Southern Ontario, for example, the E Class is not ubiquitous and you certainly don't get lost in a crowd up here. Mercedes Benz is undoubtedly regarded as a luxury marque in this area. Ferraris and Rolls Royces are not common even on the streets of Toronto.

I guess it all depends on the relative wealth of where you live.

petee1997

I don't have the car yet. I expect to see it in the 1st ten days of Aug. You know I will try to make you sick with the miriad of improvements and upgrades over the 2010 intro model.
I'm also lucky because my wife decided not wait for for the 2011 and has been driving the 2010 since April. This new baby is mine and I can't wait to play mind games with all you 2010 owners. Maybe the trunk finish will be upgraded, e-mail capabality,new command graphics with 3D,and many more features real or imaginary.
Seriously, I haven't a clue if there are any changes but if there are, they will be minor. Usually they make corrections of things that we don't see. These cars, with their long cycles, are a work in progress throughout their life span. Each model year is slightly better than the last but usually the improvements are miniscule and not noticeable.

Dema

It isn't huge mistake, dispose the current car and get other make. Not big deal at all. Huge mistake was if you chosen wrong wife.

Wig

Agreed. And there are improvements during the production run during the model year, the changes to the W212 doors in March 2010 being an example.

petee1997

Petee: In another thread (about MBTex vs leather) I think you mentioned something about there being no perforated leather in MBs. fwiw, the full Nappa leather seats in the W211 AMGs have perforated leather. Maybe I misunderstood your post, but here's a pic.



I think I was refering to the standard leather option was not perforated. The E coupe has the perforated nappa leather seats also. But then again most of the time I don't have clue what I' m talking about.










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K-A

Yeah, that's what I'm curious about. The little things that we might not see. Or certain things you can only notice when having some seat time behind both.

Either way my car is a Lease, so I can always opt out if I'm not satisfied enough after a few years, I guess that's the "Luxury" we pay for, when Leasing. I've enjoyed owning the car enough during even these past almost couple of months to be happy enough that I made what isn't the wisest decision.... Go for a very late 2010 model, just months before the 2011's arrive. As well, I might not want to get another car during its first MY Brand New again, so if that is the case, I can chalk it up to a cool experience.

BTW, the E not being "Premium" enough doesn't excuse it for downgrading materials. And fact is, it is technically considered a Luxury Car, and the common folk of the world (or at least the U.S) very much view it as such. I don't hang around with ultra wealthy status snobs, so I can say that both my E's draw the "ooh" factor from many people. Of course it's a common Luxury car around here, so it's not like a UFO sighting, however I'm not saying it's a "rare" or specialty car, but it is a Luxury car, just a popular one, priced high enough to keep it in a Premium segment, but low enough to be accessible enough, i.e: a Mid-Level Luxury Car, where's the S-Class takes it up to Premium level Luxury Car.

Again, Mercedes Benz has a high cache, and certainly the S-Class isn't the only Luxury Sedan they make. I'm not expecting a Leather stitched dash, or Alcantara headliner at this price range, but I am expecting a new model to out-do the old ones in every regard, even the little details.